Ferry Marina Discount

[marshman]

There is no doubt that the hire yards are feeling the pinch this year - but anecdotal evidence suggests that the holiday business as a whole is squeaking a bit!

It is quiet on the rivers, but not only is there a noticeable absence of hire boats around, there seem to be less private boats on the rivers. Yesterday on Ranworth Staithe there were still 4 spaces at 4 o'clock. I don't think that there is any one reason, other than uncertainty - people hate that and with a stagnant property market, people just feel uncomfortable. Are they not taking holidays or are they staying at home or just spending less money? We can speculate but it is probably just a number of issues, all of which have an impact.

 

[Vaughan]

Short breaks are nothing new either. They have been discussed, and tried out, for donkey's years.

The price is normally around 60% of the weekly price, so if you let two short breaks in the same week, Fri to Mon and then Mon to Thurs, you are getting 120% of the weekly price. They are also a good way of introducing beginners to a boating holiday.

Those are the only advantages, however! This only works if you let the boat for two short breaks in the same week. If not, you have all the usual costs of servicing and preparing the boat, with a trial run, for only 60% of the hire price. And if you let two short breaks, you have all the same costs of preparing it twice. A short break means the boat is blocked off on the chart for the whole week, when it might have got a week's booking. You also tend to get a lot more damage and a lot more interior cleaning to do.

I don't think they are worth it, except perhaps in the low season.

While I am at it, the same applies to day launches. They are no good unless they are out all the days of the week. You will never make money out of a day launch if it only goes out on a Saturday and Sunday.

[DAVIDH]

I received an email from Barnes Brinkcraft yesterday offering up to 25% off remaining August availability. I think it's a real worry. The Broads needs the hire boatyards to be successful in so many ways. Most obviously, it expands the choice for us holidaymakers. If they can see a return on their investment, they will build more boats, expensive to hire start with but putting more money into the local economy. These new boats will of course over time, become old affordable boats, but raising standards at the same time. Less people coming to the Broads means less money going into the local economy. Less money being spent in shops, pubs restaurants etc. General facilities/services for the holidaymaker become tired and perhaps abandoned in places.  It can be a downward spiral. Interestingly, a quick scan of the next couple of weeks shows most of the high-end boats are already booked. Nothing  showing for Faircraft Loynes for example.

Holidays abroad are selling well at the moment, partly because of the "changeable" weather, but with heavily discounted prices. Hotels/apartments are contracted in advance and it's better to have some money than none. The airlines are heavily discounting for the same reason. Ryanair and Easyjet are both suffering. So it's not just the Broads.

From what I can see, I do think many people are trading down from 7 to 3 or 4 night Broads bookings. I see many go through without knowing much detail, but from the values, it's clear they are not 7 night holidays. Perhaps Vaughan has it when he says it's OK selling short breaks but if the other end of the 3 or 4 night part of the week, the boat is sitting on the moorings, it's not good. Having said that, I like to monitor on Hoseasons, how many boat classes are left to hire (7 nights) on the Friday before each Saturday of the Summer School Holidays. It shows more boats available for this summer, but not a catastrophic rise. For what it's worth, I have copied these figures below. Notice how things started slipping last year after 3 years of near sell-outs for the early weeks. None of this is definitive - just anecdotal as has been said. 

Boats still available over the last 6 years (2014 to 2019)
1st week 3/0/1/0/10/20 
2nd week 19/1/1/2/13/48
3rd week 27/2/1/1/6 (6th week still to come)
4th week 34/5/1/1/0 (6th week still to come)

[CambridgeCabby]

I do wonder why the Hoseasons booking agents are not screening any adverts this year as in previous years , doesn’t look like they are doing anything to warrant their commission rates 

[DAVIDH]

12 minutes ago, CambridgeCabby said:

I do wonder why the Hoseasons booking agents are not screening any adverts this year as in previous years , doesn’t look like they are doing anything to warrant their commission rates 

They are spending, but on social media and Google Adwords. See the image below. Each time somebody clicks on the advert, Hoseasons pay anything upwards of £1, depending on how much more the competition wants the top spots. It's a very expensive game, but more relevant now than newspaper/TV advertising.

