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Breydon


craigmc67

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I have to admit that very few hirers are likely to know the iala buoyage system and if they did they are unlikely to quickly work out the upstream/downstream bit as the water can flow different ways there (with the bure ebbing longer than the yare) and having been through that way a few weeks back the missing posts are in just the wrong place to cause confusion as all the bumph says keep between the POSTS with no mention of little floaty things, as you come under the bridge the gap is almost right in front so the between the posts thing could be taken as straight ahead.

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I  think we are starting to over think the solutions to inexperienced hirers, perhaps pay more attention to there demo from the boatyard, read the manual? after seeing the grounded boat yesterday, and it appears he passed under the Breydon Bridge and just turned right and headed north? Quite where he hoped to go is anyones guess.

to me there looked to be sufficient posts in that area so only the hirers of the boat could answer the why’s and wherefores.

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11 minutes ago, grendel said:

sufficient if you know where you are supposed to go, but there are now 4 or 5 posts missing just at that point which leaves a big gap straight ahead from the bridge.

This is a very good point. Most of us here are lucky enough to have made the crossing many times and the posts (sometimes bouys) are a handy reminder that we know to keep our eyes on while traveling a familiar route.

But if it's your first time then you may well fall into one of 2 groups.... those that approach everything with a "how hard can it be" attitude and those who have read it's difficult and are a bit nervous.

Surely as an area highly promoted for tourism BA should endeavour to make it as clear as day where you are supposed to be, even to the point of being a bit irritating for those more experienced. 

Every crew that runs aground and every sensationalist news report loses the area visitors or at the very least stops some holidaymakers from exploring and getting the whole Broads experience.

I know at least one boat owner who has never crossed due to an unfounded fear based on reports like this.

So BA, sort the posts out, put up more info signs and arrows.. do the emergency services, the boatyards and the local economy a favour!

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sufficient if you know where you are supposed to go, but there are now 4 or 5 posts missing just at that point which leaves a big gap straight ahead from the bridge.

That's a very good and important point.  Especially as the small marker buoys are unlikely to be in any hires skippers manuals.  The brand new first timers crossing - It is now understood how they could and do go straight ahead onto the putty.

Methinks the Ba need to get their finger out and put the missing posts in pronto, maybe a few more would not go amiss either.  I've often liked the idea of solar powered Port n Stbd lights being attached to the relevant posts too

Griff

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The missing posts is exactly what I flagged as having been reported earlier on this thread. As someone who finds Barton Broad confusing, and the way the colours change sides halfway round Rockland Broad, I daresay I could get lost on Breydon! :default_rofl:

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Which direction do most get stuck?

I could be over thinking it but if your up north nearly all of the actual Broads the navigation buoys mean little. Barton Broad you can cruise outside of the posts with little pain. 
could the novice just think nothing much will happen?

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It has been alleged that the boat in question was attempting a crossing of Breydon Water at around 22.00, a similar vessel was photographed passing through Great Yarmouth without any lights. Photographs have appeared on other social media platforms. 

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If the posts are confusing or missing on one side look at the other side and stay 30mtr away. Someone once said ( allegedly) “everyone is created equal” except they aren’t. Wishes and wants don’t change reality, it is what it is, inconvenient though that may be for the less challenged. I find that helping works, rather than anything else, sometimes I even get a thank you…

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I suppose next someone will suggest two long chains supported by buoys from Breydon Bridge to the other end - don't worry they would break that and still go aground! The trouble is you are never going to make allowances for some peoples stupidity and/or inability to read the instructions to do as they are asked or rather, think they know better.

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2 hours ago, marshman said:

I suppose next someone will suggest two long chains supported by buoys from Breydon Bridge to the other end - don't worry they would break that and still go aground! The trouble is you are never going to make allowances for some peoples stupidity and/or inability to read the instructions to do as they are asked or rather, think they know better.

Or a fence between the posts or plant some reeds between the posts!!!

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A new cut from Stracey to Berney should be easy enough to dig. One new bridge for the A47 Acle Straight and one for the railway at Berney Arms.

No doubt between BA, the Highways Agency and Network Rail they would ensure 6' 6" clearance at low water though 🙄

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1 hour ago, Ray said:

A new cut from Stracey to Berney should be easy enough to dig. One new bridge for the A47 Acle Straight and one for the railway at Berney Arms.

No doubt between BA, the Highways Agency and Network Rail they would ensure 6' 6" clearance at low water though 🙄

Apart from the height difference between the two rivers would necessitate a lock.

