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7 hours ago, Timbo said:

...where I can, I check each transaction form thoroughly just like I would do with any contract.

And that, sir, is the rub of the matter.

How can we , any of us, claim to be "savvy" "on the ball" or whatever when we just blindly go through the checkout routine reading just those bits that happen to catch our attention?

Some companies will hide the odd trick there, but anyone with criminal intent can thrive if they've taken you that far.

Nothing new here, car hire companies have used this technique for years, hiding their weasel ways in the small print certain in the knowledge that they won't be spotted until it's too late.

Should we blame Amazon for our failure, or should we learn from the experience and start reading these ToS before we hit the "enter" button.

For example, How many reading this have actually read the ToS of this forum? Who noticed the notation on condition 7b that, "anyone mentioning Queen Victoria in any thread would automatically owe our chairman £3.47p?

(Timbo, the cheque's in the post.)

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You can pretend to hide from Amazon, Ebay, internet shopping, and indeed internet banking for as long as you like, but these are popular services simply because people use them and want them! You real

I work 8.30am to 5.30pm so by the time Ive finished work the shops are shut. I hate food shopping and tesco deliver. It frees up our weekends to go boating  my elderly parents live in a village wi

Why would I wish to question your integrity? What motive would I possibly have. I do not know you. I have never met you. I do feel at this moment in time that I do not wish to meet you. I am

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On 07/12/2019 at 16:40, SPEEDTRIPLE said:

It will NEVER happen to me, we NEVER use Amazon, or Ebay, of any other of the on-line trendy shopping systems. Go to the shops to buy things, and keep people in work.

It's all right for those in or near the big cities, but living as I do 20 miles from Norwich is the closest I've lived to one. Deapest Wiltshire, the Outer Hebridies, coastal Northumberland and now Coastal Norfolk.

It's a 40 mile round trip to Norwich, so that's fuel, parking and a lot of time. Just to get a small item. When living in the Hebridies pre internet, everything was mail ordered at great expense and a 28 day delivery time. Even now delivery is more expensive.

By buying Amazon or Ebay you are avoiding many middle men taking a cut. But what happens to the money you have saved.. you spend it.. The one thing I don't agree with is Amazons tax avoidence schemes..

You could logically extend not using Amazon to not using the big supermarkets, But do we want to go back to the early 60s where 40% of the average income was just spent on food?

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We had a spate of "your internet's about to be cut off" calls a few weeks ago, all recorded messages. Trouble was, each time it came up as coming from a different number. These seemed to be randomly generated, so it was pointless blocking one, as the next one was purportedly from a different number. Very frustrating and annoying. I'm sure the phone companies could stop this "spoofing" of numbers, if they really wanted to, but it's obviously not a priority when there's money to be made.

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The only time I have been scammed was when someone used my PayPal account to order a very expensive watch from Saks Fifth Avenue. Fortunately I got an email notification and managed to cancel the order before it was shipped. PayPal were useless, didn't want to know, must be my fault for giving someone my password. As a result I don't save my card details anywhere online, Happy to type in the numbers when I want to place an order, and I avoid Paypal as much as possible.

In defence of Amazon, lots of small high street shops also sell through Amazon. We bought a guitar for my son recently from a fantastic independent high street music shop. They sell lots of instruments through Amazon and it enables them to reach a much larger customer base than they would through their high street shop, so not all bad.

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You can pretend to hide from Amazon, Ebay, internet shopping, and indeed internet banking for as long as you like, but these are popular services simply because people use them and want them! You really cannot stand in the way of progress forever, so you might as well use them - like dealing directly with real people in the past, there is no guarantee that you will not have issues and to be honest, whilst I use all mentioned regularly, I rarely have issues. As one would expect, there are too many scare stories about promulgated by the likes of the Daily Mail about everything going wrong for everyone and every transaction, but it a bit like the views expressed on Forums, the vast majority of people are quite happy and just get on with it!  I do not think these days it would be possible to live as I do without these facilities and am grateful for them.

