Safety On And Around The Water

[CliveEdwards]

                                             

The Merchant Navy Association Boat Club would welcome new associate members with an interest in contribution to our WaterWatch initiative whether they prefer to participate whist on the water or from the shore - or indeed both!  You can find out more from the contacts below or by going to www.seafarersafloat.com.  or www,MNA.org.uk 

Commodore: Clive Edwards, 19 Horsford Street, Weymouth, Dorset DT4 8UH

Tel 01305 781725, email commodore@seafarersafloat.uk

 

Merchant Navy Association Boat Club to launch  “WaterWatch”

 

Following the formation of the partnership between the Merchant Navy Association (MNA) and the RNLI last autumn to promote the RNLI#s Respect the Water Campaign on the UK’s inland waterways the RNLI has recently re-branded its former Community Safety operations as “Water Safety”    

For some years the MNA Boat Club has operated a scheme to promote maritime safety under the brand name “SeaVue” whereby Boat Club members undertake to act as watchkeepers afloat to “Spot, Plot, and Report” incidents, potential incidents and hazards whenever they go afloat and to alert the Coastguard accordingly, in a manner very similar to the National Coastwatch (NCI) operating from their fifty or more look-outs around the coast

Given the involvement the MNA Boat Club now has with the RNLI in respect of promoting the Respect the Water campaign on inland waterways the Boat Club is now in the process of launching its  “MNA WaterWatch” scheme whereby MNA Boat Club members will undertake the same “Spot, Plot and Report” activities in respect of the UK’s inland waterways, including rivers, canals, lakes and the Broads. Initially the MNA WaterWatch scheme will be launched as a “pilot scheme” in their East Anglian region

The MNA’s WaterWatch members will operate both from their own boats and/or from ashore by means of ad-hoc patrols and will of course report to the relevant waterway authority rather than to HM Coastguard unless the incident is in an area such as a major tidal river or estuary. In some cases it may also be appropriate to report incidents  to the Nautical Institute’s Confidential Hazardous Incident Reporting scheme known as CHIRP

The new MNA WaterWatch scheme is now  featured on the www.seafarersafloat.com website where details of the MNA Boat Club’s various other activities are also to be found

For further information contact Clive Edwards  on 01305 781725 or email commodore@seafarersafloat.com  or Steve Walker (MNA Boat Club East Anglian regional Chairman) on 07769 725434, email wavewalker@btinternet.com

Clive Edwards, 28th May 2020

Press Release May 2020 WaterWatch.doc

[Chelsea14Ian]

Anything that improves safety on or around  water is very worthwhile. 

[JennyMorgan]

Just to remind folk that the Broads Authority provides an excellent service via their 'Broads Control'.

Broads Control

If you want to contact the Broads rangers to report an incident, you can phone Broads Control on 01603 756056, VHF channel 12 or email Broads.control@broads-authority.gov.uk.

Broads Control is manned between the hours of 9am and 6pm during summer, and 9am and 5pm during winter.

Please always phone 999 in case of emergency.

[JennyMorgan]

Safety for dogs too. Blue/green algae can emerge very quickly with hot weather so beware.

Not directly on the Broads but still applicable:

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/politics/dog-owners-urged-to-keep-pets-away-from-river-due-to-algae-1-6677446

[ChrisB]

13 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Safety for dogs too. Blue/green algae can emerge very quickly with hot weather so beware.

Not directly on the Broads but still applicable:

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/politics/dog-owners-urged-to-keep-pets-away-from-river-due-to-algae-1-6677446

It does not do deck shoes any good either. I ruined a pair of waterproof suede leather Dubarrys retrieving fore and aft mudweights in Fleet Dyke. Did not notice untill it had dried. 

[marshman]

It seems to me, with respect, that this is yet another way of diluting the response - how many more differing watch or rescue groups do we need? Is there any real evidence that it will actually add anything to what is already available - or is it just another example of well meaning individuals and associations looking for something to do?

OK that may sound very harsh but we already so many organisations involved in watching, search and rescue, and assisting,  I have lost count! Why not join up with another one - or do people need to be in control of their own "patch"?

As far as I am concerned the system as it now is pretty good - so why try and fix it?

P.S. Dubarrys? It can ruin my old trainers or  Roys Crocs if it likes!!!!!

[ChrisB]

12 minutes ago, marshman said:

 

P.S. Dubarrys? It can ruin my old trainers or  Roys Crocs if it likes!!!!!

It is my biggest "Broads Gripe" unlike sailing at sea you can't stay clean in boat or person.

