Toilet Change

[wooster]

Hi, I'm pretty technically ignorant and have been on a learning curver since buying our boat. Please excuse the series of basic questions I'm potsting these days.

My boat is ex-hire, and it has -  I believe -  a toilet sitting on top of the tank. After use you use a lever to slide open a plastic cover and the contents of the bowl fall down. You then close the sliding cover and use a tap to turn on the water which is fed in from a pipe nearby coming ( I assume from the water tank because, as far as I can tell, it isn't river water ) to fill the bowl again.

I wonder if it would be possible/easy/expensive to fit an electric toilet instead. Would I need to start making alterations to the holding tank or anything horrendous?

Thanks again for your patience

[BrundallNavy]

It sounds like you have a “Thunder” box type toilet. If you change to electric you will also need a new holding tank.  You should be able to fit it in the same place and place the new toilet on top but an electric toilet will use a lot more water so you might want to consider a much larger tank sited somewhere else. 

[rightsaidfred]

I have a similar set up and just use the shower head for flushing, it works no hassel and leaves plenty of pennies in the bank, old saying if it works don't mend it

Fred

[Smoggy]

I know the thing is for leccy bogs these days but are you and crew physically OK to work a manual pump?

Not being able to use the loo because the batteries are low is a disaster in my book, and leccy loos are more prone to technical issues than a classic hand pump job (I've had an old rm69 for years in 2 different boats and never had a blockage) and less water use so tank lasts longer between pumpouts.

I Don't get the leccy bog thing, I have to work a manual lever at home to say goodbye to last night's dinner and beer so why expect a button on the boat?

[wooster]

Thank you people for your replies. I'm not that bothered about it being electric but my missus is a bit put off by the gaping chasm affording a direct experience of the holding tank when the toilet's in use. It doesn't hold water to allow for a err.. receiving pool to make the whole thing more pleasant. Maybe if I could sort out that part it might help

 

[ExSurveyor]

I have a drop through thunderbox. Never had a problem with blockages. If it isn't holding water it might be time to change it.

Mine is tank fed via a two stage lever, half move is flush water, full is disposal.

Top tip, close the lid if you don't want to see the contents final journey.

[marshman]

If your rubber seal around the flap is working properly, then to help the missus throw a cup  of water down it and most will remain initially.

I had two on board for nigh on twenty years ( loos that is! ) and had no issues with either - if they pong a bit which they can do, both pump them out more often or keep a roll of cling film handy and seal the bowl before leaving the boat. Get the yard to put plenty of Elsan or similar Blue down  and keep adding it occasionally when in use. The bog window is one I never shut and sealing the bowl when leaving will help. Over the years they cost me nothing except pumpouts, Blue and clingfilm.

But if money is no object then fit and electric one but there is not a lot to go wrong with the drop through.

 Good job she doesn't live out in Holland - there you seem to have to inspect it too before flushing it away!!!

[Mouldy]

1 minute ago, marshman said:

If your rubber seal around the flap is working properly, then to help the missus throw a cup  of water down it and most will remain initially.

I had two on board for nigh on twenty years ( loos that is! ) and had no issues with either - if they pong a bit which they can do, both pump them out more often or keep a roll of cling film handy and seal the bowl before leaving the boat. Get the yard to put plenty of Elsan or similar Blue down  and keep adding it occasionally when in use. The bog window is one I never shut and sealing the bowl when leaving will help. Over the years they cost me nothing except pumpouts, Blue and clingfilm.

But if money is no object then fit and electric one but there is not a lot to go wrong with the drop through.

 Good job she doesn't live out in Holland - there you seem to have to inspect it too before flushing it away!!!

You beat me to it MM.  There are two ‘Traveller’ toilets on Moonlight Shadow.  The seals wear and they then do not hold water in the pan, which allows the smell to escape from the tank.

There is a pink fluid, similar to the blue that is poured in the tank via the pump out point, that can safely be added to the tank from the toilet, which doesn’t damage the seals.

Just suggest to your other half that she doesn’t look down the hole when flushing.  There is little to go wrong with that type of toilet, which is why they were fitted to so many hireboats.

[Smoggy]

[OldBerkshireBoy]

ASAP amongst others stock refurb seal kits for a few toilets of this design. Finding someone to do the refurb for you is another matter.

Aqua Kem blue  is denser than water so adding a spash first before adding water can work and keep the room smelling clean.

