Coronavirus And The Broads

[JennyMorgan]

Businesses are getting a helping hand to survive.

https://www.edp24.co.uk/business/government-grant-to-help-businesses-in-south-norfolk-and-broadland-1-6606840

[RS2021]

Was due on the Broads in a couple of weeks with NBD. Finally had an e.mail from Hoseasons over the weekend (website had been saying don't contact us we'll contact you). Their offer was either a voucher for the value of your holiday to use an any other holiday through them, or same boat, same week next year for the same price you have paid. So we've booked for next year - at least something to look forward to...

As has been much discussed, I hope the boatyards are able to weather this storm. We had already paid and I'm happy to leave the money there for next year.

[BroadAmbition]

A good friend of mine has done similar with H.W's  He has two boats booked for early April 2020 to celebrate his 60th afloat with family / friends (We were due to be afloat with them)  He has left full payment with H.W's and we are now planning to celebrate his 60th when he is 61 April 2021.  This helps out the yard and gives us all something to look forward to even if we now have to wait 12 x months

Griff

[addicted]

Our boat is still on brokerage and as things stand likely to stay that way for the foreseeable future. Frustratingly all this lovely weather would probably have made it more likely for us to find a buyer. Just to make things  perfect, we went to go out to do the weekly shop this morning to find we are going nowhere as the car battery has gone flat due to lack of use.

 

 

Carole

[grendel]

I was lucky i had to take my daughter to drop off a care parcel to her gran (social distancing was observed) and it gave my car a good 40 minute run as i left it running while at grans, which has hopefully put some charge back into the battery.

 

[BroadsAuthority]

FYI all,

BSS temporary exemption extended to 30 April (from 14 April) according to the BSS website - https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/about-us/news-and-press-releases/news-releases/nr20-003-covid-19-bss-temporary-suspension-extended/

Our guess is that they will continue to extend it in 3 week periods until there's greater clarity on the ending of lockdown.

Tom

[DuncanPritchard]

Like many others i have been unable to have my holiday on the Broads, and it doesn't look like i will get my £1500 back. The voucher no good to me as i have no other free time this year  and next year i am off to the states .

The damage Hoseasons seem to be doing will no doubt put many off booking with them if you read the comments on trust pilot

https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/www.hoseasons.co.uk

From now on i will book direct with the yards as i thought i could trust hoseasons, especially when i called before paying the balance of £1300 min early march ( after booking in October 2019) and told if the holiday was cancelled i would get my money back. Now no money back and they have changed the original T&Cs in regards Covid. They are breaking the law but what can you do when they will not engage either by email or phone.

Stroll on 2 years when i can retire and get my own boat, missing my old boat on the Thames.

Hope all the owners manage a great summer when this is all over.

happy cruising/sailing

[JennyMorgan]

Hello, Duncan. Does not your insurance cover your loss?  Does not ABTA or whatever offer to act on your behalf? Not sure that a company can change its T&Cs after the event! 

[floydraser]

I've just read the reviews and some people seem to have got a result by contacting their bank. Maybe worth a try? I would hurry though as Hoseasons maybe ready to go under.

[JennyMorgan]

Not that I have any great trust in Trust Pilot but I did however follow Duncan's link. I knew Jimmy Hoseason personally and I dread to think what he'd think if he were still alive. He built that company by treating people fairly. Hoseasons will have to go some in order to regain both the trust and the reputation that had taken the company decades to acquire. Sad reading. 

[ChrisB]

Yet another once proud business sold, then sold again into the curse of Private Equity.

Private Equity has one mantra "Take the cash and load the businesses with debt" fine until you hit choppy waters.

I think I better stop there.

[Vaughan]

I too, knew Jimmy Hoseason personally, over the space of many years. He was a close friend and colleague of my father, as Blakes and Hoseasons always worked closely with each other, despite what some may have thought.

I will quote what David Court, the M.D. of Blakes, once said to the board of directors during the big recession of the late 70s :

In this business, it takes 10 years to build a good reputation; and 10 minutes to lose it.