When I want to get covered in poo and mud I go for a country walk or go shooting.

Mudweights, Goose & Duck poo, grass up to the quay heading full of worm cast and mud and god knows what else at some moorings.

Then there are the "Clean Moorings" usually crushed concrete! Absolutely great for your razor cut footwear and your decks.

I like the crystal waters of the West Country where you can see your chain going down 5 fathoms and the CQR buried in hard sand.

[CliveEdwards]

Good Morning and thanks for your comments  which I understand and to some extent  agree with, particularly as regards the Norfolk Broads (as I was brought up in Cromer and first learned to sail on the Broads)

However in general terms having spent 23 years as a member of HM Coastguard,  a further 5 years as a National Coastwatch station manager and currently  as an RNLI Water Safety Officer  there is quite rightly a serious concern to address the sad fact that some 200+ members of the public lose their lives every year as a result of unintentionally entering the water, and that 70% of these fatalities occur on inland waterways and the RNLI's Respect the Water Campaign aims to reduce this by half within the next three years.

So whilst I agree that there are quite a lot of groups  involved one way or another in activities related to search and rescue as an organisation representing both current and former professional seafarers, coastguards, lifeboat crews etc The Merchant Navy Association are proud to be joining forces with the RNLI in their Respect the Water Campaign with a view to extending it to cover the UK's inland waterways some of which are certainly not as well covered as the Broads are!  I'm attaching a quote from Sir Robin Knox-Johnston who I'm sure you will have heard of which reinforces what I've just said.

I would emphasise that our aim is certainly not to become a Category 1 maritime rescue service, or to set ourselves in competition with other groups who are no doubt doing a good job,  but our aim is to  provide water safety advice and where appropriate to provide  a reporting/alerting service in line with the RNLI's national Respect the Water Campaign and the Nautical Institutes Confidential Hazardous Incident Reporting Programme (CHIRP) all aimed at reducing the number fatalities from drowning around the UK.

Sir Robin Knox-Johnston endorses Merchant Navy Association (MNA) Boat Club  partnership with the RNLI to promote the RNLI’s Respect the Water Campaign on the UK’s inland waterways

“I am really pleased to see the Merchant Navy Association (MNA) Boat Club join forces with the RNLI to reach inland waterway users with safety messaging, helping to raise awareness of the Respect the Water campaign. MNA Boat Club members are former professional seafarers with a wealth of maritime experience and expertise so they are perfectly placed to support the RNLI’s prevention work in non-coastal waters. As a former Merchant Seaman and a Vice President of the RNLI, it’s great to see these two organisations working together to reduce accidental drowning in the UK.”

Sir Robin Knox-Johnston CBE RD*

 

I hope I have clarified our objectives, and if you, or any of the subscribers to the Forum are interested in more information or even interested in getting involved then do please contact me again

 

Yours Aye

 

Clive 

     .

  

 

 

[marshman]

You should try the Thames Estuary for a change then - 3 or 4 miles offshore and all of a sudden she comes the a graceful stop - or rather an abrupt one as you nudge the sand!!

West Country is fine- but who stole the sun?? Try Greece/Turkey!!!!!

[Vaughan]

2 hours ago, marshman said:

- or is it just another example of well meaning individuals and associations looking for something to do?

Like Marshman I suggest, Sir, that your good intentions should be directed elsewhere.  As an ex merchant mariner myself, I cannot see quite what these private patrols that you suggest, have to do with the Merchant Navy.

The Norfolk Broads has one of the finest reputations for safety on inland waterways that I have ever heard of and this has been earned by over 100 years of experience on the part of boatyard businesses, navigation authorities and the pleasure boating public themselves.  I find it a bit sad, frankly, that you seem to think we have all been here waiting for yet another "water watch" to come along and tell us all what we ought to be doing.

No matter what figures you may quote for the number of deaths due to "unintentionally entering the water" they are about as meaningless as the latest virus statistics until you look at them in detail.  I suggest to you (without going into detail) that the vast majority of such deaths on the Broads have not been anything to do with boats and are mostly the result of people staggering out of a pub in the dark and falling in the river.

What we are all trying to do at the moment is to get pleasure boating on the Broads going again through this crisis, and not bog it down with even more regulation.  If you are suggesting a sort of "neighbourhood watch" of your members going around in their private boats (presumably flying a flag) and reporting what they regard as safety issues, I really do not think that would be appropriate.

 

[grendel]

just one thought occurs to me @CliveEdwards, does this scheme have the cognisance and approval of @BroadsAuthority? as they are the authority responsible for the broads?

