Broads Tolls protest continues

[Boaters]

More unrest amongst the boating fraternity on the Broads ,whether this is the path to take remains questionable as obviously you will not be able to legally use your boat on the rivers with no toll so could still be visited by toll checkers who will obviously remain on your case,I know that others on here have made suggestions as to what action is possible ,so do you think this could work ??????????

LINK TO EDP

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/broads_boat ... t_1_837108

[Guest DAYTONA-BILL]

Hi Roy, if you consider that the BA get over half their funding from boat tolls, if EVERY boat owner and fleet operator witheld their tolls for 6 months, the BA would be bankrupt overnight. Also, as other people have said, all other publically funded beaurocracy`s have had to make savage cuts, then why have`nt the BA?. Another point raised in the responses to that article, says about the boat owners having the knowhow to get things done by themselves, and using legal methods to get the money instead of it going through the BA`s books, which would nessecitate the BA spending some of it on "administrative charges". It sounds like the Broads boatowners have at long last had enough of the lies and back dealing dished out by this unelected, publically funded, non publically accountable beaurotwatic quango, and although i`m not (yet?) a Broads boat owner, if i could in any way give my support to any direct action, such as this, then i certainly would. Regards ................. Neil.

[wayneakp]

Some people know I have an ongoing run in with BA over tolls policy but I do think we do need the services provided.(notwithstanding that bridge issue)

However if you look back at what you have been paying you will notice tolls have risen over 50% in the last five years. Have the costs of these services risen by that amount?- I doubt it, but if they have then BA are not managing properly - believe me I know all too well the financial pressures of business recently.

A divsersion of the tolls into overheads tells me a lot!

As I have said before Section 31 of the Harbours act makes interesting reading.

rgds

Wayne

[Guest]

if EVERY boat owner and fleet operator withheld their tolls for 6 months, the BA would be bankrupt overnight.

and so would all of the fleet operators, with no hire fees coming in, and 6 months canceled and reneged bookings .

There has been much vociferous "BA bashing" in recent years, condemning everything they stand for and do, with liberal use of the now very popular word "Quango". Yes, tolls have increased by higher percentages than inflation, but how many similar things have not ?

The problem is that now the BA really have taken a step too far, with their misappropriation of toll fees to supplement their general overheads and delay job and cost cutting that similar organisations such as councils have had to face. This is very wrong, so for the first time, staid organisations like the Broads Society and NSBA have openly published strong criticism of the BA's potentially illegal, (and certainly immoral) action.

If only protesters could focus their complaints about the BA on their clear-cut provable transgressions, the BA would have much more difficulty denying them and getting away with it. The more general "BA Bashing" that takes place, the easier it is for them to dismiss the accusations as coming from an uninformed "little" people.

[mbird]

But what is the point of discussing this next month when tolls have to be paid this month? Strikes me as a nothing press release to make it look like they actually give a damn. This should have been discussed in January if it was to have any teeth!

[senator]

Not Necessarily Mark,

Section 31 of the harbours act that Wayne refers to is the right of appeal against unfair or unjust charges.

The Broads Tolls are collected as Harbour dues, the right passed down with the transfer of the Broads from the Great Yarmouth Port Authority.

The Appeal is to the Secretary of State.

With my tolls I have sent a short note stating that I do not agree with the fairness or justness of the tolls on two counts.

1) The Broads Authority is using a portion of the toll money illegally and for reasons other than it is collected

2) No account has been taken or compensation given for the loss of Navigation caused by Somerleyton Bridge last year.

If everyone does this then we can launch a group appeal latter in the year to the Secretary of state.

[diesel falcon]

Slightly off topic but still tolls,

Has anybody heard /know ,if the ba can warn/prosicute you for not having a tolls disc in your mariner? i know they were going for it ,but has it been made law yet?

[mbird]

Not Necessarily Mark,

Section 31 of the harbours act that Wayne refers to is the right of appeal against unfair or unjust charges.

The Broads Tolls are collected as Harbour dues, the right passed down with the transfer of the Broads from the Great Yarmouth Port Authority.

The Appeal is to the Secretary of State.

With my tolls I have sent a short note stating that I do not agree with the fairness or justness of the tolls on two counts.

1) The Broads Authority is using a portion of the toll money illegally and for reasons other than it is collected

2) No account has been taken or compensation given for the loss of Navigation caused by Somerleyton Bridge last year.

If everyone does this then we can launch a group appeal latter in the year to the Secretary of state.

That's fine Ian, but the article states they were discussing witholding tolls, not appealing after they'd paid them. Two totally different things, and can you honestly see any court telling the BA to give money back? They would counter-appeal and waste a heap more of our cash.

[wayneakp]

Slightly off topic but still tolls,

Has anybody heard /know ,if the ba can warn/prosicute you for not having a tolls disc in your mariner? i know they were going for it ,but has it been made law yet?

Hi Trevor

I think you will find that is what they mean by "adjacent waters" so yes - but in my experiance it depends who owns the "adjacent waters"

rgds

Wayne

[Guest]

Slightly off topic but still tolls,

Has anybody heard /know ,if the ba can warn/prosicute you for not having a tolls disc in your mariner? i know they were going for it ,but has it been made law yet?

Yes, it came in with the revised Broads Act that did become law.

If the "adjacent water" contains only boats owned by the landowner, then the toll is not a legal requirement for boats floating on it.

If the boats are owned by someone else, (like every marina), then the toll is legally required. This even means that if someone owned a dyke and let their friends and family moor their boats in it (owned by them), then they would also require a BA license.

