Centre Cockpit Peculiarities

[wooster]

Hi all

Not sure how technical this is ( probably not at all - sorry ) but i didn't know where else to put it.

Anyway, I'm just in the process of buying a centre cockpit Elysian and talking to someone, a thought occurred to me. On a floating pontoon is it going to be tricky to get inside? Do I need to buy a ladder to stick on the side. Should I be looking for a side mooring or even a finger ? Am I making up something to worry about?

Thank you for answering such simple and ignorant questions.

All good wishes 

wooster

[CambridgeCabby]

Am I making up something to worry about?
 

yes , and why concerned about a floating pontoon as surely this would mean your mooring height in relation to pontoon would be constant as opposed to a rising or falling tide causing greater access difficulties 

[Chelsea14Ian]

Its not a problem  at all.

[wooster]

I thought that as you were standing level with the water on a floating pontoon rather than higher ( as on a bank ) it might make the height into the boat pretty high compared with an aft cockpit, the height of which is a few feet lower.

[CambridgeCabby]

Is all dependant on the tides as to relative height to the bank , with a pontoon if you find the boat too high a simple caravan step would suffice 

[Turnoar]

Hmm, just looked at some pics, stern on I would think you’d be ok given the walkable albeit tightrope one foot 🦶 in front of the other side deck so long as you’ve got a handrail to grab on. Worst case you’d do it Mr Bean style passing the lady on the stairs if you missed with both feet!

Alternatively, side on, go in the side Dukes of Hazard style but head first instead maybe depending on the mooring scenario or state of the tide or both.

Recommend a safety ladder regardless, even if you’re not on your own it’s a pain to get out if you do go for an impromptu swim!

[NorfolkNog]

Just wondering which Elysian? If its this one or I think there is a less common 34 foot version. If it is this type, we hired one once. If memory serves it was very easy to nip out of the side, particularly with the canopy down. If I remember rightly there is no rear exit but they are small boats and very easy to handle. If I'm thinking of the wrong boat I do apologise! 

My favourite design is the centre cockpit Alphacraft and although that has a rear door I find it easier and quicker to hop over the side if the canopy is down. 

As others have said mooring on a poontoon is easier because they are at the optimum height. We always try to get on the pontoon at Oulton Broad in winter and it makes life much easier. 

[vanessan]

1 hour ago, wooster said:

I thought that as you were standing level with the water on a floating pontoon rather than higher ( as on a bank ) it might make the height into the boat pretty high compared with an aft cockpit, the height of which is a few feet lower.

Mooring against a pontoon is really no different to mooring against a quay heading or bank. You are not level with the water. We find a caravan step useful at, say, Hardley Mill but find we don’t need it at the Oulton Dyke pontoon moorings. The nice thing about pontoon moorings is not having to worry about adjusting ropes. 

[wooster]

Fair enough. Seems I was off beam. I might consider getting a small safety ladder though as I 'm no spring chicken and the missus isn't very niimble either

[vanessan]

46 minutes ago, wooster said:

Fair enough. Seems I was off beam. I might consider getting a small safety ladder though as I 'm no spring chicken and the missus isn't very niimble either

Nor are we! Thought this might help you get an idea of pontoon mooring, this is at Oulton Dyke (Dutch Tea Gardens).

[Karizma]

Here's what we used this week to get on our boat, which is handy when your 'floating' pontoon doesn't float and you have a high spring tide! Wellies are optional extras .........

[floydraser]

I can recommend one of these, shop around for the best price: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Milenco-MGI-Plastic-Double-Step-Caravan-Motorhome-Camper/271881042230?hash=item3f4d5f7936:g:v84AAOSwoQ5fjJ3F

Note the feet. My boat came with one of the metal caravan steps and the narrow feet kept getting lodged between the planking of the pontoon, making it a bit scary at times.

The one above is stable and there are holes in the feet if you wanted to tie it down for extra security. I also tie-wrapped a couple of empty plastic bottles underneath just in case it falls in.

[wooster]

Thank you all for your advice. Truly, I'm seriously considering a little light aluminium or similar ladder that hooks or attaches over the side in case one of us goes for a swim and can't get in otherwise. It would also solve some of the more extreme situations noted above.

What say you wise men and women of the forum?

