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oldgregg

Crossing North To South

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8 minutes ago, Paul said:

I saw a tidal app for IOS being banded about the faceache groups recently, which not only gives tide times but "state of the tide", but from the screen shots alas this seems to have been worked out as simply the percentage of time passed between each high and low etc. This is not accurate. 

I'm aware of that one. As some know I've been working on an Android app for some time (admittedly as a side side side side project) but without giving too much away, it would work a little differently.

6 minutes ago, Paul said:

and after all the debate and pondering, and the best laid plans possible, remember the tides can be anything up to two hours late depending on weather conditions

Yes that's what made me think about the feasibility of a Saturday evening slack crossing, as it could end up being a late one.

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4 minutes ago, Paul said:

and after all the debate and pondering, and the best laid plans possible, remember the tides can be anything up to two hours late depending on weather conditions

That is so true. I normally find that having a plan and sticking to that plan are two entirely different concepts on The Broads. Also trying to keep to a schedule or time is the worst plan. Some of my best times on Breydon have been when time is not an issue and I'm there just because I can be.

I have often left Reedham with an ebbing tide and cruised down the Yare, out across Breydon, under the bridge and then turned around and come back across Breydon. If the ebb is still really strong and I'm in the mood, I'll just set the revs to 1200rpm and cruise back at 2mph or whatever the ebb will allow. I'm not thrashing the engine. The time is my own and I have time to enjoy Breydon. I would then either moor up at Burgh Castle or The Berney Arms for the night.

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2 hours ago, EastCoastIPA said:

For the return I have, but wouldn't normally contemplate fighting a flood on the lower Yare or Waveney as they are much stronger than the flood on the Bure. You will thrash the engine, burn more diesel, and be disappointed by the payback on the Bure as a lot of the time you can hardly feel the flood when going up the Bure. Aim ideally for 90 - 120 mins after low water and if necessary pick up the start of the flood about half to three quarters of the way across Breydon to get the best passage up the Bure.

That's the first time I can remember seeing anyone advise waiting longer than an hour after low water for South to North but it makes perfect sense. I often make the mistake of setting off too early, arriving less than hour after low and then being against the tide all the way to Stacey Arms. I know people often recommend a short stop at the Yacht Station to allow time for the flood to begin but I've never fancied doing that because I'd rather see the back of Great Yarmouth as soon as possible. 

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Starting to get confusing are we going N to S or S to N topic titled Crossing North to South

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North to South, but the boat will need to come back later the same week...

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I always arrive "late" at GY whichever way I am headed. South to north an hour after slack works for me. 

One thing I would add is to watch the chanel marker posts on Breydon or the lower Bure as you travel. Seeing the water flowing round the posts will tell you in which direction and how fast the tide is around you. 

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I know she's my wife, but Marina always works out the tides when we are heading north and coming back south.She nearly always gets it right.Most of the season we stay south, then on our hols, we fight off the river monsters, then head north.

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North to South, but the boat will need to come back later the same week...


It better do......

:-)


Sent from my iPhone using Norfolk Broads Network
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10 hours ago, Paul said:

 

It's perhaps not an issue with your airdraft but remember the water level does not rise and fall evenly, it rises and falls much quicker at the beggining of each new tide then towards the end and as much as 80% of the rise can occur in the first two hours of the tide. 

Whilst information on this topic is very helpful in planning journeys North to South and back again I do feel that the rise of water level statement could possibly cause some confusion.

Calculating height of tide at a given time can be quite accurately predicted using tidal curve graphs but a simple alternative is using the "Rule of 12th s"

A new tide will near enough rise 3/12th or 25% in the first two hours. During hours 3 and 4 it will rise another 6/12th or 50% and in in the last quarter, hours 5 and 6 it will rise a further 3/12th or 25%.

From looking at the above it can be seen that the largest period of the rise is during hours 3 and 4 or over the middle period. Hours 1 and 2, 5 and 6 give the smaller rises.

Hopefully this information may give help to some when planning the crossings.

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Silly question but does the same apply to the ebb as well as the flood?

(I know the ebb last longer but is the theory the same)

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Actually it confuses things - I do not think the 12th rule applies at Great Yarmouth nor in many places across the Broads. There are just too many other factors around in Broadland, such as flows of fresh water etc etc.

Apologies if you disagree!!!

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I think the general principle is right. Tracy at the Berney once described it to us in a very animated manner. Basically it starts off slowly, gathers pace and towards the end runs out of steam. That does tend to hold true to an extent I think. The under tow on the Bure at Yarmouth confuses a bit also.

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Have to agree with Marsh on this one. It can actually be ebbing at Yarmouth yet the tide might in reality be rising!  It might also be ebbing on one side of the river and flooding on the other!  

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I have value to add here!

We have taken Thunder through North to South one hour before LOW water. We were making 5mph on tickover through the yacht station so not a great deal of steerage no real problem for an experienced helm. Had a bit of an issue when a craft castoff from the Yacht Station ably assisted by Yacht Station staff about 30m in front of us.

The nice past the yellow post we struggled to make 3mph at about 2000 revs until under the big bridge then about 4mph across Breydon- this was before the new engine so we were not pushing it.

I would say that if the weather is forecast for a fine weekend there will probably be a lot of privateers out and about on southern rivers so mooring at London May be a problem!


Sent from my iPhone using Norfolk Broads Network

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I reckon both might be difficult to be fair!


Sent from my iPhone using Norfolk Broads Network

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9 minutes ago, Matt said:

........ mooring at London May be a problem!
 

I agree.

Can I  just add to this thread and also related to the recent one about "when did people get scared"

If you are a relatively newbie to boating, reading this thread, or never been through Yarmouth before, just aim to get to Yarmouth at around or just after slack, going north or south and all will be fine.

The ONLY thing you HAVE to worry about is clearance under the bridges, if you're not sure call the Yacht Station.

The reason I made this post is that chat about the crossing, either way, is very interesting and informative and provides food for thought for all, but speaking from experience does worry some people unnecessarily. (sometimes too much information is a bad thing).

I just wanted to reassure the less experienced reading the forum that passing through Yarmouth is not a problem, and something to be enjoyed.

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Wise words indeed.

We are considering the 'finer points' but avoiding getting stuck under the bridges is most important. I agree, for the less experienced stick to the established guidelines. Hundreds must do it every year with thankfully few problems!

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32 minutes ago, NorfolkNog said:

Wise words indeed.

We are considering the 'finer points' but avoiding getting stuck under the bridges is most important. I agree, for the less experienced stick to the established guidelines. Hundreds must do it every year with thankfully few problems!

That's exactly it Noggy, you make the point more succinctly and with fewer words.:91_thumbsup:

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16 minutes ago, Wyndham said:

with fewer words

Not what Mrs Nog says!!! :default_biggrin:

 

:default_beerchug:

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