[CliveEdwards]

Thanks for your response, but I think you may have misunderstood - The MNA Boat Club has operated its previous SeaVue Watchekeepers Afloat scheme for the past five years and more, and we have had at least a couple of members reporting incidents, potential incidents whilst out on their boats and have either assisted or stood by pending the arrival of a Cat 1 responder and we're not suggesting that WaterWatch will change that situation as far as boating activities are concerned. What we're trying to do is to address precisely the problem you highlighted  - namely those members of the public who for whatever reason (and you mentioned one!) unintentionally, or even occasionally intentionally and very ill-advisedly end up in the water

The RNLI have their own Water Safety Teams around the coast addressing exactly the problem that you (and we) have identified but they do not have Water Safety Teams covering inland waterways, and nor are there Coastwatch Stations inland either and we we are seeking to do is to make a start to plugging that gap - as far as the Broads are concerned you and Marshman are undoubtedly correct in saying there are already groups/organisations providing safety cover, at least as far as boating activities are concerned (although in my days on the Broads years ago that wasn't the case) but there are waterways, canals, lakes,  rivers and so on where  there isn't much by way of a  water safety provision. hence our initiative.

We're not planning suddenly to start some major safety operation but  in response to the RNLI's Respect the Water campaign  we#re asking our members to put their vast boating and maritime SAR  experience to good use inland as well as around the coast

To go back to your point about pubs etc an example of what we're actually is to distribute the attached leaflets to pubs and clubs in particular and take the opportunity to distribute other RNLI water safety materials 

 

 

 

 

,  

[JennyMorgan]

I wholeheartedly agree with both Marshman and Vaughan on this one. Diluting what is here could cause confusion and the consequences of that could be fatal. I was a Coastguard Auxiliary for twenty five years, as if that matters a jot. As it is we have the RNLI, Hemsby Broads Rescue, RYA, NSBA, a network of boatyards, the Fire Service and the Broads Authority itself all singing from the same hymn sheet, do we really need yet another vigilante group, however well meaning? After all the safety record on the Broads is pretty good.

Sorry, Clive, but we have seen it all before, butterfly lifeboat men come and go on the Broads. Indeed the RNLI itself had an ILB at Oulton Broad, it didn't prove itself and was eventually stood down, not to be replaced. You may perceive a role for your members on the Broads but, frankly, you will only be duplicating, and perhaps only as a shadow of what is already here. A case of too many cooks spoiling the broth perhaps? 

[ChrisB]

A little light reading from The Coastguard and Maritime Agency

 

Rescue_boat_code_final_rev_5-13_02.07.13-nl.pdf

[grendel]

basically every boater would i am sure at least stop to find out what was needed if they saw another in distress, just last year i stopped and took an inflatable under tow when its engine had died on it, I spotted them waving and went over to see what i could do   now as you probably know, most hire yards say that hire boats should not tow others, but as this was an emergency and this boat was stuck with a dead motor miles from anywhere i took them in tow, taking 2 of the occupants on board (the two non swimmers) and towed them the couple of miles to the wavney river centre. when i mentioned this to the yard on my return, far from being upset they thanked me for assisting someone in distress.

And in my experience most other boaters are the same, they will render assistance where possible, or at the very least make the call for that assistance.

thus my question whether you had notified the broads authority and obtained their consent before starting your campaign, as others have pointed out the Broads is pretty well covered for emergency rescue already. i know when we arrange our forum meets we generally try and get representatives along from the broads authority and the RNLI or the Hemsby team along to give safety chats and instruction, last year it was practicing with the throwing bags to see how far we could throw them, all good practice.

[JennyMorgan]

Clive, with your most recent response,  you are attempting to replicate what already exists. Last year, for example, pubs welcomed demonstrations on rescue techniques for their staff. There is a well established belief among those of us who mess around in small boats, especially on inland waterways, that naval officers (MN & RN) are about as much use on a small boat as a lawn mower, a billiard table and a spirit level, and quite a few other suitable items. I mean no disrespect to your members but their 'vast boating and maritime SAR  experience' may well have little or no relevance on the Broads.  By all means help and support the RNLI, several of us do, but don't try and teach us to suck eggs. A  couple of years ago a pair of gentlemen set themselves up to do pretty much what you are offering to do, they really didn't fit in and eventually they gave up!

[Vaughan]

1 hour ago, CliveEdwards said:

as far as boating activities are concerned (although in my days on the Broads years ago that wasn't the case)

I would certainly take issue with you on that, but we will leave it as "old history"!

