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Poppy

Sand Martins And Nndc

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https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/politics/council-under-fire-over-sand-martin-nets-1-5983138?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Social_Icon&utm_campaign=in_article_social_icons&fbclid=IwAR1tL6jLW88HpqV8E95BUA__5SuqgJwSSmxY_uKXeTw5Yixj_mMVWXgL2SI

"North Norfolk District Council put the temporary netting up on cliffs at Bacton to deter the birds from nesting during work on the Sandscaping project, which will see 1.8m cubic metres of sand put on the beaches to protect them from erosion.

The council said Natural England approved the nets and the RSPB had given advice."

Natural England, on Radio Norfolk  have said that they have no system for approvals. The RSPB are saying that the Council has not followed the advice they gave !  :default_icon_mad:

The Relevance of this to the Broads ? Well, the sand martins from this colony are regularly seen feeding over Barton Broad and elsewhere. Video on BBC Look East last night of the birds hanging on to the netting, seeking a way through to their nest burrows was, to quote my wife 'heartbreaking'.  I had to agree.

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For those who have trouble with links to the EDP, here's the article.

Use of nets to stop sand martins nesting on cliffs at Bacton prompts council criticism

The use of netting to encourage sand martins to nest elsewhere on the north Norfolk coast has seen a council come under fire.

North Norfolk District Council put the temporary netting up on cliffs at Bacton to deter the birds from nesting during work on the Sandscaping project, which will see 1.8m cubic metres of sand put on the beaches to protect them from erosion.

The council said Natural England approved the nets and the RSPB had given advice.

However, the method has been criticised. Maggie Wilcox, from Overstrand, said: “This is an emotive subject, especially when you are talking about tiny sand martins that have travelled thousands of miles only to find their nest sites blocked. This amber listed bird needs our support.”

The RSPB East twitter account posted: “Disappointing to see yet another case of netting against our migratory birds. We can only hope that the sand martins are not getting caught.”

They added:

Sarah Butikofer, the leader of North Norfolk District Council, said she was investigating the issue - and was particularly keen to establish the size of the netting and if it met suitable standards.

She said: “I am concerned about what people have brought to our attention. I have asked officers to tell me if the netting which has been used is of the type which was recommended by the RSPB, because I don’t want any birds being trapped.

“But this is a project to protect the coastline, including the low lying settlements of Bacton and Walcott and a balance will need to be struck.

“However, I’m also asking if we’ve covered the absolute minimum area we need to and if there is any chance of moving the netting as early as possible once the work we need to do is done.”

A statement issued by North Norfolk District Council on Friday said: “Netting has been used on parts of the cliffs at Bacton in order to encourage sand martins to nest further along the coast in other suitable habitat.”

Last month, Tesco was criticised after it put netting up over trolleys at its Harford Bridge superstore to stop swallows nesting above them. The criticism led to the removal of the nets.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

“We will be reaching out to North Norfolk District Council to find out more details on this case, as well as to offer advice and support in finding a swift resolution.

I have to admit, that did make me laugh!

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I would imagine if the birds are deterred from nesting this year they won't return next year

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Possibly but I think the point is the distress it's causing the birds this year. In a similar vein there are issues with contractors netting hedgerows near housing developments too. 

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2 hours ago, NorfolkNog said:

Possibly but I think the point is the distress it's causing the birds this year. In a similar vein there are issues with contractors netting hedgerows near housing developments too. 

We have seen the distress with Sand Martins in the 70s when we used to go up to Coltishall Lock, you moored at the other side then and they nested in the bank, some one rammed a boat in the bank and blocked several tunnels, me and my daughters spent best part of an hour in a dinghy opening them up again and releasing the birds trapped inside

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There’s a districnt lack of care here. The council would be quick to dive in where any individual breached a bylaw but in my eyes interfering with wildlife at any time let alone nesting season seems to be a breach of civic duty. I feel like I’ve contributed indirectly so am looking forward to wannabe candidates turning up on my doorstep to tell me why I should vote for them in the local elections and indeed what they think of this personally. Extremely disappointing behaviour. Naughty NNDC.

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I must say it’s about time someone decided that protecting local communities took precedence over a birds nesting site for one season. 

Birds have the cognitive abilities of the average cockroach or frog of even fish which many think nothing of stamping on or hoiking out of their natural environment. 

Anthropomorphism at its worst. 

 

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25 minutes ago, Malanka said:

I must say it’s about time someone decided that protecting local communities took precedence over a birds nesting site for one season. 

Birds have the cognitive abilities of the average cockroach or frog of even fish which many think nothing of stamping on or hoiking out of their natural environment. 

