Winterising

[tjg1677]

Hello everyone,

Got a question to ask, it is my first season of NB boat ownership and if have read much conflicting advice regarding prepping the boat for winter. Amongst some of the many items I have seen the following:

Fill raw water system with anti freeze

Ditto shower trays and drain pumps

Ditto toilets

Drain calorifier

Drain fresh water system........... the list goes on.

I am hoping to get some use out of GK over the winter months and would love to hear what you all do to your boats please.

Thanks in advance

 

Trev

[ChrisB]

Do you have shore power? As if you have, low consumption tube heaters can make a big difference to the depth of winterisation necessary.

[Chelsea14Ian]

We don't take a chance,our boat coming  out of the water next week.This will be our first  time for the boat.

[TheQ]

Last week I anti freezed the Generator raw water system and then removed the impellor (recommended by the generator manufacturer). Some time in the next couple of weeks I'll drain the fresh water system, I don't antifreeze my shower as it has a very old system which drains into the bilge, with no u Bend, the bilge pump clears the water.

 The toilets I don't think need antifreeze as with all the chemicals and liquid deposits it's not likely to freeze solid.

 My calorifier is at the moment disconnected but if was in use I'd drain it.

Luckily being diesel -Electric I still have some use of the boat for short trips, as the batteries will drive me along for up to four hours before needing a recharge. So Coltishall from Horning, a stop for lunch or overnight, while being plugged in, is quite possible. The solar panels topping up any lesser trip.

[ranworthbreeze]

Hi Trev,

We have two low wattage tube heaters (60 watts per foot) in the engine on a frost stat, we do the standard winterisation  when all the allocations have finished.

Regards

Alan

[BroadAmbition]

Trev, we too have 2 x tube heaters via shore power and thermostat set to +2c. Usually used Nov through to April. That is the only 'winterising' we do. Winter cruising for us is a great time of year, 'B.A' is usually out on the rivers every month. Keeping her in a wet-shed helps enourmously of course. Being a woody, taking her out of the wet stuff is a big no-no as 'this would dry her outand open her up

Griff

[kfurbank]

Trev,

 

Your list is fairly spot on if you have no electric and are not planning on using the boat. I use mine all year round and all I do is tube heater with frost stat and keep the diesel tank topped up. I also turn the water pump off and then open all the taps to allow expansion room. I turn the pump off in case I forget to turn all the taps back off before I put the battery isolators back in. It's a good idea to complete your engine service around now so that the engine has fresh oil to see it through the Winter.

If the boat isn't going to be used through the Winter then removing the impellor is a good idea as they tend to remain out of shape, although once removed they can get brittle, so probably better to just replace with a new one at the start of the season. 

[Viking23]

I would just like to add, from my experience and logic, a boat out of the water can get far colder than if left in the water, especially items close to water level.

We took ours out one winter, and we found that there was an eggcup full of water in the domestic water pump, this was enough the crack the housing, £65 learning process.

The water pump goes home at this time of year, and is refitted in March, we can bring it with us for winter cruising, if we so wish.

For those with Paloma instantaneous water heaters, they are very vulnerable, an air frost at -1c is enought to freeze the heat exchanger, and split the pipework, easy fix, if you do some DIY home plumbing lol,  -2c can be enough to crack the control valve.

So draining down is essential during October. I also remove the drain plug, and  slacken the 4 screws on the water temperature control valve, once it froze and distorted the housing, £35 less in my pocket. You can't get new parts now, for the MkV, but a few secondhand ones can be found on ebay. 

For the shower pump, this is a direct coupled diaphragm pump with pre filter, and is the original, (30 years old) and I get a cupfull of made up strong salt water and pump it through.

Elsan,  well a Thetford lol, empty of course, tilt the unit and pump the flush device till it pulls air through. 

Place moisture absorbant crystals in appropriate places helps too. Leave fridge door open, but first a wipe inside with a bleached cloth.

Lots of other things to do, dependant on type of boat.

Richard

[Vaughan]

An autumn oil change is important as old diesel oil is acidic. Run the engine to warm it up, at the same time opening all the taps and letting the pump empty the water tank. Then stop the engine and change the oil and the filter. Don't change the diesel filter until the spring, in case it freezes over winter.