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Having spent the morning and part of the afternoon fighting through city shops, being walked into by people glued to a mobile phone, queuing to pay for items, carrying large and/or heavy gifts back to the car and being run down by numerous shopping trolleys, I shall be very glad to return to online shopping and rest my aching legs! At least I can peruse at my leisure, find unusual things, get stuff delivered and all while I have a cup of tea (or something stronger). The high street started dying long before I began to desert it and there’s no going back. Like it or hate it, online shopping has become a way of life. 

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8 hours ago, TheQ said:

It's all right for those in or near the big cities, but living as I do 20 miles from Norwich is the closest I've lived to one. Deapest Wiltshire, the Outer Hebridies, coastal Northumberland and now Coastal Norfolk.

It's a 40 mile round trip to Norwich, so that's fuel, parking and a lot of time. Just to get a small item. When living in the Hebridies pre internet, everything was mail ordered at great expense and a 28 day delivery time. Even now delivery is more expensive.

By buying Amazon or Ebay you are avoiding many middle men taking a cut. But what happens to the money you have saved.. you spend it.. The one thing I don't agree with is Amazons tax avoidence schemes..

You could logically extend not using Amazon to not using the big supermarkets, But do we want to go back to the early 60s where 40% of the average income was just spent on food?

Citys are no different I am afraid ok if you want to fight through a shoping centre but not local high streets, I live in London and the high street is fine if you want a barbers, betting shop or charity shop all of which provide a good selection but not much use for anything else, as a pensioner I dont want to drive a few miles trudge around a shopping centre all day carrying a load of bags and thats the problem, an hour on the internet with goods delivered to my door is now the way to go.

Fred

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I work 8.30am to 5.30pm so by the time Ive finished work the shops are shut. I hate food shopping and tesco deliver. It frees up our weekends to go boating :default_biggrin:

my elderly parents live in a village with no amenities and are always ordering online. When they get to a point where they can no longer drive, I think they will still be able to stay in their house as everything can be delivered to the door. 

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On 09/12/2019 at 10:55, Regulo said:

We had a spate of "your internet's about to be cut off" calls a few weeks ago, all recorded messages. Trouble was, each time it came up as coming from a different number. These seemed to be randomly generated, so it was pointless blocking one, as the next one was purportedly from a different number. Very frustrating and annoying. I'm sure the phone companies could stop this "spoofing" of numbers, if they really wanted to, but it's obviously not a priority when there's money to be made.

Problem being that these calls are generated from a VOIP (voice over internet phone) and you can spoof any number you wish. The phone companies can do nothing about it. as most of them hide behind a VPN (Virtual Phone Network) there is no way to track them that way either.

All of the numbers they call are bought from people. who just call and when you pick up, the phone the number just rings off. That way they know it's a live number and someone, at the other end is willing to answer the phone. They buy these numbers in thousands, in computer language, which then generates the recorded message to you, they sit back and wait for someone to Press 1

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On 09/12/2019 at 10:55, Regulo said:

We had a spate of "your internet's about to be cut off" calls a few weeks ago, all recorded messages. Trouble was, each time it came up as coming from a different number. These seemed to be randomly generated, so it was pointless blocking one, as the next one was purportedly from a different number. Very frustrating and annoying. I'm sure the phone companies could stop this "spoofing" of numbers, if they really wanted to, but it's obviously not a priority when there's money to be made.

Most providers  offer free call and internet blocking services such as Sky Shield and BT Protect.

Fred 

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We get both the recorded message saying they are going to cut our internet off and also the actual person call stating misuse of our BT internet and we must comply with them ...we ain't on BT but don't tell them that and to be honest it's probably the only time our landline rings lol...

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Our handsets use Call Guardian, which means anyone calling from a number which is not in it's phonebook including a withheld number have to announce themselves before the phone rings. Only once they have done that will our phone ring and when we answer the phone plays back their announcement giving us the option to answer or decline the call. If they decline to say who it is that is calling then the phone cuts them off.

