Ranworth Mooring Fees?

[Chelsea14Ian]

I paid my tolls last week.The news sheet enclosed  said mooring fees at Ranworth were not confirmed. Yet on Facebook  someone  said they are.Does anyone  know if fees are or not in place. 

[unclemike]

just downloaded from broads authority website

[FlyingFortress]

Nothing as of yesterday when I popped in. 

I suspect if they do it then it will be when the disinformation centre opens and NWT and BA start hogging the moorings on their trip boats 😭

[JawsOrca]

They had a job advert on facebook which closed 8th March so perhaps its set for easter time.

[CambridgeCabby]

Although the motion was voted in favour of at the last meeting , afaik , they have not confirmed that a £10 overnight charge has not been approved and passed 

[rightsaidfred]

It was due to start April, at the moment it may well not happen they don't have any staff to man it and it will almost certainly be unlawful and unenforceable to charge on a free public mooring along with Reedham.

Fred

 

[CambridgeCabby]

56 minutes ago, FlyingFortress said:

Nothing as of yesterday when I popped in. 

I suspect if they do it then it will be when the disinformation centre opens and NWT and BA start hogging the moorings on their trip boats 😭

Presumably the Liana will pay the £10 overnight fee , and the Dragonfly will pay at least one load of £3 for a visiting motorised boat ?

[AndyTBoater]

Late to the party on this but I have a question or two*

Are there any time restrictions or definitions of what "overnight" means?

If not, does that mean that I can moor up at, say 4pm, pay my overnight fee and that space is then mine until the following morning?

Could I, therefore pootle off down river until sunset (or later if I wanted - I am a rebel with lights) and come back to find I still have the spot?

If someone moves into my spot whilst I am away and pays their overnight fees then Ranworth are selling the same thing twice? Surely thats not a good/ nice/ legal thing? 

I would assume however, that selling the same thing to 2 people/ boats is fraud of some type? Once you have sold it to me then you are no longer the owner so selling it again to someone else is bad thing.

So if I own it for the night and someone moves in whilst I am out who kicks the new boat off and lets me back in?

Andy

* - I said a question or 2 but it appears that I have put in 6 question marks and have therefore increased my QM usage by 200%. This is way above the current rate of inflation and for that I apologise.

  

 

 

[Chelsea14Ian]

Not confirmed  yet that mooring fees payable  at Ranworth  and Reedham.There are a number of moorings  that have two feeds one overnight  from 4.00pm and one 24 hours.

[floydraser]

1 hour ago, AndyTBoater said:

Late to the party on this but I have a question or two*

Are there any time restrictions or definitions of what "overnight" means?

If not, does that mean that I can moor up at, say 4pm, pay my overnight fee and that space is then mine until the following morning?

Could I, therefore pootle off down river until sunset (or later if I wanted - I am a rebel with lights) and come back to find I still have the spot?

If someone moves into my spot whilst I am away and pays their overnight fees then Ranworth are selling the same thing twice? Surely thats not a good/ nice/ legal thing? 

I would assume however, that selling the same thing to 2 people/ boats is fraud of some type? Once you have sold it to me then you are no longer the owner so selling it again to someone else is bad thing.

So if I own it for the night and someone moves in whilst I am out who kicks the new boat off and lets me back in?

Andy

* - I said a question or 2 but it appears that I have put in 6 question marks and have therefore increased my QM usage by 200%. This is way above the current rate of inflation and for that I apologise.

 

Sounds rather complicated that. I think it would come down to how big and aggressive the other crew are. 

[rightsaidfred]

4 hours ago, AndyTBoater said:

Late to the party on this but I have a question or two*

Are there any time restrictions or definitions of what "overnight" means?

If not, does that mean that I can moor up at, say 4pm, pay my overnight fee and that space is then mine until the following morning?

Could I, therefore pootle off down river until sunset (or later if I wanted - I am a rebel with lights) and come back to find I still have the spot?

If someone moves into my spot whilst I am away and pays their overnight fees then Ranworth are selling the same thing twice? Surely thats not a good/ nice/ legal thing? 

I would assume however, that selling the same thing to 2 people/ boats is fraud of some type? Once you have sold it to me then you are no longer the owner so selling it again to someone else is bad thing.