 

Something like this 

 

https://www.gaelforcemarine.co.uk/en/GB/Trem-Delta-Boat-Boarding-Ladder---18cm-Top-Bend---4-Step/s-3566-8671.aspx?PartnerID=618&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=UnitedKingdom&gclid=Cj0KCQjwsLWDBhCmARIsAPSL3_1FYFy8c30BYpuKQh1VJCXRnc4G9b1c8SERaDwymZCZjnuh_PTzTykaAgaLEALw_wcB

[wooster]

I realise I'm talking mince because the walkways at the sides of the boat would be where you would stand wherever  wouldn't they? Too dopey today. So the Centre Cockpit would make no difference. Still wondering about the ladders though

[JanetAnne]

Does the Elysian have a decent toe rail to hook this sort of ladder over? If not, there are versions that hook into a bracket fitted to the deck. Far more secure but it would mean the ladder is only useable in one position.

[TheQ]

We have an Elysian 27 Centre Cockpit, i personally don't use a ladder to get in or out, but when we have elderly (80+) relatives visiting , we had a step of about 1 ft high, which we used, really could do with a 2 stepper.

It's not whether is a pontoon , it's how high the boat is above the bank / pontoon. When the water is level with the bank edge , it's a big side to get over..

Also you'll never haul anyone up over the sides from the water it's just too high, a side ladder is definitely needed..

The toe rail is just too shallow to use for the ladder on it's own. I have one but haven't yet found a quick fit way to attach the ladder solidly when needed.

[CambridgeCabby]

7 hours ago, wooster said:

Thank you all for your advice. Truly, I'm seriously considering a little light aluminium or similar ladder that hooks or attaches over the side in case one of us goes for a swim and can't get in otherwise. It would also solve some of the more extreme situations noted above.

What say you wise men and women of the forum?

 

Something like this 

 

https://www.gaelforcemarine.co.uk/en/GB/Trem-Delta-Boat-Boarding-Ladder---18cm-Top-Bend---4-Step/s-3566-8671.aspx?PartnerID=618&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=UnitedKingdom&gclid=Cj0KCQjwsLWDBhCmARIsAPSL3_1FYFy8c30BYpuKQh1VJCXRnc4G9b1c8SERaDwymZCZjnuh_PTzTykaAgaLEALw_wcB

We used one similar to that for stern access on Cerise Lady when we first purchased her , and to be honest it wasn’t very good and was to say the least precarious as it tended to twist a bit when using it , we ended up having a stainless steel ladder fabricated and fixed in place which is much sturdier and safer .

Have you considered having a couple of stainless steps fixed to the side (these can be folding) ?

[wooster]

Yes I might go with the idea of having s inferring simple made up and fitted. The othere idea was one of these  fabric type things. I guess my point about the closing pontoons was that the height of the boat compared to the ground starting point would always be the same so it wouldn't matter about the tide and if not mane things more difficult however they'd be the same for any boat because you'd mainly board by stepping onto the side anyway. It's just the same for all boats using these pontoons. 

 

 

 

 

[annv]

A ladder is no good on the side or stern of a boat unless it has legs to stand out/of from the hull or the steps are very wide you need to be able to put your instep on the rungs also if used to get back out of the water it needs to be at least two foot below the surface to be able to lift your feet up on the lowest rung, steps are much more stable to use as boarding asist's they wont move when you step on them, and a lanyard tied on to the step will stop it blowing away if tied to the rail and not lost. John

[vanessan]

https://www.norwichcamping.co.uk/shop/product/kampa-steel-folding-double-step-2016-4353/

We use these folding steps, ok as long as you have room on board for them when out cruising. Very sturdy and safe.  

 

[PaulN]

If you are considering having steps fabricated to be fitted permanently to the transom, I would recommend folding ones, so that when unfolded the bottom step is below water level. I have always had this type, I have them now on the broads but also on my various offshore yachts.

The reason being, is that if anyone falls in when not moored up or moored on  steep bank, it's night on impossible to recover them without. Just make sure the engine is out of gear or better still switched off, while recovering them.  

[PaulN]

1 hour ago, PaulN said:

If you are considering having steps fabricated to be fitted permanently to the transom, I would recommend folding ones, so that when unfolded the bottom step is below water level. I have always had this type, I have them now on the broads but also on my various offshore yachts.

The reason being, is that if anyone falls in when not moored up or moored on  steep bank, it's night on impossible to recover them without. Just make sure the engine is out of gear or better still switched off, while recovering them.  

In fact no need to get fabricated

https://www.force4.co.uk/item/Force-4/Stainless-Steel-Ladder-with-Plastic-Treads/TD7