Coronavirus And The Broads

[Vaughan]

3 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

I've long regarded the Inspectorate/Rangers as my friends, having been on first name terms with many of them over the years. Decent people, generally fairly laid back but there if and when I have needed them. Directives have been issued in the past frowning on fraternisation but largely these have pretty quickly been forgotten, at least seemingly so, friendships have continued.

I wonder if some realise how vital this is, not just for boat owners but especially the boatyards.  Wherever I have been the manager of a yard, the river inspector has always called in for his morning coffee (and use of the toilets!) while on his beat.

I well remember one time on the Thames at Staines, when the inspector had called in on a Saturday for his coffee break on the yard with the staff and I "snuck off" on to the quay while he was not looking.  When he set off up river towards Windsor, he got through three locks before someone pointed out to him that he was wearing a stick-on Blakes emblem on either side of the bow of his launch!  I had learned that trick from my father, who once had Jack Hunt go down the Yare from Coldham Hall with a Hearts Cruisers pennant flying on the bows of his launch.  He got all the way to Reedham before he noticed!

Since it's Easter I might as well tell this story and I promise it is true :

Our base at St Gilles in France is on the Canal du Rhone à Séte, which is a commercial canal.  They don't have rangers' launches as the canal has a towpath, so they can patrol in road vehicles.  One September there were violent storms, which flooded the canal and the area around it.  I had to go round in a hired minibus, find my boats, recover the customers and get them back to their cars, or back to the nearest airport.  After this, I was concerned that my boats were left empty in certain places, open to vandalism, and so I went to collect them.  I ended up taking seven boats home, tied together in three pairs, with one in front between them.  I had the two engines at the back running, with a gangplank between them so that I could work the controls.  I was on my own on board and the full length of the tow was about 50 metres.  My skipper's ticket covered me for 15 metres. The canal had been closed by the authorities and was still closed.  A couple of hours up the canal, I met a Gendarmerie patrol launch coming the other way.  in it were two Gendarmes in uniform and a lady I knew well, who was the regional manager for the canal authority, in Séte.  I was wearing a pair of shorts and a floppy hat and stood up from the wheel to salute them as they passed.

The gendarme at the wheel scowled and at once started to turn round but I heard the lady say "Non - ca, c'est bon. Ca, c'est Monsieur Ashby!"

[Oddfellow]

2 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

I agree with Poppy on this one. For many folk paddles and oars are their form of exercise and I see no difference between that and bikes and even trainers.

The BCU has advised against it and the BA. I got into an argument with Mark Harrison at Thorpe Island Boats who was looking for a loophole to remain open and that was that he was providing exercise. He utterly failed to accept that the risk of injury on an entirely empty river with nobody around to help was much greater now than at busy times. What would happen if you capsized and got into trouble? You could argue that spraining an ankle on a walk is also a risk, I know, but nobody is suggesting they will hire you walking boots in order to take that risk.

Risk is the issue and it's sometimes really hard to see it. Another example, I would like to take my drone out on a walk and have a fly. It's not prohibited. However, someone on a Drone group pointed out the risk if someone saw me and engaged in conversation or I had a malfunction and it flew off. How would I mitigate this? I'm rather misanthropic, so talking to people isn't likely but a fly away is not something I had previously considered.   It's a very low risk, but a risk all the same. I haven't been out (with my drone or otherwise). 

[Guest Jayfire]

21 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Sorry, but I can't help but feel the various groups/individuals who are objecting to the lock-down regulations, or are trying to find ways round them are as greater danger to the public as the virus itself.

The world on at least a partial lockdown, companies not knowing if they will be able to stay in business, people having lost jobs or not knowing if they will still have a job to return to, emergency services stripping down workforces in order to assist the health service, stadiums and exhibition centres being turned into make shift hospitals and morgues, hospital staff and carers working endlessly to try and treat an overflowing influx of sick people, over 1.5 million reported cases and 97000 deaths worldwide and rising.

97000 people having lost their lives

8000 in our own country.

And some people still think it's ok to be going to the beach together for a paddle, or to be moaning because they can't go rowing around in their canoes 

[MauriceMynah]

Jay, I struggle to comprehend how frustrating all this must be for you.

[Meantime]

19 minutes ago, MotorBoater said:

If there should be a move to ban cyclists I think they will only have themselves to blame. I am motivated to post this having just looked out of the window to see, yet again, a cyclist ride by - on the pavement - with a knapsack on his back, at about 20mph.

I would confidently lay a bet on whether A&E departments see more cycle or canoe related incidents.

