Edp Article Re Mooring Closures

[MauriceMynah]

58 minutes ago, Hylander said:

What was wrong with their own shower and their own hairdryer?.

Some northern bloke was re-tiling it, and boy was he taking his time.

[rightsaidfred]

As this has expanded on from BA moorings to attitudes there are a couple of points to consider, first for landowners its not just greed you only have to look around to see the problems with littering to understand  the reluctance of some to allow mooring on their property,  regarding double mooring the increase in anti social behaviour  is obviously a big factor and will make many reluctant to take the risk with strangers myself included given past experience, yes perception is greater than reality but by the time you find out it can be to late hence caution often means refusal.

Fred

[BroadAmbition]

They didn’t have enough hot water, no shore power and a tiny hair dryer. I didn’t really like the idea of them running their boats engine for an age. Plus MrsG was onboard so all to the good

Griff

[BroadAmbition]

Plus we were on shore power full tank of hot water, immersion on, hair dryer that would get a dinghy moving!

i just gave them the Fwd of ‘B.A’  instructed one of them how to operate the shower / pump etc, shut the companion way doors and left them to it

Griff

[Broads01]

9 hours ago, marshman said:

And I agree totally with MM - all this squit about busy rivers is only valid to someone who has a relatively short memory.

 

It is not "squit" and I find that offensive. I'm not old enough to have experienced the Broads in the 60s and 70s so "short memory" doesn't come in to it. I am old enough however to have experienced the 80s and 90s when there were still many more hire boats than now but the mooring situation wasn't nearly as bad. Yes, there were more hire boats years ago of course but the point is there were more boatyards to moor in then and more public moorings to boot.

[JennyMorgan]

2 hours ago, Hylander said:

Are you fond of hospital food I wonder!!!.       You are brave that is all I can say.         What was wrong with their own shower and their own hairdryer.     You have a very very understanding wife.

Mrs G has a vast store of Brownie Points, it'll hit Griff hard if she cashes 'em all in at once!

[Seagypsy]

9 hours ago, Baitrunner said:

I’m going to open a different tack on this.... double mooring. 

I don’t think I have ever seen a hire boat double moored. On the one occasion I asked a hirer if I could moor alongside them they declined!! Bramerton common is a good point in question.

and before anyone asks yes I have invited hire and private craft the option of tying alongside us. Even a couple of canoeists at Berney Arms who were never getting out safely used our swim platform and tied their canoes off to us while they stretched their legs. 

Other than with a boat you know, has anyone had many good experiences of rafting up?

Double and triple mooring used to be the norm at Horning back in the 70's untill there was the lull in the foreign holidays then it was you can't moor here we MIGHT be going then the answer was well you get on the outside. Also when Blakes had the office at Ranworth John Lyons made sure as many as possible could moor up

[JennyMorgan]

Got to say that I am quite, if not completely, satisfied with the BA's mooring policy. They have upset at least one reputable landowner and lost an opportunity or two but that's old hat now. I am not convinced that it is for the BA to supply a plethora of moorings. Due to the flood alleviation scheme we have lost numerous informal moorings, no fault of the BA. In the past lots of small boatyards had a scheme where boats from other hire yards were welcome to moor. Now with fewer, and much larger yards, there are scores, if not hundreds of hireboats clamouring to moor at non yard moorings.  On top of that we have pressure on what moorings we have by boat owners with arguably greater expectations of what a mooring should offer than is reasonable, e.g. space. I'm more inclined to blame the Gt British public rather than the BA on this one.  Take Oulton Broad as an example,  at one time there were more than fifteen hire yards there, probably providing a hundred plus moorings for hire boats, all gone now, no fault of the Authority. The Authority is due some pretty hard hitting criticism but not on this topic, in my opinion of course!

[MauriceMynah]

5 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

I'm more inclined to blame the Gt British public rather than the BA on this one. 

Can someone warn the NHS that there will be an unexpected influx of forum members suffering from shock.