[grendel]

it looks to me that the early weeks of august are getting less popular, but the later weeks are gaining in popularity, i do wonder if this is down to people waiting for those last minute reductions.

[CambridgeCabby]

7 minutes ago, DAVIDH said:

They are spending, but on social media and Google Adwords. See the image below. Each time somebody clicks on the advert, Hoseasons pay anything upwards of £1, depending on how much more the competition wants the top spots. It's a very expensive game, but more relevant now than newspaper/TV advertising.

The trouble with that advertising is that you only target holiday makers already seeking (as in your search) boat hire on the Norfolk Broads , whereas a tv advert reaches out to everyone and introduces the idea of a Broads holiday to “fresh blood”

[oldgregg]

But who watches TV adverts now?

I for one mostly watch YouTube or OTT services like Netflix and Amazon Prime, and some TV programmes that I've set to record and then skip the adverts...

That's becoming the way a lot of people do things (although they probably skip the recorded programmes and just go to iPlayer).

I've been very surprised by how quiet it is this year. We had no trouble getting moored anywhere we went in July. Much quieter than last year even...

[ranworthbreeze]

Lets face the weather has been poor again this year, we have had our fair share of rain & storms and you do have to feel for the families that have opted for boating holidays. It may have been the best week weather wise when I was on the boat from 23rd July, even though we had two storms at night over the week on the Tuesday & Thursday Night.

We had Breydon Water closed to hire-craft last weekend and there are rumors that this may be the case this coming weekend.

Regards

Alan 

[rightsaidfred]

I still think cost is a major factor for families high season, I have had several hirers comment on it and while its not my thing I have friends who do an all in cruise for a lot less than the hire of a top end cruiser.

Fred

[Coryton]

1 minute ago, rightsaidfred said:

I still think cost is a major factor for families high season, I have had several hirers comment on it and while its not my thing I have friends who do an all in cruise for a lot less than the hire of a top end cruiser.

But it doesn't have to be a top end cruiser to have a very enjoyable holiday.

13 minutes ago, ranworthbreeze said:

Lets face the weather has been poor again this year, we have had our fair share of rain & storms and you do have to feel for the families that have opted for boating holidays. It may have been the best week weather wise when I was on the boat from 23rd July, even though we had two storms at night over the week on the Tuesday & Thursday Night.

We had Breydon Water closed to hire-craft last weekend and there are rumors that this may be the case this coming weekend.

I thought the last two weeks were very good weather-wise. Lots of sun, not too hot, and very little rain.

Could have done without the winds on Friday afternoon and Saturday though.

[SwanR]

We have had a number of short breaks at each end of the season, partly because sometimes four nights is enough when the  daylight hours  are short and the nights are cold! But also it is more affordable for the kinds of boats we like to hire. 

[rightsaidfred]

4 minutes ago, Coryton said:

But it doesn't have to be a top end cruiser to have a very enjoyable holiday.

 

True but even a mid range boat can cost about the same for accommodation only as a lot of all in cruises, while we enjoy boating on the broads for its own sake I think the majority of people these days want more than basic accommodation for their money.

Fred

[Aboattime]

1 hour ago, rightsaidfred said:

True but even a mid range boat can cost about the same for accommodation only as a lot of all in cruises, while we enjoy boating on the broads for its own sake I think the majority of people these days want more than basic accommodation for their money.

Fred

Could not agree more,that being the case, is this not the reason for the huge gin palaces on hire, with huge costs to hire?As boat owners we just love cruising the broads,and are there fore willing to accept the limitations of our boats because to us its just part of the broads experience.As ive been boating for many ,many years, my expectations of boats is probably different to new boaters.

[ChrisB]

I intend to have one of my extended trips to Australia in Winter 2020/21. I have said that I would like a trip on the Murray for a week or a short break. My son tells me Mildura and Mildura Houseboats are the Stalham/ Richardsons of the Murray. I would go before the high Summer/ Christmas period so this boat would be A$ 2100 or about £1200 and can easily accommodate my youngest with his wife, my eldest and me.

 

[CambridgeCabby]

With modern living comes the expectation of all mod cons , can you imagine a young twenties couple content with holding on to a twin tub washing machine whilst it goes through its cycle to stop it wandering across the kitchen floor or the tv closing down at midnight ?

