Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Guest basil44

cold start

Recommended Posts

Guest   
Guest

We have a perkins 4108 engine that always takes ages to start when cold or not used for a while, would it be worth looking at the glow plug and replacing if needed.Is it a simple job to change.

many thanks

basil

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest   
Guest
We have a perkins 4108 engine that always takes ages to start when cold or not used for a while, would it be worth looking at the glow plug and replacing if needed.Is it a simple job to change.

many thanks

basil

Hi Basil

sorry no one has bothered answering until now!

Yes it could well be the heater plug not working, you can if i remember correctly hear the bonfire type plug working while pre heating, you of course need to have the engine covers off and have someone else operate the pre heat switch or button. it sounds like sizzling. i assume you know the plug is located in the inlet manifold, having a fuel pipe and one electrical connector. alternatively you can take it out and apply a 12v current to it and see if it glows (dont hold it in your hand or put it on or near anything inflammable as it get pretty hot!) hold it with a pair of pliers. A new replacement cost about £16 and ASAP stock them.

I do have a manual for this engine in pdf format if you need it, pm me and i will email if required.

cheersbar

JohnT

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Basil.

Firstly the manual, I have posted a URL on this very section of the forum In the manual bit. I think this is the complete one.

I appear to have the very same problem with Woodland Dawn, she normally starts very easily but when I was up in November and it was icy nothing would induce that Perky to start, in desparation I legged it into Stalham and bought some easy start. Starting was instant with just a sniff.

I have not investigated the problem yet I was going over on Friday, but due to the weather being none to exciting and reports from another owner saying the boat looks fine I may leave it for three weeks and go up for a few days and get it ready for the season.

I have only looked briefly at it but ours has a heater in the manifold with a diesel connection. Trying to sus it out from the book was not easy there appears to be a solonoid and a heater coil so I suspect applying the preheat does two things, cooks the diesel and opens up to let it in when the heater is operated.

Anyone know?

I am hoping it is something silly like the power not getting to it cos a wire has fallen off under the dash.

I will let you know how it works when I have been and had a play maybe someone will answer the question in the meantime

Anyway as I said url for manual is in the manual section of this part of the site

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest   
Guest

Well, we were at the boat last weekend, started her up Fri afternoon, took 3-4 attempts, not bad considering the engine has been left since I winterised it back in Oct. Sat morning took a bit longer, probably due to the damp & very cold, headed off from Acle to Horning for lunch after which engine fired up 1st attempt. Same on Sun morning, took a few goes, so I think it really is down to the cold & or damp.

Gordon - I think I'll get some of your 'easy start' before I think about replacing the glow plug, as I've not heard of it can you tell me the proper name & where to get it from?

cheers

Barry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Barry,

I think the proper name is actually easy start. You can get it from car accessory places, its in a yellow and red aerosol can

I think I have seen it in Halfords. I bought a tin in the car place in Stalham, just down the little lane beside the shoe shop. No way would ours start, I nearly flattened the battery, just a mere hint of a sniff on the inlet manifold and she fired up instantly. Still not made my mind up whether to go to the boat tomorrow or not, its a 2.5 hr run from Linconshire. I shall definitely be going in three weeks time for a few days,

Gordon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would be very carefull with using Easy Start as believe it or not an engine can become addicted to it!! - seriously.

If the glow plug / burner is working properly you should be able to see a cloud of smoke coming from under the domed cover after a few seconds, as John says you should be able to hear something happening as well. The other thing to check is whether there is any voltage drop on the power supply to the plug, if you do not have a relay in the circuit this could be a problem. Some boats took the supply straight from the ignition switch which is not a good idea.

If this is working and even after 30 seconds on pre-heat it will not start then it may well be worth looking at the fuel filters to check they are ok.

Neil

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Neil,

A bit controversial, but I’ve never subscribed to the “addiction†theory, my rationale is as follows: The only reason that an engine will not start, exceptionally low temperature, bad fuel or a long lack of use apart is that there is a fault and that could be anything from, electrics, poor spray pattern, glow pin(s) to loss of compression. People tend to use either to start and it is a quick fix, "hooray that was easy", then continue to use it without repair, and as the fault remains, the engine still needs the either and appears "addicted". If the fault(s) was/were investigated, diagnosed and rectified there would be no further need of either. If the fault is repaired then the “addiction†is cured.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest   
Guest

A lot of the perkins engines used to crack the heads - usually between valve seats, a lot of people reckoned using easy start caused it.

One thing is sure as Brian says if you need to continually use easy start you have a problem you are not dealing with. and you know what happens to people with the heads in the sand!!!

JohnT

cheersbar

:Stinky

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest   
Guest

Thanks for all the advice, will not be going down the easy start route. Fuel filter was changed last year, diesel has been topped right up & fuel additive added so guess it will be head in the engine bay next time we go to the boat to check the glow plug.

Barry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Barry,

I have heard warnings re easy start, I have now fixed mine 2 easy tests with a multimeter proved the thermostart/preheater to be faulty

1, Yes power was getting to it when the preheat was switched on

2, The resistance of the unit was infinite, should be virtually short circuit,

and a quick flick of the lift pump showed diesel was getting to it, (with pipe off)

Quick ride to see that nice Sonny Boulter and he sold me a new one. He has them in stock.

Let me know if you have any further questions

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Barry

If you want any clarification with the diagnosis let me know. I certainly did not mean to suggest that easy start is a long term cure, I just used it to confirm that the thermostart was indeed in trouble and to get me out of a short term fix.

Equally I cannot see that an engine can get addicted to it and agree with the thoughts that it carrys on needing it only if the root cause is not fixed. I am happy to bow to superior knowledge if someone can come up with a plausible theory why a basic thing like an old deisil engine can develop such a craving

Temperature of -6 yesterday morning totally proved that the new part was doing the business She started without too much fuss.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:wave hi there yes i agree on the easy start addiction only as a last resort thing for me

the perkins glow plug pulls a lot of current so thats why there will be a relay in the electrical system it works by heating the spillback to tank weep to the glowplug igniting to give a flame to heat the air in the inlet manifold so be carefull if you have been pressing the prheat switch as if the glowplug is working ok it will be VERY HOT

the switch contacts burn out, also can be a faulty ign sw

fuses blow

cable melts

glowplug fails or burns out

relays fail

aux wiring to relay fails as well

just a few things to check

AN OLD DIESEL CAN CRAVE THE EASY START BY BEING LOW ON COMPRESSION WHERE IT WILL NOT IGNITE DIESEL BUT WILL THE EASYSTART

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Stranger

I did not realise it actually ignited the deisil, not an easy thing to do, Tell you what though could be a hair singing surprise if you sprayed easy start in there when the thing was actually working and you were cranking or preheating at the time :o:o:oops::cry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×

Important Information

For details of our Guidelines, please take a look at the Terms of Use here.