[Guest]

We alway moored at the boatyard, just down from 'The Commodore', I can't remember the yard name, but it's houses now...

 

[Vaughan]

1 hour ago, Broads01 said:

11 hours ago, marshman said:

And I agree totally with MM - all this squit about busy rivers is only valid to someone who has a relatively short memory.

 

It is not "squit" and I find that offensive. I'm not old enough to have experienced the Broads in the 60s and 70s so "short memory" doesn't come in to it. I am old enough however to have experienced the 80s and 90s when there were still many more hire boats than now but the mooring situation wasn't nearly as bad. Yes, there were more hire boats years ago of course but the point is there were more boatyards to moor in then and more public moorings to boot.

Well I am old enough to remember and I agree with Simon, although Marshman has been talking a lot of sense in his other posts.

I suggest that there was more river traffic in the 60s and 70s. There must have been - there were around 3000 hire boats! All the same, there was no particular shortage of moorings, as there were so many hire boatyards. There were also far more wild moorings, where now we have "private" notices or flood banks.

There was a lot more double mooring, at Horning Staithe for instance and especially in GYYS where they were sometimes moored 4 in a "trot"! I have a feeling that this was because those who stopped in Yarmouth were after its seaside "Kiss me quick" atmosphere and that feeling of a happy crowd together may have extended to the moorings as well. Maybe today's holidaymakers prefer more privacy? Or is it "health and safety" on the part of the mooring attendants?

There are a lot more rules on the Broads now, and a lot more official bodies in charge of various parts of the whole but I sense that there is a lack of a genuine overall vision for the future. There can be no doubt in anyone's mind that the mooring problem has to be addressed.

 

 

[JennyMorgan]

7 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

There can be no doubt in anyone's mind that the mooring problem has to be addressed.

But is it up to the BA? Why not the industry itself? 

[riverman]

Just my tuppence. 

There has been much talk about how the decline in moorings are a complex issue and this I can't dispute. However, to some extent this is self inflicted.

Much in same way it's been said that farmers (land owners) can be too short sighted/greedy with regards to moorings, I would also argue that BA has the same issue. 

BA/Besl/BAM had the opportunity to increase moorings (wild or otherwise) when undertaking the flood alleviation work. They could have also had a lot of free dredging done but that's beside the point. 

They could also undertake there own mooring repairs, which would save money and they would get a better job *see hoveton viaduct current works **don't take a spirit level. 

BA tend to rub people up the wrong way, if they handled there relationships with land owners, farmers and boat yards in a better way, then there might not be so much of an issue regarding moorings.

There has to be more give and less take, bearing in mind that these are for profit operations, that the broads is not natural, and that we can only go forwards in time not backwards. 

 

[riverman]

29 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

But is it up to the BA? Why not the industry itself? 

Although this is a good idea, I don't see it practically working. For this to work there would need to be an industry body, taking a mandatory and proportion toll off all boat owners so as to make it fair for all....isn't there already something like that?

If just the boat yards paid for moorings, then there would be people mooring for 'free' or people being restricted from certain moorings. 

It would be a better idea for BA to allow managed expansion of the larger yards or reasonable devolpment by land owners in exchange for substantial river front 24hr moorings. 

[Seagypsy]

3 hours ago, kingfisher666 said:

We alway moored at the boatyard, just down from 'The Commodore', I can't remember the yard name, but it's houses now...

 

Don't know if it is right yard but Broadsway Cruisers was on Commadore Rd, first time on Broads 1975 hired Cambria also think Topcraft was there.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Seagypsy said:

Don't know if it is right yard but Broadsway Cruisers was on Commadore Rd, first time on Broads 1975 hired Cambria also think Topcraft was there.

Broadsway Cruisers, that's the one!. We were usually on a 'Blakes' boat at that time and Broadsway were a 'Blakes A flag' yard. I know it was only a hop, skip & jump from 'The Commodore'. I seem to remember 'Topcraft' was around the broad a bit, nearer the old maltings.