That is not really the issue. If we are supposed to refrain from any activity that adds to emergency service use then both activities are to be discouraged. Cyclists can walk like everybody else.

If the guidelines say exercise locally why are these people allowed to ride miles into the countryside, if they are staying local why do they need a backpack ? Drivers are pulled over daily to explain their journeys, what about the cyclists ?

I get the arguement about canoeists getting their exercise but they can use their feet as well as their arms (Unless disabled) and if we are all in this together then start acting like it.

Any apparent bias is down to not owning a bicycle and has nothing to do with sitting at red traffic lights whilst cyclists blithely ride straight through, or being nearly flattened several times by cyclists riding at speed on the pavement - honestly.

I hope this is not too much of a deviation.

To give a little bit of balance. Could some of those cyclists with rucksacks on their backs be on their way to work, using a cycle rather than bus to get to the station or work?

Additionally for some people a decent hour walk is a good workout, whereas for others a decent hour run if they are fit enough gives them the exercise they need that an hour walk wouldn't provide. Then there are those with dodgy knees from running or whatever that find cycling a good cardio workout, but kinder on the knees.

I think we are in one of those situations where we need to do our personal best to abide by the government guidelines and do the best we can to satisfy ourselves we are acting within the guidelines, and a little less looking on enviously or in judgement at others who may, or may not be breaking the guidelines. Within a minute of where I live I have 14.5 miles of seawall I can walk around. I therefore don't need to drive to exercise and I judge myself as lucky, however I could be out taking a walk and someone else may look out their window and think, another tourist come to walk along our sea wall. Because we are getting people travel here to walk along the wall the car parks are closed, but that doesn't stop people parking in side streets. For that reason I tend to cycle or walk early or late when only a few locals are out.

The last paragraph is not aimed at any one poster in particular.

[Poppy]

31 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Yes Poppy, let's all listen to "civil liberties" groups and ignore the government advise... sorry, orders.

Sorry, but I can't help but feel the various groups/individuals who are objecting to the lock-down regulations, or are trying to find ways round them are as greater danger to the public as the virus itself.

 

Did you read the link ? What was 'outrageous' was the treat from the Chief Constable of Northamptonshire  saying his force was "only a few days away" from "marshalling supermarkets and checking the items in baskets and trolleys to see whether it's a legitimate, necessary item".

If you don't regard that as outrageous, you don't aspire to the same sort of society as me.

[Ray]

17 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I wonder if some realise how vital this is, not just for boat owners but especially the boatyards.  Wherever I have been the manager of a yard, the river inspector has always called in for his morning coffee (and use of the toilets!) while on his beat.

I well remember one time on the Thames at Staines, when the inspector had called in on a Saturday for his coffee break on the yard with the staff and I "snuck off" on to the quay while he was not looking.  When he set off up river towards Windsor, he got through three locks before someone pointed out to him that he was wearing a stick-on Blakes emblem on either side of the bow of his launch!  I had learned that trick from my father, who once had Jack Hunt go down the Yare from Coldham Hall with a Hearts Cruisers pennant flying on the bows of his launch.  He got all the way to Reedham before he noticed!

Since it's Easter I might as well tell this story and I promise it is true :

Our base at St Gilles in France is on the Canal du Rhone à Séte, which is a commercial canal.  They don't have rangers' launches as the canal has a towpath, so they can patrol in road vehicles.  One September there were violent storms, which flooded the canal and the area around it.  I had to go round in a hired minibus, find my boats, recover the customers and get them back to their cars, or back to the nearest airport.  After this, I was concerned that my boats were left empty in certain places, open to vandalism, and so I went to collect them.  I ended up taking seven boats home, tied together in three pairs, with one in front between them.  I had the two engines at the back running, with a gangplank between them so that I could work the controls.  I was on my own on board and the full length of the tow was about 50 metres.  My skipper's ticket covered me for 15 metres. The canal had been closed by the authorities and was still closed.  A couple of hours up the canal, I met a Gendarmerie patrol launch coming the other way.  in it were two Gendarmes in uniform and a lady I knew well, who was the regional manager for the canal authority, in Séte.  I was wearing a pair of shorts and a floppy hat and stood up from the wheel to salute them as they passed.

The gendarme at the wheel scowled and at once started to turn round but I heard the lady say "Non - ca, c'est bon. Ca, c'est Monsieur Ashby!"

Great stories, thank you 👍

[MotorBoater]

ECIPA, there is much in what you say and no-one would begrudge a cycle ride to work especially with the reduction in bus services, however that doesn't account for the cycle riders who just happen to pass, or are in, large open areas (Like the huge sports field next to my house) that can't be shut down.

