Open Wallet Surgery (maybe)

[Mouldy]

Some interesting reading.  Looks like boating on The Broads could get a chunk more expensive.  We’ll hear soon enough.

Even with a relatively small boat like Norfolk Lady, a 13% increase in tolls will push ours up by around £60.

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[Broads01]

Ooh, not good news. I note the increase in hire vessel fees and introduction of mooring fees at Ranworth and Reedham. The ranger at Ranworth isn't really necessary in my view given tides aren't an issue there. Last time I was there he didn't seem to do a lot.

[grendel]

bit of a change suddenly turning free 24 hour moorings into paid moorings, would this then negate the 24 hour rule? (making mooring at ranworth even more difficult?

[Meantime]

I can see all kind of legal ramifications of charging at Ranworth and Reedham. Yarmouth and Norwich yacht stations are owned by the respective councils and leased to the BA and presumably the mooring fee helps to cover the cost of the lease and the staff. However as I undersatand it, Ranworh mooring was owned by Blakes and at some point given to the BA. Is it ethical, or legal to now start charging for a mooring? Is a ranger needed at Ranworth? Similarly I don't believe Reedham is owned or leased by the BA, so how can they levy a charge? other than to claim it is needed to cover staff costs. I have always managed to moor single handed at Reedham without any help from the ranger, so what would they be attempting to charge me for? Non use of the ranger, or a mooring fee for a piece of land they neither own, or lease.

 

[Smoggy]

They tried to introduce a charge at reedham before and got told to Go Away by the parish council I seem to recall, I don't believe they have the authority to do so.

[BroadAmbition]

Why am I not surprised?

Yet another above inflation increase on Motor boat tolls.  Since we recommissioned 'B.A' in 2007 every year has seen an above inflation rise levied.  The term 'Cash Cow' springs to mind.

As for introducing charges to what have been historically free 24 x Hr moorings, that are already paid for out of tolls this will be the thin edge of the wedge.  More 24 x Hrs moorings set to follow suit with charges in coming years?  Once this starts it'll never be reversed more will follow and of course annual above inflation mooring fees increases will follow as sure as eggs are eggs

Griff

[NeilB]

I don't like being packed in like sardines at Ranworth so usually only stay overnight if I can get an end mooring.  Otherwise I can see the dinghy getting more use for pub / shop visits as mudweighting is free - for now anyway.....

[BrundallNavy]

A certain member on hear might have to take out a second job if they charge at Ranworth 

Get rid of the ranger and keep them free, oh I forgot the rangers are mostly volunteers. 

[MargeandParge]

If they charge at Ranworth I will claim against any wrong decisions the Ranger's make as we suffered damage due to their mooring of a day boat under our bow. So BA make sure that they are professional staff. It will be your obligation. 

Struggling Regards Marge and Parge 

 

[Mouldy]

Link to full report;

https://www.broads-authority.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0023/452309/8-Proposed-draft-budget-and-charges-for-2023-24-in-the-navigation-area-and-adjacent-waters-combined-appendices-12-Jan-2023.pdf?fbclid=IwAR0-056LMKHF-dfAmDAa-NmcF3mXzQYMgswFwd_wGNUQU4JUr7D_DbwXbIk

[Meantime]

We all know that inflation is running high at the moment, however the council tax will be limited to a maximum 5% increase this year, which is below inflation, so councils will have to tighten their belt on how they spend OUR money. Why should the BA be any different?

[SteveO]

Am I right in thinking that the last time BA had a little trouble balancing the books they dispensed with the services of the mooring person at Ranworth? This being the case, there is no earthly justification for introducing a mooring charge other than naked profiteering. 

[ExSurveyor]

1 hour ago, Meantime said:

We all know that inflation is running high at the moment, however the council tax will be limited to a maximum 5% increase this year, which is below inflation, so councils will have to tighten their belt on how they spend OUR money. Why should the BA be any different?

The difference between an elected and accountable council and an unelected and unaccountable Quango.

[Matt]

And charging to moor at Ranworth and Reedham….

 

 

[Mouldy]

3 hours ago, NeilB said:

I don't like being packed in like sardines at Ranworth so usually only stay overnight if I can get an end mooring.  Otherwise I can see the dinghy getting more use for pub / shop visits as mudweighting is free - for now anyway.....

Like us, Neil.  I do like to moor there for a couple of hours during the day, or overnight out of season, but like you, I don’t like the sardine squash.  I wonder what the charge will be for an overnight stay.

Apparently, the details discussed on 12th, will be voted on on 20th January, so objections or other comments should be forwarded to the BA (not that anyone will take any notice!).

Was that cynical?  

[Heron]

In the current situation the country finds itself, 13% across the board on toll charges does not seem to be out of line with other increases.

Food inflation 14%+, my electricity unit charge up between 9% & 10% from 1 January on top of previous rises and another increase due 1 April. It is about what I was expecting and could have been worse.

What does concern me is what cuts the BA will have to make if, as I expect, 13% is not enough bearing in mind the increase has to cover costs round to March 2024.