Having to cook dinner from scratch with no ability to “ding” a ready meal?

Walking their children to school or relying on public transport ?

The same has happened with the hire fleet , some now have wine fridges , tracking satellite tvs, spa baths , power showers washing machines and even dish washers , personally we prefer a boat to be fitted out like a boat as opposed to a floating luxury apartment .

 

[vanessan]

31 minutes ago, ChrisB said:

I intend to have one of my extended trips to Australia in Winter 2020/21. I have said that I would like a trip on the Murray for a week or a short break. My son tells me Mildura and Mildura Houseboats are the Stalham/ Richardsons of the Murray. I would go before the high Summer/ Christmas period so this boat would be A$ 2100 or about £1200 and can easily accommodate my youngest with his wife, my eldest and me.

 

As someone who has had 4/5 trips on houseboats on the River Murray, I will really envy you!  They are magnificent vessels and it is a completely different world to the Broads. I love both because they are so different, sadly I think long-haul travel may be a thing of the past now so I will just have to rely on some truly wonderful memories. Don’t forget to do a write-up after your trip. 

[Heron]

Just read the comments on this thread from the last couple of months. Lets face it as a nation we are in denial.

Inflation 2.1%, I wish!  Brexit uncertainty.  We are told  Employment figures going up in leaps and bounds, who are they kidding? The National Park tag putting people off because we do not want to holiday as part of a crowd, a popular image of NPs. The High Street on the rocks,  the growth of food banks,  and there are plenty more reasons why people cannot afford a holiday on the Broads.

[BrundallNavy]

Just seen on FB Freedom are selling off a hire boat due to poor bookings this year. 

[SwanR]

Maybe it's one out one in. They are also advertising Commanding Light as the flagship of their fleet. I don't recall seeing that one before. There's another thread about it on the forum.

[marshman]

More like to fund the new one just announced!

Whilst of course Heron could be right about the NP tag actually putting people off, I think he (?) would be extremely hard pushed to find any real evidence to prove that point. Equally it is all to easy to say we are in denial but some other points are pretty difficult to prove or otherwise. Sounds like Trumpisms to me!

[rightsaidfred]

While it is impossible to prove any of the comments as fact if you talk to enough people you can get a pretty good feel of what is of most concern, the two overriding comments are to do with cost and problems with the boats and how well or badly the problem is dealt with probably the biggest spoiler for those affected, hardly anyone mentions the BA or associated politics they are only interested in the experience good or bad.

Fred

[Broads01]

11 hours ago, Vaughan said:

Short breaks are nothing new either. They have been discussed, and tried out, for donkey's years.

The price is normally around 60% of the weekly price, so if you let two short breaks in the same week, Fri to Mon and then Mon to Thurs, you are getting 120% of the weekly price. They are also a good way of introducing beginners to a boating holiday.

Those are the only advantages, however! This only works if you let the boat for two short breaks in the same week. If not, you have all the usual costs of servicing and preparing the boat, with a trial run, for only 60% of the hire price. And if you let two short breaks, you have all the same costs of preparing it twice. A short break means the boat is blocked off on the chart for the whole week, when it might have got a week's booking. You also tend to get a lot more damage and a lot more interior cleaning to do.

I don't think they are worth it, except perhaps in the low season.

While I am at it, the same applies to day launches. They are no good unless they are out all the days of the week. You will never make money out of a day launch if it only goes out on a Saturday and Sunday

Short breaks tend to be 70% of the week price now Vaughan, effectively more than that when you consider you pay the same damage waiver on top. I have been on a 3 night break a couple of times a few years back but never again as they're just too short in mind and particularly poor value for money. 

[DAVIDH]

1 hour ago, brundallNavy said:

Just seen on FB Freedom are selling off a hire boat due to poor bookings this year. 

The boat in question (pictured below) was never actually in the hire fleet. Freedom had been working on it's refurbishment with the intention of adding it to the  fleet, but now, probably because they have added Commanding Freedom, have decided to put it up for sale. 

[SwanR]

I did wonder whether that was the case David, or whether this had been in their fleet previously. It isn't entirely clear on FB but I read it that way as well.