[JanetAnne]

Topcrafts yard is still there, just. You can't miss it, there is currently a big yellow digger ripping it down 

[MauriceMynah]

Greedy money grabbing land owners !!!

Hmmm, is it?   I wonder !

Imagine this. you own a riverside field. You allow people to moor there in the knowledge that there is a shortage of bins on the broads. Choice 1. Do you supply bins (and swallow the cost) or accept that there will be a small proportion of boaters who will fly tip their rubbish there. You supply the bins (which out of the goodness of your heart, a service you pay for.) Also, You have to take out insurance in case someone hurts themselves. These days they WILL sue.

So you decide to lease the property to the BA. They don't supply bins (It's not their job nor in fact their responsibility) So you supply them anyway (at your own expense) then you find you still have to take out insurance in case someone hurts themselves using the bins.

As the expenses build you decide to recoup your costs from the BA. Thus far, you have provided a facxility at significant cost both financial and time and not received a brass farthing, so you decide to make some money from this facility. You are then accused of being a greedy money grabbing land owner. You close the lease, take back the land and stick up "Private, No Mooring" signs.

Sound familiar?

Most of us take our rubbish to proper facilities. Most of us use barbecues responsibly. Most of us take responsibility for our own actions.

BUT Some do not. so moorings close.

 

[Malanka]

Well I was on the broads in the 70’s and every decade since and yes there were more hire boats then. We never moored in a hire yard unless it was give boat back day. If folks remember that differently that’s fine. What we did was drop mudweight, or chuck rhond anchors into reeds and take a leap of faith that it’s reeds not water and hope for the best as we jumped as high and far as we could usually enthusiastically yelling some imaginary pirate boarding cry. Magic fun for a child of 13. North or south it was usually bank side mooring. 

Anyone using percy’s Island recently will have witnessed almost every night double mooring on horning staithe and the pub too. So I don’t know about nobody doing that there these days. My eyes say differently.

I’m with JM on this issue in that folks don’t seem to want to moor nose to tail anymore, with all the mod cons coming out the wazoo these modern hire boats have, thrusters here there and everywhere nose to rail should be a fiddle. What I do see is less care being taken over other people’s property, this leads to then people leaving space so as not to “be in the way”, which in turn leads to well if he’s doing it and so on. 

Even when single handing I can push Malanka sideways with enough impetus to get ten or 15 feet out quite easily and I’m pretty sure there aren’t many hire craft that weigh more than Malanka does. I’m not the most mobile anymore ( two bouts of crutches six months each in the past 6 years) and I can still get onboard even if a little ungainly these days.

My opinion for what it’s worth is that folks don’t moor with others in mind. They moor thinking I go forwards to get out therefore I must have space. This lack of thought or awareness of how boats move is down to lack of information from the hire yard at handover to new hirers. It’s not a mistake experience let’s you make. Think Reedham leaving with tide and so on, I’m sure everyone I’ve seen do that never ever does it again. 

When we cruise we always have plans A B AND up to F. When it comes to mooring, the I must go there in that spot is not how we cruise. We don’t have issues with mooring , apart from the smacking the boat with either boat or boat hook morons that is. 

 

Great debate, great points and as usual I agree to some degree with everything. Life’s too short to fret. My blood pressure can’t take it .

No job yet still searching. 

 

M&F

[MauriceMynah]

10 minutes ago, Malanka said:

My opinion for what it’s worth is that folks don’t moor with others in mind.

Martin, The tragic thing is that folks don't do ANYTHING with others in mind. These days it's "to hell with anyone else" on so many occasions.

 

13 minutes ago, Malanka said:

What I do see is less care being taken over other people’s property,

As above.

[Malanka]

For me it’s the lack of trepidation or awareness concerning consequences of actions. I had that drilled into me every day for years and I have done the same with mine.

My kids have no limits to their ambitions (13 years at International Schools will do that) but they respect other people.

 

M