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EastCoastIPA

Well Done BA On These Two Prosecutions

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1 hour ago, Ricardo said:

No I don't think it will happen , but I merely reacted to a post that appeared to at least be more about how fast one can go across braydon , me I'd be thinking hell we consumed all that diesel at sea time to calm things down a bit after all who's gonna see it live , the guy caught can't be too far away from where I used to live really considered I'm too from west Yorkshire :12_slight_smile:, my point re braydon was simple ie wats the point :default_beerchug:

In all too many instances, I suspect, a case of toys for boys, vroom vroom! Actually it must be fun so why not? Mind you, I'd rather take my time & make use of my binoculars. 

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I happened to witness the incident on the river Wensum which for the most part occurred between the Carrow Bridge and the Novi Sad Friendship Bridge. The picture in the EDP I would suggest was taken north of the Friendship Bridge.

I was standing on the car park of the Riverside Leisure Centre.

If you look closely at the picture of the speeding boat, yes he was speeding, no doubt at all. Sure the swans were at risk, the wash was excessive but I have seen worse, and of course the individual had been warned before. So you could argue that he got his just desserts, bang to rights as they say.

But the size of the fine and costs, £2650. That is a huge amount of money for what would seem to be somewhat out of proportion for the actual severity of the offence, when compared with some road traffic offences and criminal offence.

Regretfully the full incident was not published and could therefore possibly be construed by holiday makers and others as being unreasonable which is regrettable.

Andrew

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On the other hand, Andrew, many other fines and sentences  might be construed as inadequate. Personally I welcome this outcome, even if it is heavy handed, reaction by both the BA & the Courts. 

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I have to agree with Andrew on this. After all we have photographic evidence of what actually took place. He didn't hit anything, there were no moored boats about and he certainly didn't damage the banks, as they are solid concrete.

I am not condoning it for a moment but does this really merit a fine of over two and a half thousand pounds?

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5 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I have to agree with Andrew on this. After all we have photographic evidence of what actually took place. He didn't hit anything, there were no moored boats about and he certainly didn't damage the banks, as they are solid concrete.

I am not condoning it for a moment but does this really merit a fine of over two and a half thousand pounds?

However the newspaper article does state that he was caught on 3 separate occasions on that stretch and also was prosecuted for exceeding 5mph along by the Whitlingham Woods car park, which is not a concrete bank. So the fine covers four speeding offences as well as an offence of not being tolled.

Would have been interesting to see the level of fine if the RSPB had chosen to get involved and prosecute for the disturbance caused to the swans, if that were possible off course?

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As iv already said he's known to me and many others too as a prolific speeder , he's upset an awful lot of people in a very short time , it really doesn't matter that the banks in the city are concrete there is wildlife about in usually large numbers and the fact is there is a 4 mph speed limit although I will admit more signs are required as the last one I think is at carrow yacht club the beginning of the river in question , either way he's been reported many times and caught many times , so far play to BA and the courts if you don't learn you will eventually pay and in this case a considerable sum , clearly iv no sympathy  at all but I doubt anyone on here would having had him pass them flat out at 1am ! 

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20 minutes ago, Ricardo said:

As iv already said he's known to me and many others too as a prolific speeder , he's upset an awful lot of people in a very short time , it really doesn't matter that the banks in the city are concrete there is wildlife about in usually large numbers and the fact is there is a 4 mph speed limit although I will admit more signs are required as the last one I think is at carrow yacht club the beginning of the river in question , either way he's been reported many times and caught many times , so far play to BA and the courts if you don't learn you will eventually pay and in this case a considerable sum , clearly iv no sympathy  at all but I doubt anyone on here would having had him pass them flat out at 1am ! 

Sounds like he has not the slightest respect for others, rules, regulations or authority so I guess it will not be too long before he is at it again. Probably the only way to stop someone like that is to confiscate the vessel but I doubt it would ever come to that. 

 

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7 minutes ago, vanessan said:

Sounds like he has not the slightest respect for others, rules, regulations or authority so I guess it will not be too long before he is at it again. Probably the only way to stop someone like that is to confiscate the vessel but I doubt it would ever come to that. 