Anthropomorphism at its worst. 

 

Personally I see no harm in being concerned for our feathered friends. 

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That isn’t what I said read what I said

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It is horrible when someone decides to treat anyone or anything like a piece of ****, unfortunately some decide to do so

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I saw all these comments and thought I must have read a different article. I read it that as part of the flood defences a big pile of sand was going to be dumped at the bottom of the cliff and the cliff was netted to save birds from being trapped by the sand. Surely that is a good thing? Surely if the cliffs fall into the sea more birds would be affected?

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2 hours ago, SteveDuk said:

I saw all these comments and thought I must have read a different article. I read it that as part of the flood defences a big pile of sand was going to be dumped at the bottom of the cliff and the cliff was netted to save birds from being trapped by the sand. Surely that is a good thing? Surely if the cliffs fall into the sea more birds would be affected?

The colonies between Mundesley and Bacton Terminal are periodically lost for a season due to landslides. Netting has been used before to move the Martins along. One instance being the creation of the excavated ramp at Happisburgh.

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the way I read the report was that they were using netting, but had not followed the guidelines set down by the rspca for the type of netting used, to me this seemed to be the crux of the matter.

I can see that netting off some of the area to prevent nesting sites being buried by the new sand cover is a reasonable precaution, but it does strike me that if they had got their act together and started the project as soon as the birds had left on their migration, they could probably have completed it before the birds returned - or is that just wishful thinking?

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I assume, maybe wrongly, that they would need a decent weather window to complete the work.

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Malanka, I have read very carefully and several times to make sure I understand exactly what you mean... and I agree with every word.

There are many times when "wildlife" and society find themselves in conflict. It is necessary on these occasions to balance the needs of each group to assess the importance to either to either. Sometimes unpleasant decisions have to be made.

As ever I find myself exaggerating by way of illustration. Imagine this...   You are the fireman in charge.

There is a fire in a block of flats. next to the block there is a pond, which in turn is the home of some great crested newts, the nesting site of two pairs of bittern, and is considered a site of scientific interest. it is the only water available to you

The fire engine needs to use the water from that pond to put out the fire, but it will drain the pond by doing so.

Q1. Nobody is in the flats, you are dealing with nothing other than property. do you drain the pond?

Q2. There are people in the flats. Do you drain the pond?

There are many other questions I could put to you all dear readers, but you get the gist.

People should not complain about housing shortages whilst at the same time stop or even delay housing developments because there's a blue tit nesting there.

We all understand the principles involved, it is to the degree those principles are applied that is in question, and unlike my questions above, the answers are rarely so black and white.

Nature is red in tooth and claw, and the human being is part of nature.

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+1 

Excellent analysis and my point exactly. 

 

M

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11 hours ago, Malanka said:

That isn’t what I said read what I said

I did, hence my comment! 

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The problem, as I see it, is one of timing. 

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1 hour ago, grendel said:

I can see that netting off some of the area to prevent nesting sites being buried by the new sand cover is a reasonable precaution, but it does strike me that if they had got their act together and started the project as soon as the birds had left on their migration, they could probably have completed it before the birds returned - or is that just wishful thinking?

A more than reasonable conclusion.

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I read last night, again this morning, that the NNDC in a meeting with RSPB have agreed to remove the netting, or at least some of it. I always believe what I read in the EDP.

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7 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I read last night, again this morning, that the NNDC in a meeting with RSPB have agreed to remove the netting, or at least some of it. I always believe what I read in the EDP.

Although they have already backtracked on the timeframe in which it will be done.

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/environment/timeline-changed-for-removing-netting-from-norfolk-beach-1-5988233

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2 hours ago, grendel said:

the way I read the report was that they were using netting, but had not followed the guidelines set down by the rspca for the type of netting used, to me this seemed to be the crux of the matter.

I can see that netting off some of the area to prevent nesting sites being buried by the new sand cover is a reasonable precaution, but it does strike me that if they had got their act together and started the project as soon as the birds had left on their migration, they could probably have completed it before the birds returned - or is that just wishful thinking?

Depends what project, netting the cliff or pumping sand?

They are going to pump 1.8 million cubic metres, that is a lot of sandle castles and will take time. The words Rome, Day and built come to mind.

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Hi all from reading EDP and your threads why couldn't they have done it last autumn or early spring, 

We have simlier issues with builders taking down house sparrow / marting swallow & swifts, on over 40 houses they've put up 20 boxes on the back of houses , 

It's case of not understanding birds coming back to same best site year after year, if the nest site gone birds gone, 

We need to protect what we have got look at RSPB bird count,

 

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