It blocks fake calls completely. 

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9 hours ago, Paul said:

Our handsets use Call Guardian, which means anyone calling from a number which is not in it's phonebook including a withheld number have to announce themselves before the phone rings. Only once they have done that will our phone ring and when we answer the phone plays back their announcement giving us the option to answer or decline the call. If they decline to say who it is that is calling then the phone cuts them off.

It blocks fake calls completely. 

Is that a BT facility only Paul?

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On 12/12/2019 at 10:02, vanessan said:

Is that a BT facility only Paul?

Sorry Vanessan, I missed that. They are BT branded handsets, but will work on any network or provider as the screening is done by the handset not the network. You just need to have caller display, which we get free from Talk Talk, some networks might make a small charge.

https://btplc.com/inclusion/ProductsAndServices/Choosetherightphone/BT8600AdvancedCallBlocker/index.htm#hero-video

 

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I think it's the best piece of tech we've ever bought. If someone whose number is in the phones contact list calls then the phone rings normally and the name of the contact appears on screen. If a number that is not stored in the phone, or a withheld number calls then before the handset rings it asks the caller to record a short intro of who they are or the reason for their call. The phone rings and displays "announced call" and plays you the message when you answer. If you want to speak to the caller press one, if not press two and they go to answer phone. After the call you also have the option to permanently block the number, or set it as trusted which means the next time the caller doesn't have to announce themselves. 

It has stopped nuisance calls completely. They don't bother even announcing themselves, they just hang up, and automated calls saying "we are calling about your recent accident, press 1 to blah blah blah" can't get through as the caller has to press hash once they have recorded their message. 

We have the twin handset version but they come as singles, twins triples and even quads I think and the call screening facility works on each handset.

We've also had them quite a few years and they are still working well, unlike the previous panasonic handsets we had which lasted precisely 13 months before expiring within days of each other .....

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following on from my original post I have today received my phone bill and the are no charges relating  to the call I received purporting to be from Amazon. So if it was a scam I can't see what they hoped to gain from it.

 

 

Carole

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On 09/12/2019 at 16:24, vanessan said:

Having spent the morning and part of the afternoon fighting through city shops, being walked into by people glued to a mobile phone, queuing to pay for items, carrying large and/or heavy gifts back to the car and being run down by numerous shopping trolleys, I shall be very glad to return to online shopping and rest my aching legs! At least I can peruse at my leisure, find unusual things, get stuff delivered and all while I have a cup of tea (or something stronger). The high street started dying long before I began to desert it and there’s no going back. Like it or hate it, online shopping has become a way of life. 

You forgot , avoiding the British weather.   Much nicer sitting here in the warm.     Mind you it is horses for courses as they say,  our neighbours go out every day shopping and I mean every day,  come rain or shine , or even deep snow.

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We have a phone that can block calls that you define and also 'anonymous' calls which works well enough. In the main if we get a call from a number not in our directory we do not answer it and it goes to answerphone allowing 'genuine' callers to leave a message. Unfortunately some genuine calls also come up as anonymous which are blocked and our doctors falls into this category. Having waited for a call from them and not receiving it I went down to the surgery and was told that they get this a lot but if you tell them they can enter a 'prefix number' that will bypass the anonymous block and add a comment on you notes for future reference. Thankfully we have not needed to put this to the test but if it is true I wonder how many other folk are in a similar situation without realising it.

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48 minutes ago, Hylander said:

You forgot , avoiding the British weather.   Much nicer sitting here in the warm.     Mind you it is horses for courses as they say,  our neighbours go out every day shopping and I mean every day,  come rain or shine , or even deep snow.

Don’t get me wrong, I love going out shopping! It’s just that, as I get older and less stable, I can’t handle it like I used to. I don’t think you can beat actually seeing and touching something you want to buy. I still think though that the high street has sadly had its day. 

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