Boris Says We Can Go Boating!! - (Not sure he did we must wait clarification (edited by Maxwellian)

[vanessan]

16 minutes ago, Paladin said:

Paragraphs 1.7 and 1.9 of this government document https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

Thank you. It’s not in the Govt 50 page document as far as I can see so I am pleased to see it has been covered here. Makes perfect sense and spells out quite clearly how (for us boaters) we can use our vessels. Marshman will be delighted as he can go and work on his boat at last!

[Poppy]

9 minutes ago, vanessan said:

Thank you. It’s not in the Govt 50 page document as far as I can see so I am pleased to see it has been covered here. Makes perfect sense and spells out quite clearly how (for us boaters) we can use our vessels. Marshman will be delighted as he can go and work on his boat at last!

So can I !

[rightsaidfred]

1 hour ago, vanessan said:

Thank you. It’s not in the Govt 50 page document as far as I can see so I am pleased to see it has been covered here. Makes perfect sense and spells out quite clearly how (for us boaters) we can use our vessels. Marshman will be delighted as he can go and work on his boat at last!

Does it ???????????????

Fred

[marshman]

The CRT say you can visit your boat - what about if you are in a marina? Did the CRT specifically ban you from visiting your boat even if it were in a marina - I cannot spot that in the wording of their statement? 

So now the CRT will have to perhaps reconsider their guidance - the trouble is I doubt whether anyone at DEFRA can spot the difference between a caravan park, or a marina! I will happily show them the precise difference if they so wish, and will spell it out here if necessary!

People have no alternative but to stay in the park in their caravan, simply because the vans are not mobile and they share lots of facilities with each other. Many have clubrooms and some toilet blocks where people can intermingle but I don't think any of those issues affect the boating fraternity - unless you are sharing Mr Wallers bucket!! Most people in a marina want to go out and indeed do, they have there own toilets, including PW, and once out generally do not mingle now the pubs are shut!

How on earth can my presence at a marina during the day, and going back in my bed at night, spread Covid 19 in any way whatsoever - I would like to think the BA would be saying this point exactly to Defra - but I guess that is really just too much too hope they would actually do anything to help boaters who pay their salaries!!!!

 

 

 

 

[Meantime]

Marshman, I think the trouble is sometimes people have to be careful what they ask for! The government hadn't made any specific allowance for marinas. British Marine got involved and asked for clarification and the government lumped marinas in with caravan parks! Now we are stuck with it until someone can convince the government, quite rightly as you say, that the two are intrinsically different. Given the governments workload right now, I won't hold my breath on that happening anytime soon. Let's hope the BA want those private tolls this year and pull their finger out and lobby on our behalf!

[marshman]

Oh dear - no bloomin' hope then!!!  They do have a new safety officer but she is unlikely to buck the trend is she!!!!

 

[JennyMorgan]

I hope most fervently that the the BA are promoting & protecting the interests of boaters. Marshman's plea is reasonable and should be upheld. Beyond that perhaps boats that provide exercise or sport should be allowed to navigate the broads, e,g. wind or muscle powered and with the proviso that they are not used to provide accommodation.  If that fails to create any problems then perhaps phase in open dayboats generally. 

[colino]

Most marinas are closed anyway if i turn up i will told to go home

[JennyMorgan]

8 minutes ago, marshman said:

Oh dear - no bloomin' hope then!!!  They do have a new safety officer but she is unlikely to buck the trend is she!!!!

 

Oh dear, not yet another change of employee!

[marshman]

Her predecessor retired some months ago!!

[JennyMorgan]

4 minutes ago, marshman said:

Her predecessor retired some months ago!!

He wasn't that old was he? I didn't always agree with him but he was a decent sort and he did some good work.

 

 

[vanessan]

1 hour ago, rightsaidfred said:

Does it ???????????????

Fred

Why do you think otherwise Fred? It seems clear to me that if you can’t return to your home the same day, you can’t go to your boat. 

[marshman]

PW - showing your age! Steve was knocking on a bit and had been around for some years. Had a bit to do with him over the years but generally quite helpful when push came to shove!!!

[floydraser]

3 hours ago, marshman said:

How on earth can my presence at a marina during the day, and going back in my bed at night, spread Covid 19 in any way whatsoever 

In your own case it probably can't but the guidance has to be universal. If you have to physically touch something to gain entry for instance, open a gate, then the virus could be spread by contact with said object. If all marinas had contactless entry then no problem but I'm not sure they do.

VE day in our street everyone kept 2m apart, until they swapped mobile phones to take pictures! 

[marshman]

There are no gates to gain access - like many yards its wide open to the world!!

[grendel]

Then I guess it is down to whether the yard allow you entry to their land at this time, you may politely be asked to refrain from visiting, or they may just allow you to get on and do your maintenance.

[SwanR]

By the way ... not all caravan parks are like Haven. Some people live most of the year on the one where our caravan is. No facilities, no barriers to get through. We could easily drive there and self-isolate with no need to be in contact with anyone. The walks would be wonderful on the coast compared to wandering around the housing estate where we live. But until we are allowed to stay overnight we consider it an unreasonable distance even though we could easily do a return trip in a day. We’ve all got to be patient in these extreme circumstances and help to save lives. 

[JennyMorgan]

5 hours ago, marshman said:

There are no gates to gain access - like many yards its wide open to the world!!