 

Very true he hasn't , that said he's not been out for a while now than goodness, problem is BA can't take the boat but t the courts can , its not live aboard so not a home its classed as an asset and a bailiff can cease it if required to do so .

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Very true he hasn't , that said he's not been out for a while now than goodness, problem is BA can't take the boat but t the courts can , its not live aboard so not a home its classed as an asset and a bailiff can cease it if required to do so .


If he’s annoying everyone as much as it sounds like wouldn’t we expect someone to take the law into their own hands at some point?
Not that I’m condoning that.


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Just now, JohnK said:

 


If he’s annoying everyone as much as it sounds like wouldn’t we expect someone to take the law into their own hands at some point?
Not that I’m condoning that.


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Believe me it could easily happen and likewise I don't condone that method but if you don't learn then to me 3 strikes n your out and that includes tolls too , in stead of messing about with national park this n national park that BA should be putting more plans into place to stop this abuse of the system , and if that means changing the law then do be it .

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As stated the fines are for cumulative offences including tolls so I would suggest rather than excessive the fine could have been higher especially if the court has taken account of his earnings, as for the second offender on Breydon if it is the case I think it might have been then given the extent of damage and distress he caused in my opinion the fine could and should have been substantially higher, that sort of disregard for the safety of people and their property is totally unacceptable, as I understand it fines are supposed to be a deterrent as well as a punishment.

Fred 

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Re the Breydon incident:

 http://www.greatyarmouthmercury.co.uk/news/cruiser-pilot-fined-for-speeding-on-breydon-water-1-5350304

There are two boats, same type, with the same name, different registration numbers:

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki/index.php5?title=Boat_Photograph&photo=338y_63188&BoatId=39953&BoatHistory=63188

Wouldn't have thought that such a small boat could cause such problems.

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Do we know anymore?
There has to be more to it than just speed doesn’t there?
I have a friend () that’s done 45 knots across Breydon but not when other boats are around. Is he risking prosecution?


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2 minutes ago, JohnK said:

Do we know anymore?
There has to be more to it than just speed doesn’t there?
I have a friend (emoji57.png) that’s done 45 knots across Breydon but not when other boats are around. Is he risking prosecution?


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Agree, there is more to this than is being reported.

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I can only guess that the boat was passing too close or in between other boats and perhaps going backwards and forwards. 

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Blinking heck its a SC 23 I'd have thought it much bigger , I best not get that bigger SC35 I'll be getting in trouble every day , then again I prefer life as a film not a blur :12_slight_smile:

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28 minutes ago, JohnK said:

Do we know anymore?
There has to be more to it than just speed doesn’t there?
I have a friend (emoji57.png) that’s done 45 knots across Breydon but not when other boats are around. Is he risking prosecution?


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Theoretically no, I think!

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Phew, I’ll tell him
That was certainly what I think I was told by the rangers (speed is fine but we expect you to pass other boats slowly when not towing) but that article worried me that it seemed to be more about the speed than anything else. Compounded by the head ranger saying it’s a lesson for speeders.

That’s reminded me of something else but I’ll start another thread.


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I've seen spirit of breydon moored at the old nra staging on breydon before so dropped off the plane to go past and once clear gone back on the plane then did the same on the way back across (it was a shakedown run), got a cheery wave from them so no it's not just about speed, if you bounce another boat about it's wrong but if it's clear no problem.

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10 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

Re the Breydon incident:

 http://www.greatyarmouthmercury.co.uk/news/cruiser-pilot-fined-for-speeding-on-breydon-water-1-5350304

There are two boats, same type, with the same name, different registration numbers:

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki/index.php5?title=Boat_Photograph&photo=338y_63188&BoatId=39953&BoatHistory=63188

Wouldn't have thought that such a small boat could cause such problems.

That's interesting.. So they got caught under the safe speed rule... Looking at colregs which I suspect are whats used on Breydon. (http://www.nepia.com/media/73232/Colregs-Rule-06-Safe-Speed.PDF) they are a little vauge which means the prosecuting party had to have proved that unsafe speeds where being used and the examples in this rule are again a little vauge. I suspect that the skipper was inexperianced or failed to prove enough to the judge that they understood the controls of the boat or somehow got too closed or showed they was unable to stop etc etc. 