So if I own it for the night and someone moves in whilst I am out who kicks the new boat off and lets me back in?

Andy

* - I said a question or 2 but it appears that I have put in 6 question marks and have therefore increased my QM usage by 200%. This is way above the current rate of inflation and for that I apologise.

  

 

 

A 24 hour mooring is 24 hours, as for selling twice being illegal so is Reedham where they don`t currently hold a lease and a historical free public quay.

Fred

[CambridgeCabby]

The proposed fee is for overnight mooring as opposed to 24hr moorings , normally this is payable from 17:00 until usually 11:00 the following morning .

If a boat departs the mooring earlier than the 11:00a.m time it is assumed they have vacated the mooring , ie you won’t be able to book/reserve a mooring once you have departed the space it becomes available for “hire” again.

At Oulton YS and Also at Beccles YD we are able to book a mooring , I wonder if this is to be the case at Reedham and Ranworth ?

My feeling is it won’t be , and the above scenario will be applicable 

[Chelsea14Ian]

There is no doubt  that mooring  are at times hard to come by.Is this the answer.I don't think so.I think it will put alot of people  off.The shop,pub visitor centre  and NWT will in my opinion  suffer.

[Vaughan]

34 minutes ago, Chelsea14Ian said:

There is no doubt  that mooring  are at times hard to come by.Is this the answer.I don't think so.I think it will put alot of people  off.The shop,pub visitor centre  and NWT will in my opinion  suffer.

I would agree with you in principle but unfortunately I don't think that will happen at Ranworth, where the BA know full well that they have  a "captive audience".

Surely everyone on a week's holiday in a hire boat will wish to stop overnight at Ranworth?  Equally, most people on passage to the south rivers will end up spending the night at Reedham, while waiting for the tide?  So the holidaymakers will just bite the bullet, and pay the mooring fees.

The BA will then be able to say, in all cynicism, that "look, it made no difference, people are prepared to pay for the facility".  So next year, look out for the same mooring fees on all the other BA moorings, where people are also "prepared to pay".

And it is all being subsidised by our river tolls, folks.

[CambridgeCabby]

We have been told that the mooring fees are to pay for the mooring rangers there .

We do not need rangers assisting in mooring at Ranworth , if he is raising funds just to employ these rangers then where will it stop , I fully agree that this is a very dangerous precedence to set and most certainly seems to be the pre quill to paid for moorings as opposed to free 24 hour moorings .

 

[Davydine]

22 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

Surely everyone on a week's holiday in a hire boat will wish to stop overnight at Ranworth?  Equally, most people on passage to the south rivers will end up spending the night at Reedham, while waiting for the tide?  So the holidaymakers will just bite the bullet, and pay the mooring fees.

 

Just to play devils advocate, when we hire, we tend to moor at Ranworth through the day so that we can take a walk up to the church but we tend not to stay the night, likewise when we travel north to south we tend to skip past Reedham and head up towards Brundall, I appreciate we are probably the exception rather than the norm.

[Vaughan]

2 hours ago, Vaughan said:

 So next year, look out for the same mooring fees on all the other BA moorings, where people are also "prepared to pay".

What I neglected to mention was that, in tourism, you can usually identify the things that people like about their holiday and what attracts them to it.  What you can so often never tell, but wish you knew, is what it was that put them off and stopped them coming back next year.

Something like ten quid to moor at Ranworth could very well tip the scales, and send them somewhere else in future. That is why I think this idea may be a very serious mistake.

[Meantime]

28 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

Something like ten quid to moor at Ranworth could very well tip the scales, and send them somewhere else in future. That is why I think this idea may be a very serious mistake.

I suspect if you've spent £2k to £3k hiring a boat and then budget for eating and drinking out in pubs most days an extra £10 for one or two moorings during the week pales into insignificance over the course of a weeks holiday.

Conversely though if you own your own boat you have a number of upfront quite heavy expenses and after that your boating becomes cheaper pro rata the more you use the boat. If my mooring fees, insurance, toll, maintenance are £4k per year and I only use the boat for 2 weeks per year then I'm paying £2k per week. Use it for 4 weeks and I'm paying £1k per week, and so on. Basically once your annual costs are paid for, then boating actually becomes reasonably cheap.