[NorfolkNog]

Yes, appaulling treatment by Hoseasons. I always deal with the yards directly although they still have to pay Hoseasons their cut. Which is not an unsubstantial amount either. The yards do value your business and will treat you fairly. Might be a good reason to use independent yards? Having said that my yard are excellent and have been very supportive. 

[Chelsea14Ian]

As mentioned regarding your back.Advice I've heard is at due date for holiday balance, pay if its cancelled if you use credit or debit cards you can get your money back.If it was me I would contact Hoseasons and tell them you want the money back.

[RS2021]

I think from a business perspective Hoseasons are right to offer and encourage vouchers or moving your holiday, but wrong to refuse refunds. This is really for two reasons.

Firstly reputation, you can see from this thread and Trust Pilot what it does for your reputation and as Vaughan quotes its hard to build and easy to lose. But, its the second reason which may have more impact in the log run. I've paid for my holiday and moved it to next year so I'm looking forward to a free holiday next year. For Hoseasons and the yards, however, that's a holiday they have to provide for no new cash next year. If they have done that for a lot of holidays, then here will be little cash coming into the business this time next year. At the moment the government is keen to support businesses with loans and grants. Next year? Covid 19 will be a thing of the past (hopefully), but will the government be as keen to offer support then? We are in strange times and companies must tread a fine line between destruction of a business through lack of cash, or destruction through loss of reputation. I hope both the yards and Hoseasons choose wisely and tread that fine line and survive.

P.S. Does anyone know when the yard gets its cash if you've booked through Hoseasons? Do Hoseasons sit on the cash, or does the yard get it when you pay the balance?

[JawsOrca]

2 minutes ago, RS2021 said:

P.S. Does anyone know when the yard gets its cash if you've booked through Hoseasons? Do Hoseasons sit on the cash, or does the yard get it when you pay the balance?

I believe it's on date of departure or the last day of the holiday, but probably plus 30 days too.

[MauriceMynah]

25 minutes ago, RS2021 said:

P.S. Does anyone know when the yard gets its cash if you've booked through Hoseasons? Do Hoseasons sit on the cash, or does the yard get it when you pay the balance?

A very good question, I was wondering that too. I'm sure Vaughan will be able to tell us.

I would have imagined that the yard would get the money less commission when the customer had paid it.

[RS2021]

20 minutes ago, JawsOrca said:

I believe it's on date of departure or the last day of the holiday, but probably plus 30 days too.

So that means if you defer your holiday (or take a voucher) Hoseasons, and not the yard, sit on the cash. In that case Hoseasons are going to be awash with cash as they would normally only get to keep a percentage. Does this mean the yard get nothing this year?

[JawsOrca]

I used to work in the travel industry 

Kind of (maybe) an obvious heads up, I would be very very careful booking accommodation only at present as I believe it's not covered by any bonding/protection scheme (if they are part of it - Independent yards arent)  and as such has no protection for failure: https://www.abta.com/tips-and-advice/is-my-holiday-protected. In fact I would go as far and say do not book any accommodation only! (I suspect Hoseasons will all operate under accommodation only, unless you throw something else in the booking to make it a package holiday like car hire).

(Bit of boring history maybe, reason it isn't (It's all coming back now), is because the payment isn't paid until date of departure, so theoretically the funds shouldn't go walkies, but obviously in todays cash flow problem era it's probably spent before you give it). 

If you really want to still book, you must use a credit card although I wouldn't be surprised if they start to find a hole to squeeze out from certainly you booked this year.

I suggest citizens advice regards trying to get a refund but I wouldn't be hopeful sadly as I suspect they don't have the money to give out. Would be sad to see them fail though and would be interesting to see the impact on the broads.. gulp.

Don't be fooled by the ABTA badge certainly if you aren't booking a package holiday.

[Vaughan]

26 minutes ago, JawsOrca said:

30 minutes ago, RS2021 said:

P.S. Does anyone know when the yard gets its cash if you've booked through Hoseasons? Do Hoseasons sit on the cash, or does the yard get it when you pay the balance?