So certainly speed itself is fine just know how to handle it.. which considering most boat on the Broads don't leave the system that may leave many of them open up to getting caught.. Unless you have a trade plate and speeding in the special sections which clearly have special airbags under the water to protect everyone including the swans.. 

 

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20 hours ago, Wussername said:

I happened to witness the incident on the river Wensum which for the most part occurred between the Carrow Bridge and the Novi Sad Friendship Bridge. The picture in the EDP I would suggest was taken north of the Friendship Bridge.

I was standing on the car park of the Riverside Leisure Centre.

If you look closely at the picture of the speeding boat, yes he was speeding, no doubt at all. Sure the swans were at risk, the wash was excessive but I have seen worse, and of course the individual had been warned before. So you could argue that he got his just desserts, bang to rights as they say.

But the size of the fine and costs, £2650. That is a huge amount of money for what would seem to be somewhat out of proportion for the actual severity of the offence, when compared with some road traffic offences and criminal offence.

Regretfully the full incident was not published and could therefore possibly be construed by holiday makers and others as being unreasonable which is regrettable.

Andrew

I disagree. This was not an isolated incident and, believe me, when you get hit by that wash, the boiling water you're making your tea with is easily all over your legs, and that's if you're still on your feet. Unlike speeding on a road, excess speed on the water has an immediate detrimental effect on all other river users around you. It will wash baby birds out of nests, potentially flood and kill kingfishers in nests,  it will cause major erosion, and has the potential for considerable vessel damage too. I witnessed him fly past my boatyard having overtaken two (maybe three hire boats 30 yards away) and my fleet nearly landed on the bank. 

If holidaymakers find the level of fine high, it will serve as a major dissuasion from speeding. Nobody who is able to stick to the rules has anything to worry about. 

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20 hours ago, Vaughan said:

I have to agree with Andrew on this. After all we have photographic evidence of what actually took place. He didn't hit anything, there were no moored boats about and he certainly didn't damage the banks, as they are solid concrete.

I am not condoning it for a moment but does this really merit a fine of over two and a half thousand pounds?

In the EDP photo, there were no moored boats, but this isn't the only place he was guilty of such speed or red-handed. As i said in a prev post, he am near beached my fleet going past me at speed. 

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11 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

Re the Breydon incident:

 http://www.greatyarmouthmercury.co.uk/news/cruiser-pilot-fined-for-speeding-on-breydon-water-1-5350304

There are two boats, same type, with the same name, different registration numbers:

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki/index.php5?title=Boat_Photograph&photo=338y_63188&BoatId=39953&BoatHistory=63188

Wouldn't have thought that such a small boat could cause such problems.

I don't know if this is the same boat or incident I was referring to as I didn't hear the name of the boat just the considerable amount of damage on and distress caused to a privately owned ex hire boat when it stopped at Yarmouth to clear up the mess and report the incident, I believe there was either a video or photos of what happened given or shown to the Rangers I also don`t know how badly other boats including hire boats were affected, if people feel the need to open up across Breydon then do so at high water when few other boats are likely to be around.

Fred

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I have suffered the effects of this idiot leaving Coldham Hall one evening where I saw his boat moored when I was there..

About an hour after we left,  in darkness,   a speedboat shot past us at Brundall,  he must have been going over 30, the wash was horrendous and he was out of sight before I could get to the window.

I spilt a bit of G and T.

He should have his boat confiscated.

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1 hour ago, rightsaidfred said:

I don't know if this is the same boat or incident I was referring to as I didn't hear the name of the boat just the considerable amount of damage on and distress caused to a privately owned ex hire boat when it stopped at Yarmouth to clear up the mess and report the incident, I believe there was either a video or photos of what happened given or shown to the Rangers I also don`t know how badly other boats including hire boats were affected, if people feel the need to open up across Breydon then do so at high water when few other boats are likely to be around.

Fred

The EDP article refers to a victim surcharge of only £66.00 which suggests to me that damage was only minimal, not that that I am in any way condoning what happened or anti-social speeding in general. 

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