[Boaters]

Seems they have us by the short and curlys regarding the time scale where the Tolls are concerned due to the lack of time before renewal.Trouble is if they get away with it this year unchallenged what will be thrown at us next year.

[senator]

If no one paid then I am sure that they would back down but in reality there are not that many militant boat owners so the risk of a CCJ is to great and BA know this.

At least if every one lets them know even in a 2 line complaint that they do not agree with them then it allows some time to arrange a mass appeal that at least may make them think.

[Boaters]

Definitely adding a comment when I pay my tolls this week,at least they will know I am not a Happy Bunny

[wayneakp]

Not being syndical Ian, but do you really think they give a toss ?

[senator]

Not at all Wayne but having to explain to the secretary of state why so many of their customers are not happy might make them think about it next year.

[Antares_9]

Open comment for BA management.

I paid my tolls for about 17 years, then I decided not to pay them any more and haven't paid them for over two years, it hasn't marred my enjoyment of boating one bit, on the contrary, I thought I would loose the "turn up and go" element which simply has not proved to be the case. What it has done is lost you your tolls and the local economy quite a bit. When I say quite a bit I mean not only the usual mooring, fuel, pub and resteraunt spend on almost a weekly basis but six figure sales to boat dealers and subsequent earning when they sold our old boats. I always considered your tolls good value untill you stopped me using what I had actually paid you for, give poor support to your customers (you may want to look up "customer" in OED) and see what they do, they have the final sanction, not you and you are powerless to do anything about it, take care.

Unless that's what you want of course, in which case it's a good strategy.

[Guest]

As two very happy bunnies (why else would you call your ship Binky?) we’ve had much fun on the Broads, and much fun away from the Broads, returned in 2009, sadly away in 2011.

Brundall to sea, too far to do. Anywhere to the south of Somerleyton, too risky.

Vote with your boat. (party fruit's for Ann )

Phil and Carron

[Guest]

Not being syndical Ian, but do you really think they give a toss ?

Not at all Wayne but having to explain to the secretary of state why so many of their customers are not happy might make them think about it next year.

I think (IMVVVHO ) that Wayne is quite right (unfortunately).

The sad reality of the situation is that any "letters of unhappiness" sent to the BA from toll payers will probably never see the light of day again, and certainly not by the Secretary of State. The toll renewal staff are most probably told to just file them, and even then, maybe just in the round container on the floor. If the management is all that it's said to be, I doubt that anyone except the admin assistants opening the envelopes ever see the comments.

[senator]

Missing the point Strowager, Of course the BA will bin them but what it does do is register your dissatisfaction. The thing that will make them think in future would be the appeal against the fairness of the tolls to the Secretary of state, something you have the right to do under the harbours act.

registering your dissatisfaction gives you the right to make that appeal, if enough of us do, preferably as one mass appeal, then they will have to explain themselves to The Secretary of State, something I am sure he/she can't be bothered with but will have to respond to.

[Hockham Admiral]

Registering your dissatisfaction gives you the right to make that appeal, if enough of us do, preferably as one mass appeal, then they will have to explain themselves to The Secretary of State, something I am sure he/she can't be bothered with but will have to respond to.

Just how do we go about doing that, please?

[Guest]

registering your dissatisfaction gives you the right to make that appeal, if enough of us do, preferably as one mass appeal,

Ah, I can understand the "registering" aspect of a mass appeal, but still not any letters sent in with individual toll renewals.

Don't get me wrong, I'm for anything that will highlight this highly objectionable BA action, I just wonder if the energy is better directed to something less easy for them to ignore.

[senator]

Bit like it may harm your defence if you do not mention now something that you subsequently rely on in court.

The appeal is made directly to the secretary of state of which there are apparently 2, will dig out the address for this unless another forumite who is in it's possession would like to add it but maybe it would carry more weight if everyone was to put their name to the same appeal.

[G&A]

Hi,

Just a thought or two.

With the economic climate, any misappropriation of funds is even more distasteful than ever, and so would it not afford a national response of disgust? Can we bring some clout on board in the way of adverse publicity and so any registered dissatisfaction cannot go unnoticed? There is already support of our plight with regards the obstruction of navigation due to bridge problems.........if it was spotlighted widely, then maybe something would be done. Its highly unfair to be constructively criminalised for 1. witholding payment for goods unfit,( albeit partially and intermitantly but unfit nevertheless as we have to pay in advance ) for purpose according to the Sale of Goods Act and 2.witholding payment due to misappropriation of funds by BA.

PJCJ..........party fruit, woop woop!! Wot no dried peas!!

You guys will be sorely missed but luckily will be in our neck of the woods for the odd evening of drinkies!!

[senator]

If enough people are prepared to put there name to the Appeal and it would be nice if that covered all Norfolk broads boating associations and forums, then I am sure the EDP, Motor Boats Monthly, Anglia Afloat and possibly local news would carry it.

All down to numbers.

[DaveS]

I will be sending my renewal in tommorow, and I can assure you that it will be accompanied by a personal letter (my words, and not a copy of someone elses) stating that I am appalled by the actions of the organisation in plundering the Navigation Fund, in order to 'prop up' management shortcomings.

Given the year-on-year above inflation Toll increases, the farce that was the Somerleyton Bridge issue, and now the plundering of the Navigation Fund, if I ever had any respect fo the BA, then that had now been completely obliterated.

It will, I know, be a waste of paper and effort in writing the letter, but it might just make me feel better

Dave