However if you need to start factoring an extra £10 or £20 every week you use the boat on top of the annual costs, then the balance of boat ownership starts to shift. It already is with the price of diesel, the cost of pump outs and more and more pubs wanting to charge for moorings.

One thing I find with owning a boat is you tend to think, it's paid for, so why holiday elsewhere and pay again, but conversely that means you end up with much less variety in your holiday. There will come a time, and I think it is fast approaching, when I'll sell up and use the money saved to hire a boat for the occasional week on The Broads and spend more time holidaying elsewhere.

That has the knock on effect of the not inconsiderable amount of money spent in The Broads pubs, restaurants and shops, being spent in other counties or even other countries. 

[Broads01]

35 minutes ago, Meantime said:

I suspect if you've spent £2k to £3k hiring a boat and then budget for eating and drinking out in pubs most days an extra £10 for one or two moorings during the week pales into insignificance over the course of a weeks holiday.

I agree in respect of hirers in that position but many hirers are on a budget so mooring charges make a difference.

[Wussername]

The issue I fear is that the mooring fee becomes a grudge payment. Difficult for the layman to justify. A feeling that one is being exploited, taken advantage of. In brief, ripped off especially where it is newly introduced or an established expense which is increased beyond all reasonable expectation.

One is left with the realisation that an authority, an organisation, a company or an individual believes that it is morally and legally entitled to "Give the donkey another whack" without any thought to a person or indeed the consequences of such action to others in particular.

 

[Lulu]

1 hour ago, Meantime said:

However if you need to start factoring an extra £10 or £20 every week you use the boat on top of the annual costs, then the balance of boat ownership starts to shift. It already is with the price of diesel, the cost of pump outs and more and more pubs wanting to charge for moorings.

 

This is basically what I said when I wrote to the BA. We have worked hard to get our boat, we budget  to keep her running but if the future is charging at free moorings, for the large amount of days we use the boat , we won’t be able to afford to pay for the toll and additional daily mooring fees (effectively paying twice) . 

[Vaughan]

55 minutes ago, Meantime said:

I suspect if you've spent £2k to £3k hiring a boat and then budget for eating and drinking out in pubs most days an extra £10 for one or two moorings during the week pales into insignificance over the course of a weeks holiday.

I very much agree with your post above apart from this first paragraph.

I can't think how many times I have stood behind the counter in reception to welcome customers as they arrive for their holiday and watched their faces fall as they find they have all sorts of extras to pay, even after they have paid for an expensive week's hire.

In the case of Crown Blue Line, it was the reason why we started to offer the all inclusive package, so that people could choose to know for sure how much their holiday was going to cost.  Back in the 60's and early 70s on the Broads, part of our marketing strategy was that a boat may seem expensive compared to a cheap package flight to Majorca, but at least once you have hired the boat, you have paid for your whole holiday, with no extras at all except fuel.

In those days we could truly say that - but not now!

I am sorry but in my experience, the more people have paid for a luxury boat, the more they are likely to very much resent being "stung" for ten quid every time they moor up somewhere.

[FlyingFortress]

7 minutes ago, Wussername said:

Give the donkey another whack" without any thought to a

I do like that expression.

Sums it up perfectly for me.👍

I think that my main objection to these increases is that it is not just this year that I have felt that I am being milked by all and sundry. But the ongoing above inflation rises year on year without adding insult to injury by then trying to charge for free moorings. The increase in mooring fees at certain pubs is not an issue personally as I choose not to use them . But once the precedent is set for charging for free moorings then IMHO it will only spread.

 

[FlyingFortress]

Oh and remember it's only a couple of pints of beer. Well for someone on a tight budget that is a couple of pints less in The Maltsers, Ship and Nelson.

Tesco et all must be rubbing their hands in glee

[grendel]

I would still like to see what the rangers reaction would be if you claimed to be a parishoner at ranworth. (due to it being absolutely clear in the title deeds that parishoners cannot be charged).

would you need proof?

would they be allowed to ask for proof?

would they still claim they could charge you?