Sold up the river ? BA

[Boaters]

From the EDP and the word "Betrayed " used in the news that we did not expect ,shows the regard that is held for Broads users after all that has been said recently regarding the use of our Tolls.The Increase in Tolls and Fuel forgetting other items will mean many of us will find it even harder to pay the costs of boating.This will impact on all aspects of Broads usage IMHO as the reduction in facilities by BA Information Centres etc in a time when we need to attract tourists that are holidaying in this country .I am not sure of all the factsbut there are those of you out there that will have views and it should at least lead to a bit of lively debate and maybe some way of collectively making our feelings felt.

Link to EDP

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/environment ... d_1_812511

[w44nty]

More daylaght robbery by the Government,it now appears our money will be used to prop up the losses in their admin budget.

Unfortunately there is not much we can do about it,its a win win situation for the BA.

What should happen is that everybody hold back on their tolls payment, that way it will hurt them as they will probably have budgeted to use the money early,so if everyone pay late rather than before the date,it might send a message to them.

More people will sadly sell up and look elsewhere for their leisure activities,and in the current climate will probably have to take less than its value to get out of ratrace.

[Guest DAYTONA-BILL]

The ONLY thing these beaurotwatic quangos listen to is direct action against THEM. Something else cuddly Dave Cameron keeps on about is the "Big Society", well, if that`s the case, surely as Broads boat owners, under the "Big Society" rules, you have the rite to take control of the Broads and its funding. When you actually read right into it, the "Big Society" CAN play right into Broads boatowners hands. I`m afraid i don`t have a clue about how to go about this, but surely there must be several highly qualified solicitors or legal experts who own boat on the Broads who can tell you how to go about it. If the local public can take over the running of schools, colleges, hospitals, local government departments etc, then one of those departments must include the BA. As w44nty says above, withold your tolls, i would say for not less than 3 months, and in the mean time, every toll payer should send in a signed letter of intent to take over the day to day running of the Broads, voluntarily, and also put in a request to have ALL outstanding toll monies transfered to the said "voluntary society" I honestly think this is an area that SHOULD be explored. Regards to all .................... Neil.

[Hockham Admiral]

The main problem, as I see it, about withholding tolls is that you can't then use your boat ( for those of us "lucky" enough to own one). If you add up moorings, insurance, maintenance, improvements and cost amortization, them the BA toll is a quite small percentage. In our case nearer 10% than 20%.

So to withhold toll fees is shooting yourself in the foot if you use your boat on a regular basis. I may be cynical but the fact that the toll runs from April to April reinforces this; April, May and June are pretty good months to go boating!

If someone can assure me that you can happily go boating without a licence and fear not prosecution then I will certainly consider the wishes of w44nty and Bill.

[Guest]

The cold reality of the situation is that although some people feel very strongly about this, and would be willing to take "protest" action, the bulk of Toll payers would not (including me). The low response to this thread so far, (compared with other Internet "places" ), would perhaps indicate that.

If a significant number of toll payers withheld their payments, it would merely add to the administration costs of the BA, who could then legitimately claim the extra legal and admin expenses as part of the toll account next year, which we would then all have to pay on top of the inevitable increase.

It does appear that the BA's proposal to partly remove the toll income "ring fence" is wrong, and the various independent Broads Associations and Societies have already published strong objections. I would rather give them my full support via all legal means and their much more informed negotiators.

[w44nty]

You are probably correct with your views Strowager,to most boat owners the Toll Fee represents a small part of their annual costs and therefore most people will bite the bullet and pay up without any problems.

The trouble is with us Brits is we do not make ourselves heard and are always ready to roll over and have our bellies tickled rather than stick out for something that is wrong,with the current climate of everything increasing in costs people just accept it, have their moan ,and get on with it,

I just wonder how much the £1 in our pocket is worth now,you might get about 40p worth of fuel once the duty and taxes are taken out of it,also you have to bear in mind that £1 has already been taxed as part of your income.

[Hockham Admiral]

I just wonder how much the £1 in our pocket is worth now,you might get about 40p worth of fuel once the duty and taxes are taken out of it,also you have to bear in mind that £1 has already been taxed as part of your income.

38p actually!

(45p is Duty and 17p is VAT)

Makes you wonder, don't it?

[w44nty]

38p actually!

(45p is Duty and 17p is VAT)

Makes you wonder, don't it?

Legalised robbery by the government,they are worse than loan sharks.

Why dont they just take every penny we have go,its getting close to it.

[Hockham Admiral]

Legalised robbery by the government,they are worse than loan sharks.

Why dont they just take every penny we have go,its getting close to it.

You obviously don't remember that back in '06 the EU told our government to put the VAT on red diesel up to our then 17.5% rate.

Scotch Brown, then Chancellor of the Exchequer, when questioned in Parliament, told an MP for the Thames Valley that he would never penalise the boating fraternity with this burden....

The next year he just went and added the Road Fuel Duty............

So you can't blame this Government for everything.....

[Boaters]

Reading my current copy of Anglia Afloat which came several days after the announcements but contains comments made before the facts were fully known,has comments from some of the players involved of Piracy,Doomsday,Breach of Trust and much more .Mr P has stated that up to now toll payers have never been asked to pay their way in meeting the costs of the Authorities overheads but we must start paying now Many of you will remember the old days of Colegate when I would Imagine we had many less involved in Administration than in present times .The backlash is apparently being felt by many of those like us who are passionate about the Broads including the various Bodies pushing the Broads cause.On thing that struck me was the comparison that Organizations like councils etc making drastic cut backs in staff and overheads including the sharing of premises and job out sourcing but not it seems at BA ????????? Rant over

[Guest DAYTONA-BILL]

This is what usually happens at publicly funded unelected beautwatic quangos Roy. As i said above, if the "Big Society" DOES actually come in, then toll payers should be able to take over the running of the Broads and rivers. One of the big problems is how to get people MOTIVATED into carrying out any form of direct action. It seems everybody complains about it, but when asked to get together to fight against this sort of thing, they just shy away with lame excuses. Where you see advertised some BA officials "entertaing" dinitaries on some expensive "look what we`re doing to look good excercise" with government officials in tow, Protest extremely loudly, and forcefully, as well as pelting them with rotten eggs or tomatoes. That`s the sort of thing that grabs headlines, and makes the beaurocrats look rightfully embarrased. And before anybody starts saying this sort of thing is a bit fanciful or even too extreme, don`t forget, as history has proved, it`s the sort of thing that has influenced politicians in the past. Unless toll payers are prepared to take such actions, the BA will just keep on taking toll money little piece by little piece, untill there`s NEVER going to be ANY money for navigation purposes, which will result in the Broads eventually silting up and becoming nothing more than a reed marsh so wildlife fanatics can go and watch butterflies etc. That`s MY rant over. Regards to all ..................... Neil.

[Hockham Admiral]

Neil, Hi

If your Norfolk history's up to it you may remember a guy called Robert Kett had similar ideas!

[thirdmate]

There is no doubt that BA are dipping into the toll fee's to maintain the excessive overheads built up in the good years. Regardless of wether it is legal or not.

If more cash is needed can someone tell my why there is no commercial reed harvesting in broadland ? and don't say there is no market as thatchers are having to import reed from Turkey because of the lack of homegrown product. You just have to look at the southern broads and the vast reed beds sitting there. A wasted and sustainable resource.