I am wondering whether you would be adding anything to what the Norfolk Police (Broadsbeat) are already doing, both on and off the water, by making regular patrols  and offering most helpful and friendly advice to holidaymakers.  This also goes, of course, for the comprehensive team of Broads Authority Rangers' launches as well as the attendants at their public moorings.  Have you been in contact with either the B.A. or Broadsbeat, about your proposals?

Also to mention the many hundreds of Broads private craft whose owners are already members of the RNLI and as such, are constantly alert to the need to keep watch for the safety of others.

I am afraid I still don't see what you are going to add to what is already in place, but it sounds from what you say, that you are going to do it anyway.

 

[Vaughan]

13 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

about as much use on a small boat as a lawn mower, a billiard table and a spirit level,

You forgot the stepladder and the wheelbarrow.     

[vanessan]

I am pretty sure I have seen these posters displayed on the Broads Authority notice boards at their 24 hour moorings. 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

You forgot the stepladder and the wheelbarrow

This is my Stepladder....I never knew my real ladder

[Vaughan]

3 hours ago, CliveEdwards said:

To go back to your point about pubs etc an example of what we're actually is to distribute the attached leaflets to pubs and clubs in particular and take the opportunity to distribute other RNLI water safety materials 

In which case, to get yourself "bedded in" to a new area for your operation, I suggest the Prince of Wales Rd in Norwich, in the early hours of a Saturday or Sunday morning, when the night clubs turn out. Nothing to do with the Broads of course but responsible for a very large part of your overall average drowning statistics.

And if you want to distribute leaflets around there, wear plenty of PPE!

 

[stumpy]

With the greatest possible respect for the original posters intentions this smacks of blazered buffers in well-polished Freemans cruising around shouting at well-lubricated stag parties to put a lifejacket on!

[JennyMorgan]

2 hours ago, Vaughan said:

You forgot the stepladder and the wheelbarrow.     

Now, a wheelbarrow can be useful, ideal for emptying and carting away the empty gin & wine bottles from the bilge, as well as carrying the skipper back to the boat from the pub at closing time. Perhaps a 'rent-a-barrow' scheme would be good for those wanting to cart their holiday tat back to the boat from the revered Lathams! 

[JennyMorgan]

5 hours ago, CliveEdwards said:

(although in my days on the Broads years ago that wasn't the case)

Gosh, Clive, however ancient are you? I've been in, out and on the Broads since I was babe in arms, 74 years ago, and I can assure that there have in that time been the very able River Commissioners, scores more yards than there are today and professional boatmen at all the major centres on the Broads. Not only that there was an influx of ex Wavy Navy & Patrol Service folk keen to get back on their boats. 1950's through to today, at least, has seen no shortage of suitable expertise on the Broads. In the meantime I firmly believe that our local RNLI members do a sterling job and to suggest otherwise is uncalled for. 

[Turnoar]

When I was about 15 me and a mate were whiling away a Friday summers evening rowing out across Hickling Broad after we’d spotted a Martham Javelin which appeared to be and indeed was stuck hard aground on the hard bottom off the point and whom gladly accepted assistance. After various attempts all the rigging  sheets were tied together, rowed over and secured to the nearest channel post, back on board, helm and motor full astern, two pulling on rope, rest of us rocking on shaft side to reduce draft and geronimo... the relief of the skipper culminated in a twenty pound note (each) which reminds me of the episode every time one crosses my palm. Years later a Jenner brother recited a similar episode to me where a yacht of their fleet Force Four (because it only sailed well in a force four!) was stuck in the mud on Hickling and having travelled to the Pleasure Boat to grab a refreshment prior to weighing up the situation were assisted by Stanley Nudd, a local who worked at Woods, who used a similar technique but with the line attached to the top of mast (I was also told by an apprentice of my grandfather about fixing a sprung plank at how hill by similarly heeling the yacht with the main halyard made off on the bank somehow much to the horror of the hirer). Another story I recall is a friend of my grandfathers telling me that he first came to Norfolk on a holiday on a Woods motor cruiser and ran aground on Breydon; my grandfather in capacity as yard foreman personally rescued them on that occasion culminating in a huge sense of gratitude and lifelong friendship, hirerer later becoming owner of a Woods yacht picked by grandad for best timber, first yacht I sailed on and still going strong, and retiring to Potter and Grandad becoming one obsessed with 3M cinefilm etc in retirement which hirerer introduced him to. Moral of the stories are as Grendel and others have indicated there’s generally someone around to help and long may this natural human trait continue. Now here’s a worthy cause which landed outside my house this morning...