2024 / 5 might be interesting.

[Vaughan]

12 minutes ago, Heron said:

In the current situation the country finds itself, 13% across the board on toll charges does not seem to be out of line with other increases.

I agree and we would surely be naive not to expect an increase in tolls this year but these other proposals are nothing short of sinister.

What next?  A congestion charge on the Ant?  Or worse, a clean air charge?

I think charging for these moorings would be a drastic mistake - another nail in the coffin of Broads holiday boating.  I am reminded of cities such as Norwich, who have effectively banned the motor car from city centres in favour of cycle lanes and now wonder why all the shops have shut and all the customers have gone out of town.

I believe it's called pricing yourself out of the market.

[Vaughan]

7 hours ago, Vaughan said:

I am reminded of cities such as Norwich, who have effectively banned the motor car from city centres in favour of cycle lanes

By the way, I used that analogy as I feel it is similar to the BA's present delight in promoting paddle-boarding and kayak-ing.  Maybe that's what they want?  Paddle boards don't need moorings, bank maintenance, or dredging!

And if that doesn't generate enough income for "navigation" they can always knuckle under to the "green" pressure of the RSPB and others, to let it all go to "re-wilding".  Long live the beavers and the sea eagles!

Trouble with satire, is that it so often gets too close to the truth.

[SwanR]

I didn’t even know there was a ranger at Ranworth. Never seen anyone there other than one occasion many years ago when someone was noting down the boat numbers. And certainly never been helped to moor by anyone other than fellow boaters. 

[RumPunch]

2 hours ago, Vaughan said:

By the way, I used that analogy as I feel it is similar to the BA's present delight in promoting paddle-boarding and kayak-ing.  Maybe that's what they want?  Paddle boards don't need moorings, bank maintenance, or dredging!

 

Be nice if the the casual paddle boarders pitching up actually knew what a toll was - at least half those I got chatting to locally last year hadn't

No, it's not all ( or canoe users for that matter ) but I reackon as a percentage it's higher than boat users.

[BroadAmbition]

There's another above inflation busting rise in their figures too.  They (The Ba) really do love fleecing their paymasters don't they?

Mooring charges at Gya and Norwich are currently £13 for overnight, they propose to increase them to £16.  Current rate of inflation? - 12 or 13% depending on which source you look at.  The proposed increase? - Yes it's over 23% ! 

Twenty three percent - That's taking the urine even by their own historical standards

During the off season the Ba close both GYA and Norwich berths stating H&S etc as no operatives are in attendance.  Seeing as they are proposing taking Ranworth and Reedham into chargeable venues, are they going to do the same and 'Shut' them during the off season too?  Or will they conveniently revert them to free moorings but remain open as it suits them not to staff them?

A right tub of maggots

Griff

 

[rightsaidfred]

17 hours ago, Meantime said:

I can see all kind of legal ramifications of charging at Ranworth and Reedham. Yarmouth and Norwich yacht stations are owned by the respective councils and leased to the BA and presumably the mooring fee helps to cover the cost of the lease and the staff. However as I undersatand it, Ranworh mooring was owned by Blakes and at some point given to the BA. Is it ethical, or legal to now start charging for a mooring? Is a ranger needed at Ranworth? Similarly I don't believe Reedham is owned or leased by the BA, so how can they levy a charge? other than to claim it is needed to cover staff costs. I have always managed to moor single handed at Reedham without any help from the ranger, so what would they be attempting to charge me for? Non use of the ranger, or a mooring fee for a piece of land they neither own, or lease.

 

Regarding Ranworth I seem to remember something about a covenant in the various passages of ownership to the effect of it being maintained as a free mooring, perhaps someone with a better or longer memory than myself could verify this as it could be an important argument against the proposed charges.

I think the Cator family and local parish council may also  have an interest in preserving the free moorings so maybe this will come to nothing just as Reedham did last time a charge was proposed.

Fred

[Meantime]

49 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

I think the Cator family and local parish council may also  have an interest in preserving the free moorings so maybe this will come to nothing just as Reedham did last time a charge was proposed.

Makes you wonder if we are being played, what the bigger game is? Will the BA find out that they cannot legally charge for mooring in those two locations and lo and behold, it's an excuse to push for more than a 13% increase on the toll.

This forum prides itself on being the friendly forum, but it is at times like this that I really miss those who would also discuss the serious issues with a long and deep knowledge of the subjects. I'm sure Paladine for one would have much to say on this subject, and based upon a good deal of fact and knowledge. 

Sadly, laughing and frivolity doesn't pay the bills!

[oldgregg]

That's how I'd read it too.

Pretty standard negotiating tactic - Propose a lot of change, provoke a bit of outrage and then 'compromise' by offering what had actually been planned all along.

They do it every few years so we need to not pander to it and instead push for what the real agenda is.

On another note, I see that JP is considerably past the usual retirement age for public sector. Perhaps now is the ideal opportunity to 'spend more time with the family' and let someone more talented have a go?

[marshman]

I am not sure but I have a feeling that Ranworth Staithe is owned by the parish.