The problem with running antifreeze through the raw water side is that in the spring, you are pumping all that into the river. Not very green! It is also very expensive. Draining the raw water system using the drain plugs on the engine is not difficult. It is also good to take out the heat exchanger tube stack and check it for deposits. Also take out the raw water impellor. Don't forget to drain the gearbox or hydraulic pump oil cooler as well.

Leave all water taps half open. If your pipework is copper, find the lowest point, usually in the bilges, and take off a connection to drain it. If it is plastic you should be all right. Drain the calorifier. Draining in winter means you also start with fresh water in spring. Put a bleach tablet in the first fill and let it run through the taps, before filling again. Take off the fresh water pump and take it home, so that you can take the end plate off and inspect the diaphragm and flapper valves. The quality of drinking water is very important in a boat.

Salt water in the shower tray sounds a very good idea.

Check the stern glands on shaft and rudder.

And most important - ventilation! Don't close the boat up, leave windows open where possible, as well as cabin doors, cupboards and drawers. If you have a winter cover, ensure that the air can blow through freely from end to end.

 

[Baitrunner]

Good reminder Vaughan, as not many people do the oil change this time of year and wait until Spring.

You can get "green" (not the colour, although it may be) antifreeze now for going in the raw water system - although I suspect several thousands of gallons of it going in the drink come Spring may not be too good.

[Vaughan]

I just wanted to add that normally, you keep an antifreeze mixture in the engine at all times of the year as it has other good properties other than just frost protection.

If you want to inspect the tubestack, it is easy to drain the coolant from the heat exchanger into a bucket, using the drain cock or plug underneath. When you re-assemble it, simply pour the coolant back in the engine again.

You can test the coolant strength with a hydrometer (cheap from Halfords) and I would say somewhere between minus 12 to minus 17 degrees is suitable.

[tjg1677]

Thanks everyone for their advice and input on this. It seems that different people do it different ways - hence my confusion.

I rather like the idea of a tubular heater or two however I have been told that a lot of boats at Ferry Marina have them and as they are all set to roughly the same temperature, they all tend to cut in together and cause an overload on the local grid and tripping the power supply completely, now whether this is locally at the posts or at the FM consumer unit I dont know but there is always that risk of no power and a sub zero night.  So looks like I am back to doing it the old fashioned way by manually protecting everything according the excellent advice received. Shame really as I really wanted to use her over the winter.

 

Thanks again all, much appreciated

Trev

[Seriously]

Hi Trev

currently in same position as you. going to get her ready for winter myself . Only because Id like to think I could use her in the winter if I get the chance. I think we will be willing to rough it for one night (only if the wife agrees)  . So only need to  Re winterise the raw water system. Take bottle water with us, maybe shower at the  boat yard and use their facilities. Not exactly Hilton but well worth it just to be on the river in the winter.

Karl

[Oddfellow]

For anyone who wants a winterisation service, Kingfisher can do the full monty or the bare minimum for you. 

The problem with tube heaters is complacency. You are basically relying on them working. If the power goes, they won't protect you and if you have no way of monitoring this....... 

Each to their own; if you want to use the boat, you need to work out ways of providing the most fool-proof protection that  can be quickly undone and redone. If you are not expecting to use the boat, do it properly. 

Don't forget too. Winterising is not just about stopping things freezing. It's about protecting your carpets, soft furnishings, curtains, fridge, wall coverings and so on. 

[JawsOrca]

I second what Andy says.. I couldn't rely on tube heaters.. Marina powers do drop out.. We winterise our boats each time we leave them in the winter.. We do use the boats throughout the winter though so it helps keep mould etc down.. I don't think you really can leave a boat for 6 months and expect it to be perfect in the spring. Learn how to winterise the water systems each time and use her  

[JanetAnne]

We have all commented on our ex hire boat having its name on all the bunk boards, bottom of drawers, cushions etc. That's because it was all removed and stored safe for the winter. This allowed the maximum air movement through the cabins and therefore minimum damage while the boat is out of use.