Your last paragraph appears a reasonable response from a reasonable man. The problem is the people NOT doing their best, and that is not only cyclists. My point is that the cyclists should be held to account like anyone else and not excused as merely fitness aficionados.

Your last sentence says it all - figure out what you can do, and when to do it.

[JennyMorgan]

I don't think that I am actually trying to find a way round the rules and guidelines, just asking that a fair and reasonable interpretation of the rules is applied. Personally I do use my boat to go shopping so could argue that I need to get from my home at Oulton Broad and go to Lidl at Beccles, I could but I won't, it wouldn't be reasonable! 

I have a public footpath that runs down the side of my garden, I have seen a dramatic increase in joggers and cyclists in recent days, either going shopping, run out of toilet paper, or simply exercising. 

Personally I do get out in the garden, either gardening or working on my boat. I'm lucky, the best part of an acre of garden at my disposal and in truth I'm rather enjoying it. However, I do sympathize with those 'trapped' in less fortunate circumstances. If rules are made in a hurry then reasonableness is required. 

An eighty mile trip to go kayaking is not reasonable but that is not to say the activity itself is unreasonable. 

[rightsaidfred]

The problem is what is a reasonable exemption for some becomes an excuse for others to flout the rules that is why unfortunately we all suffer for the selfish few.

Fred

[MauriceMynah]

1 hour ago, Poppy said:

Did you read the link ? What was 'outrageous' was the treat from the Chief Constable of Northamptonshire  saying his force was "only a few days away" from "marshalling supermarkets and checking the items in baskets and trolleys to see whether it's a legitimate, necessary item".

If you don't regard that as outrageous, you don't aspire to the same sort of society as me.

If I were to drive to my nearest supermarket 5 miles away, bought a copy of the TV guide and a bottle of whiskey, then drove back, would you consider that to be a "necessary journey" ? I suspect not. I suspect Northamptonshire's Chief Constable wouldn't either. I certainly don't... BUT... If said items were included with my normal weekly shop, then yes, perfectly acceptable behaviour.

In answer to your question, No, I didn't follow your link as newspaper links give this poor old laptop nothing but grief. I shall have to trust that what the paper said was exactly what was said, and not the journalists take on what was said.

To be honest I think that selfish people taking the pee out of the lockdown are hugely more outrageous than over zealous police officers trying their best to stop people catching this bloody virus.

[JennyMorgan]

1 hour ago, Vaughan said:

 I had learned that trick from my father, who once had Jack Hunt go down the Yare from Coldham Hall with a Hearts Cruisers pennant flying on the bows of his launch.  He got all the way to Reedham before he noticed!

A jape that went down in the local history books! It was perhaps too easy to set dear Jack up. He was a hugely popular man and rather enjoyed the inevitable attention, he also liked his beer. I have regaled you with the time we that we took a sleeping Jack from one pub to another so won't repeat that. However, on another occasion he 'left' his River Commissioner's  ensign at the Waveney Inn. We had an impressive collection of Broads boatyard pennants above and behind the bar, several yacht clubs too, but we didn't have a Commissioner's flag. The legendary Charles Collier used to drink at the Waveney, but we could neither beg, borrow nor steal a flag from Charles, too damned smart! Jack used to come down off the Yare & meet up with the Waveney inspector there, probably because we served well kept Adnams! Anyway, we eventually acquired not just a burgee but a smart new ensign off Jack's boat. When he next came to the pub he commented on the Ensign, now in a prime position over the bar. With a straight face we told him that Charles had given us his old, despite it looking rather new, ensign. An answer that he appeared content with. Charles asked the same question, only to be told that Jack had actually donated it to the pub. Whether either spoke to the other about it I don't know but either way the Ensign stayed above the bar! 

[Ray]

Some of you guys should get together and write a book! I love these stories - thank you 🍺

[Vaughan]

Folks, you may think Peter and I are just telling old sea stories.  We are "punching the breeze", if you like.

But we are actually trying to show how vital that relationship has always been, between the authority, and the commercial companies, be they boatyards, or riverside businesses.

It is that which MUST NOT be destroyed, just because of this (hopefully) temporary crisis.

[grendel]

3 hours ago, Ray said:

I read a clarification from the government yesterday that said any shop allowed to be open and trading can sell anything they usually do from all their aisles. Hope that helps.

I heard that on the news on the radio, along with the comment that some police had been patrolling the non essential aisles, they did say they could sell any stock already on their shelves, i have to say none of the shops round here had shut any non essentials aisles.