Sounds like a simple ask is all that is required, a common courtesy & I wouldn't have thought it would be unreasonably refused. Just maintain social distancing, what could be more simple? .

[JennyMorgan]

No firm guidance, yet. It does seem to me that day-boating will be acceptable, at least we can hope so. Will folk in general use their common sense in the event that that is the case?

[Paul]

13 hours ago, JawsOrca said:

Angling is also specifically named as an acceptable sport from 13 May.

I wonder how many will have read this and be dangling the maggot on Wednesday claiming "The Broads Authority told me I could"?

[rightsaidfred]

10 hours ago, vanessan said:

Why do you think otherwise Fred? It seems clear to me that if you can’t return to your home the same day, you can’t go to your boat. 

Exactly, you was suggesting some can whereas I understand the ruling to mean exercise in outdoor public places only.

While I sympathise with the likes of Marshman unless your like JM with your boat at the bottom of your garden the rules apply to everyone especially those in marinas that are closed, make an exception for one and everyone thinks it applies to them.

Fred 

[JennyMorgan]

Clearly Marshman, and others, can now travel to their boats. Garden Centres can now open so it would seem reasonable that marinas can also open, but that is surely up to the marina owners. A simple phone call perhaps?

[Meantime]

7 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Clearly Marshman, and others, can now travel to their boats. Garden Centres can now open so it would seem reasonable that marinas can also open, but that is surely up to the marina owners. A simple phone call perhaps?

Peter Whilst you can now travel to your boat, whether you can access it remains another thing. The following is a list of businesses that must remain closed.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/further-businesses-and-premises-to-close/further-businesses-and-premises-to-close-guidance
 

Since British Marine the trade body sought and received clarification from the government marinas are to be treated in the same way as caravan parks, i.e. remain closed. It doesn't matter whether there are barriers or not if the marina is private land then it must remain closed.

The government has made special exception in the new guidance for garden centres only, in that they can now join the list of essential businesses and reopen with appropriate measures from Wednesday. It might seem reasonable for marinas to be allowed to reopen like garden centres, but they are vastly different places and until the government says otherwise, they are closed.

It doesn't matter whether the caravan park or marina have people who live their all year around as their primary residence, they are still closed to all other berth holders and visitors and as per the link above special exemption is made only to those who's primary residence is a caravan park or marina.

1 hour ago, SwanR said:

By the way ... not all caravan parks are like Haven. Some people live most of the year on the one where our caravan is. No facilities, no barriers to get through. We could easily drive there and self-isolate with no need to be in contact with anyone. The walks would be wonderful on the coast compared to wandering around the housing estate where we live. But until we are allowed to stay overnight we consider it an unreasonable distance even though we could easily do a return trip in a day. We’ve all got to be patient in these extreme circumstances and help to save lives. 

SwanR Please see the above. It doesn't matter whether the park or marina is within daily driving distance and you don't intend staying over night. Unless it is your primary residence it is closed to you. Most parks and caravan parks, maybe not all, will have some onsite facilities. Shower block, toilets, maybe a shop. These could all pose a risk. Additionally as an exception has been made for people whose primary residence is a caravan park or marina, is it fair for day visitors to visit their boat or caravan and possibly spread the virus to the residents?

24 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

Exactly, you was suggesting some can whereas I understand the ruling to mean exercise in outdoor public places only.

Fred 

The new guidance means you can visit places such as beaches to sunbathe, or parks to just sit and read. It doesn't have to be for exercise from Wednesday.

1 hour ago, JennyMorgan said:

No firm guidance, yet. It does seem to me that day-boating will be acceptable, at least we can hope so. Will folk in general use their common sense in the event that that is the case?

The Broads and rivers are not closed. It is not a BA decision. It comes down to whether you can gain access to your boat i.e. is it within a closed marina. If on a riverbank or private mooring then you can access your boat. The rivers are not closed therefore you should be able to use your boat. As per the new guidance from Wednesday any trip must be completed within the day and you return to your primary residence at the end of the day.

1 hour ago, JennyMorgan said:

Sounds like a simple ask is all that is required, a common courtesy & I wouldn't have thought it would be unreasonably refused. Just maintain social distancing, what could be more simple? .

Private marinas have been told to close. If you ask them all they can give you is the current government position. Common courtesy to ask yes, but they can only give you the official line. Now if there are no barriers and you don't ask, and they turn a blind eye then that I would suggest is another thing. Most marinas do not have planning for, or give permission for residential berths, but we all know they exist in many places unofficially with a blind eye turned.

Remember this whole situation with marinas started by British Marine asking and getting an answer. Not the one that any off us wanted, but they cannot now unask the question, all they can do is lobby for why, like garden centres, their businesses warrant an exception to the above list of businesses that should remain closed.

[vanessan]

51 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

Exactly, you was suggesting some can whereas I understand the ruling to mean exercise in outdoor public places only.

I think ECIPA has summed it up quite well. Marinas and suchlike remain closed but if your boat is at the bottom of your garden or moored somewhere like Langley Dyke or in any other of the numerous Broads dykes, it appears that if you want to go and sit on it and picnic or sunbathe, from tomorrow you can. I believe that’s right?

BA should be updating their guidance later today.

[Bytheriver]

Some possibly good news on BA FB page from last evening - at least they are asking the question today  https://www.facebook.com/BroadsAuthority