I just mention it because we are all aware of antifreeze and tank draining needs but perhaps haven't considered other areas.

[ExSurveyor]

I always drain the domestic water system,  cover the engine in a thick quilt, fit engine heater on thermostat,  fit dehumidifier on timer and small cabin heaters on thermostats.  

I also visit to stay at least once a month and have a friend living near who will call over if I ask.  

The boatyard are also great if I ask them to check. 

This is the first winter with the little boat as well,  I have decided to take it out from December as I am less likely to use it and one less thing to worry about. 

I also hope Norfolkland has a mild winter 

 

[Polly]

We leave all the lockers empty and open for air flow. Unlike BA, Brilliant comes out; she doesn't open up as some woodies do, and takes up in spring with very little fuss....so far! (I'd say 'touch wood' but that would be silly) 

Being yer Classic saily, there is not much more to do; we take the outboard back to Marine Tech for servicing and storage, and empty the water containers.  Some years we take the sails in to Jeckells for valeting depending on how much use they have been put to.

Last year we took the summer covers into the 'other' Jeckells for cleaning and reproofing and  they did a great job on these elderly covers. Sadly though, they haven't had a good summer, tree 'sap' being the culprit; but rather than   repeating the clean and reproofing cost I am making a new set for cruising, the old ones will go on top when moored to collect the aphid contributions, so saving the new. It will be an interesting winter project.

 

[Oddfellow]

On 27/10/2016 at 3:42 PM, Vaughan said:

 

If you want to inspect the tubestack, it is easy to drain the coolant from the heat exchanger into a bucket, using the drain cock or plug underneath. When you re-assemble it, simply pour the coolant back in the engine again.

 

There are plenty of Bowman and Polar header tanks out there that either don't have a drain or where you wouldn't dare to open it. Many of these castings are old and trying to unscrew a drain from it might spell disaster if it is not regularly removed. 

I would not recommend this unless it is a regular thing. For a Bowman or Polar with rubber end caps, just remove the end cap and drain that way. 

[Jim]

Hi all,

We have kept our boat in for 9 years of the 11 we have owned her.  Standard practice has been to empty all the water tanks, get holding tank emptied, check internal cooling system anti freeze and plug in a frost heater in the engine bay and oil filled radiator in the cabin. The tube heater in the engine bay had never run via thermostat and that is one thing I would like to do this year.  Can you recomment the unit on your boat Alan?

 

[ranworthbreeze]

Hi Jim,

We just have a small frost stat that is powered by a AAA battery which I change at the start and end of the season, this controls the two tube heaters one each side of the engine that are wired into the battery charger circuit.

We only have the main shore breaker on and the battery circuit on during our closed season.

I Will get back to you on the frost stat make and model number when I am on the boat in November.

Regards

Alan

 

[Regulo]

We use a standard mains powered frost stat controlling two tube heaters. We're lucky in as much as our marina owners are on site all winter and soon rectify any electric power trouble. It would need to be a severe cold snap to cause damage, I'd think

.

 

(The single socket in the pic has now been updated to a twin for two tubes)

[Jim]

Thanks Alan and Regulo,

Earliest I can get to ours will be this coming Sunday so hope to get her at least plugged in for the time being.  Fellow forum members have always kept us in the loop about power issues whenever they could and we only had one "near miss" in the Winter of 2010/11.  The marina did suffer a power outage for a short while during a very cold spell so when we got back to our boat in March 2011 we discovered some damage.  There was an old water filter fitted on the galley which we never used as the whole thing was so old, I could not get the top off to replace the ceramic cartridge. The whole unit had exploded and there was ceramic all over the cabin so it saved me the job of removing it!  We had also blown a core plug in the raw water manifold and no other damage thankfully.

 

 

[tjg1677]

Check this out, argos, eighty watts and thermostatic....thirty quid.

http://www.argos.co.uk/product/3956625

[Baitrunner]

My only comment on relying on the built in stat is they are often not very good for low temps. 

So You might be better off going for a normal tube heater and separate frost stat unless you don't mind it being on a lot more than when it's just freezing.