[JennyMorgan]

1 hour ago, Vaughan said:

Folks, you may think Peter and I are just telling old sea stories.  We are "punching the breeze", if you like.

But we are actually trying to show how vital that relationship has always been, between the authority, and the commercial companies, be they boatyards, or riverside businesses.

It is that which MUST NOT be destroyed, just because of this (hopefully) temporary crisis.

Back in the day we drank in each other's pub, met up at trade shows, had end of season get-togethers, drank the Guiness Bar dry at the Boat Show. Beyond that there was a network. Upset one landlord or yard owner then you could be sure that all the others knew about it! 

Regarding the then River Commissioners and the Inspectorate, they too were part of that network, the holiday industry was their eyes and their ears, the relationship was amicable and on the whole beneficial to the Broads.  Back then there was mutual trust and above all, respect and understanding.

[Turnoar]

5 hours ago, EastCoastIPA said:

To give a little bit of balance. Could some of those cyclists with rucksacks on their backs be on their way to work, using a cycle rather than bus to get to the station or work?

Additionally for some people a decent hour walk is a good workout, whereas for others a decent hour run if they are fit enough gives them the exercise they need that an hour walk wouldn't provide. Then there are those with dodgy knees from running or whatever that find cycling a good cardio workout, but kinder on the knees.

I think we are in one of those situations where we need to do our personal best to abide by the government guidelines and do the best we can to satisfy ourselves we are acting within the guidelines, and a little less looking on enviously or in judgement at others who may, or may not be breaking the guidelines. Within a minute of where I live I have 14.5 miles of seawall I can walk around. I therefore don't need to drive to exercise and I judge myself as lucky, however I could be out taking a walk and someone else may look out their window and think, another tourist come to walk along our sea wall. Because we are getting people travel here to walk along the wall the car parks are closed, but that doesn't stop people parking in side streets. For that reason I tend to cycle or walk early or late when only a few locals are out.

The last paragraph is not aimed at any one poster in particular.

If within guidelines cycling is seen as being dodgy then I think we can safely assume that the fruit fields will rot this year, just can’t see how pickers will avoid congregating, but then again with borders open, planes still flying  In and out who are the powers that be trying to kill? I mean kid. I’ll keep cycling for an hour a day.

[Vaughan]

19 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

I haven't heard a cuckoo yet, worrying, where are they?

I heard a Hoopoe for the first time this morning. I suppose that they are the Minervois version of cuckoos.

[JennyMorgan]

19 hours ago, psychicsurveyor said:

The public are encouraged to report the fools to the police, the rangers are doing no different.

Quite right too but consider that the public don't generally have blue uniforms and blue, flashing lights! 

[JennyMorgan]

35 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I heard a Hoopoe for the first time this morning. I suppose that they are the Minervois version of cuckoos.

Being curious I googled and came up with this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoopoe

Bit of a treat, not yet indigenous to the Broads, e.g. I had neither heard of nor heard one, yet. 

[ExSurveyor]

25 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Quite right too but consider that the public don't generally have blue uniforms and blue, flashing lights! 

Perhaps their equipment overstates their authority, a bit like the traffic wombles who patrol the motorways trying to project a certain image that doesn't refect the powers they have 

[JennyMorgan]

1 minute ago, psychicsurveyor said:

Perhaps their equipment overstates their authority, a bit like the traffic wombles who patrol the motorways trying to project a certain image that doesn't reflect the powers they have 

A fair comment.

Most of the Rangers that I meet are decent,  'live and let live' folk, I suspect that one or two of them are feeling uncomfortable with this apparent escalation of their duties.

[Vaughan]

28 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Bit of a treat, not yet indigenous to the Broads, e.g. I had neither heard of nor heard one, yet. 

Around here we have dry, stony ground in upland vineyards. Not the right habitat for a cuckoo.

By the way, this is also why we have no mosquitos!

[ChrisB]

1 hour ago, Vaughan said:

I heard a Hoopoe for the first time this morning. I suppose that they are the Minervois version of cuckoos.

In very good summers we would get the odd one in West Sussex when that was our base years ago. However they say due to warming (or maybe bad navigation ) over 100 make the South Coast most years now.

 

 

[Vaughan]

57 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Bit of a treat, not yet indigenous to the Broads, e.g. I had neither heard of nor heard one, yet.

Actually, I remember they were fairly common in the Yare valley when I was a boy. You would see their distinctive wing colours, flying across the river from field to field. They are ground dwellers, apparently. You would see them about as often as we nowadays see a Jay flying.

My father always recognised them, from his time in North Africa.

Please excuse the slight "thread bomb" but it's nice, to talk about the spring.