I believe it's on date of departure or the last day of the holiday, but probably plus 30 days too.

I have never been a member of Hoseasons but Blakes yards had a monthly account, where hire monies less commission, were transferred to the yards. But Blakes were a non profit  making co-operative of their member boatyards, whereas Hoseasons is, and always has been, a travel agent.

They also used to have exclusivity, which allowed them to charge commission even though the yard had made a direct booking. I don't know if this is still the case but probably not for all yards.

[JawsOrca]

10 minutes ago, RS2021 said:

So that means if you defer your holiday (or take a voucher) Hoseasons, and not the yard, sit on the cash. In that case Hoseasons are going to be awash with cash as they would normally only get to keep a percentage. Does this mean the yard get nothing this year?

Yes and no.

Hoseasons may be having cash flow problems, so probably have little cash at present (but they should/maybe who knows getting support from the government).. But yes they will hold funds until the departure date of the holiday. So yes it has the potential to help their cash flow (obviously not helping the yard but they may have something in contract with the yard or goodwill gestures to help them but I doubt it and that wouldn't be how it would normally work).

If the yards not taking bookings then sadly yes they will not be getting any funds, again hopefully being supported by any government schemes though.

[Vaughan]

I remember when Thomas Cook went bust, some of their customers were held hostage in foreign hotels because the hotel had not been paid by Cooks. This may be ominous, in the case of Hoseasons.

There is also the question : do the yards need Hoseasons any more, in these modern times?  NBD, for instance, is exactly what the name implies.  You book direct with them by internet and not through an agent.  I also know a couple of other yards who have been considering abandoning Hoseasons for several years now.  Whether they ever made the break, I don't know.

There is also another objective question : Is it the boatyard who are failing to provide the holiday, or is it the customer, who is failing to arrive for the holiday?  I am having a close read of conditions of hire at the moment and will post about it shortly.

[tim]

This is possibly naive of me but I paid my balance to Pacific last Friday, I also had an email conversation with Fiona where we both hoped there maybe a loosening of restrictions before we are due to start the holiday 

I did this for two reasons, I trust Pacific to do the right thing (plus it is in my contract to do so) all my dealings with them has made me believe they are honorable people, I also did it because they probably need an ejection of cash at this time and I can afford to invest in them

Until I'm am told officially by the government that our holiday isn't happening I will cling to the belief that I shall have my broad fix, although I accept as broad pub lover that part isn't going to happen.

If we do get to go, I'm thinking of taking a second car to help transport the provisions I'll need to get me through the week!   

[JawsOrca]

2 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

There is also another objective question : Is it the boatyard who are failing to provide the holiday, or is it the customer, who is failing to arrive for the holiday?  I am having a close read of conditions of hire at the moment and will post about it shortly.

Vaughan, I believe its the government via it's advice not to travel and the state of emergency. Would be interested to see what clauses there are in booking t&c's for this.. Some may not have expected this, so it could be neglected.. I believe the travel industry have taken it on themselves to say "As goodwill, we will transfer or refund" but I suspect as money runs out it will get more interesting!

[JennyMorgan]

For all my life Hoseasons have been synonymous with the Broads. Very clearly, in its present guise, Hoseasons does not appear to be in a damage limitation mode, at least as far as their customers are concerned. I rather fear that the company, rather than try to rebuild bridges, will turn its back on The Broads, or more likely the Broads will finally turn its back on Hoseasons.  Our world will never be quite the same, that is becoming increasingly obvious. Very clearly some institutions and businesses have made some unwise, even suicidal knee-jerk decisions. As Jaws suspects, when the money runs out then it will get more interesting. Mind you, it's not just Hoseasons, the yards etc are hopefully in receipt of the money collected on their behalf, maybe there would be some sense in contacting the yards directly in an effort to retrieve money. Take that thinking a stage further then why should Hoseasons return money that they in turn have already paid out to the yards, if they have. Supposition on my part, that's for sure.