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1 minute ago, BroadAmbition said:

Surely not, if the cut was deep enough a normal rise / fall would be fine

There's also the rail line that runs down the side of the Acle Straight to consider too

Griff

Don't think that it hasn't been looked into since the Victorians, to as late as the 1950's, by better engineers than me.

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It would be the time difference that could cause problems about an hour?

St Olaves is about 1.5 after Yarmouth Yacht Station and Acle 2.5. There could be quite a strong tidal stream through the cut, Without a lock.

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12 hours ago, ChrisB said:

t would be the time difference that could cause problems about an hour?

St Olaves is about 1.5 after Yarmouth Yacht Station and Acle 2.5. There could be quite a strong tidal stream through the cut, Without a lock.

This was one of the main reasons why the scheme never went ahead in the early 60s. There was an ambitious plan to go from Stokesby to Reedham, using the route of Tunstall dyke. It could not have been done without a lock, owing to the tides, but with such flat land, it would have to be pumped. There was also the crossing of 2 roads and 2 railways. Not two difficult for the roads but raising the railways enough to allow navigation under them would have been very much too expensive.

For the same reason, they never connected the Bure onto Breydon at Scaregap Farm, which would have been only a few hundred yards but too difficult!

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19 hours ago, marshman said:

I suppose next someone will suggest two long chains supported by buoys from Breydon Bridge to the other end - don't worry they would break that and still go aground! The trouble is you are never going to make allowances for some peoples stupidity and/or inability to read the instructions to do as they are asked or rather, think they know better.

Most sensible post on this thread...

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The heat has made us all a bit grumpy and cynical lol Not everyone who has an accident is an idiot. We all get things wrong sometimes, even when we know better, not to mention things like inexperience and of course occasionally mechanical failure. Bearing in mind that of course there will always be the odd one that won't be told, it's still not a bad idea to explore ways to make accidents less likely for everyone else.

(This has been today's Zen post from a finally cool boater in his garden with a daft dog and morning cuppa... you're welcome 😁)

 

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6 hours ago, BroadAmbition said:

The heat has made us all a bit grumpy and cynical lol

Well here's just one holding his hand up saying - Not to me it hasn't

However a bit miffed at having to work today

Griff

Dear, Dear, Mr Charles,

Surely you had two weeks in Lowestoft, relaxing with your trotters in the air. Not five minutes ago! 

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Never had any problem on Breydon whatever size boat I took over there. I really do not see how anybody could go aground there if they had any common sense.

Going upstream, green to the starboard (right) red to the port (left) and vice versa going downstream. If a post is missing then look for the next one straight ahead, its not rocket science.

However, if you do go aground for whatever reason, shove the boat in reverse immediately, don't run around in a panic with your hands in the air screaming, get a grip on yourself and engage the brain. Carrying on in the same direction if forward gear trying to steer in forward gear away from the grounding will only push you further onto the mud. When you get off and can moor safely, check the weed filter. Simples!  

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For the experienced Breydon shouldn't create any problems and the experienced would know what to do in a breakdown.

However, the inexperienced, those that haven't read or listened to the guidance and know best will still run aground.  Its been happening for the last 50 years or so, nothing changes - just now we have social media so the world knows before the person aground almost does!

Saying that, many years ago sailing back with friends in convoy from Oulton Regatta, we had a lovely sail down the Waveney and half way across Breydon, we suddenly realised that a violent thunderstorm was imminent (one of those that appear off Yarmouth!).  I can't remember the order but there was rain, thunder and overhead lighting and a terrific squall.  Both yachts had to immediately take action!  So we went head to wind, made for a post, held on, tied on, dropped the sails and masts and sat inside the cabin shaking!  If my memory serves me right, the other yacht in convoy went onto the mud.  No something I would want to do today.

Rain stopped, wind dropped, mast and sails went back up (maybe we outboarded until through Yarmouth) and got back to Potter in one piece in lovely sunshine

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2 hours ago, Popeye said:

Never had any problem on Breydon whatever size boat I took over there. I really do not see how anybody could go aground there if they had any common sense.

Going upstream, green to the starboard (right) red to the port (left) and vice versa going downstream. If a post is missing then look for the next one straight ahead, its not rocket science.

However, if you do go aground for whatever reason, shove the boat in reverse immediately, don't run around in a panic with your hands in the air screaming, get a grip on yourself and engage the brain. Carrying on in the same direction if forward gear trying to steer in forward gear away from the grounding will only push you further onto the mud. When you get off and can moor safely, check the weed filter. Simples!  

I did say the same thing last night but my post got deleted

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