[NeilB]

I'd just replace the seals and it should then hold water.  It's fairly easy and there are guides on Youtube, just need a strong stomach!!

Electric toilets are nice but use a lot of water and can be easily blocked, the drop through toilets are virtually impossible to block. 

When installed correctly the flush should be fully automatic when you you press the lever down, you should also be able to add water but leave the bowl closed by lifting the lever up.  A lot of hire yards added a manual push button to operate the water pump as the levers can sometimes stick or the anti syphon can fail which then slowly fills the holding tank.

[ZimbiIV]

I fiited an electric toilet to our 1st boat.

It was noisier and used a lot of water.

On our second boat I refused to fit one! 

If you are not happy (by orders) just fit a new dump through, cheaper and easier.

Promise a new something else instead.

The quote I got 14 years ago was £1500 for fitting a toilet and larger water tank.

We now prefer to hire a non-electric toilet boat.

You enjoyed the input but you do not need to enjoy the output!

paul

 

[wooster]

Thank you all most kindly. Some extremely helpful information there. I particularly like the cling-film idea. The only time I've combined that with toilets was to catch out people at parties Seriously will, do that, though.

Ours has a pipe running up the wall beside it which feeds the water and you need to use a pedal attached to the bowl to open the hatch then turn the water on which has a handle the same as on a seacock valve. I suspect that there's an "industiral" aura about the whole process which is psychologically offputting. If I could buy just a new toilet and stick it where the old one is, and keep the drop-through theme, then that would be much better. I fancy the type that @ExSurveyor has. I feel that not having to go through the two-stage mechanics would make things better. Would this be a feasible idea?

 

[Lulu]

I miss our drop through loo we had on Luna. Wish we had the same type on Mermaid. Nice and easy with a foot lever compared to all this faffing about with the one we have now 

[ExSurveyor]

Mine is a Thetford aquamagic. Very easy to fit. The water valve at the rear leaked after 8 years but was cheap and easy to replace.

[dom]

36 minutes ago, NeilB said:

the drop through toilets are virtually impossible to block.

The flip side of that is people tend to put, or accidentally drop stuff into them which blocks the pump-out side. We used to find all sorts of random stuff in tanks. I once suffered a blockage, removed the pump-out pipe from the deck fitting and had a bread knife drop out of the end. You can just imagine how that got there

We used to have a tap on the end of a hose, with a long bit of copper pipe brazed on, bent to a 90 degree angle with the open end flattened into a nozzle. After the initial pump out, we'd use it to jet wash around the upper inside of the tank before pumping out a second time, which helped keep smells to a minimum. Not sure if yards have anything similar these days?

[rightsaidfred]

41 minutes ago, wooster said:

Thank you all most kindly. Some extremely helpful information there. I particularly like the cling-film idea. The only time I've combined that with toilets was to catch out people at parties Seriously will, do that, though.

Ours has a pipe running up the wall beside it which feeds the water and you need to use a pedal attached to the bowl to open the hatch then turn the water on which has a handle the same as on a seacock valve. I suspect that there's an "industiral" aura about the whole process which is psychologically offputting. If I could buy just a new toilet and stick it where the old one is, and keep the drop-through theme, then that would be much better. I fancy the type that @ExSurveyor has. I feel that not having to go through the two-stage mechanics would make things better. Would this be a feasible idea?

 

You can replace the toilet quite easily or refurbish the seals on the old one, I have done both, Boulters can supply or supply and fit if you don't fancy doing it yourself, if replacing seals I suggest having a pump out first.

Fred  

[Karizma]

Well what a topic, as I've just serviced both of my Sealand Traveler 911 heads on Karizma (we have 2), as one had developed a leak on the vacuum breaker and wasn't holding water in the basin.

Once I'd done the first one, I decided to do the other as I wanted to replace the 'white ball' that rotates when you press the peddle, as it was pitted and didn't look nice.

So a new vacuum breaker and seals on one of them, and new seals and a new white ball (shaft and cartridge) on the other one.

The other thing I managed to do was undo a small plug at the rear of the floor flange and clean out the overflow drain - which hadn't been done since installation by the looks of things.

As others have said, not a nice job to do, especially when you realise there's a 'thin layer of crust' thats accumulated over the years, but after a deep clean, it was strangely satisfying knowing everything is clean, free from previous owners 'deposits' and works well - and should now last for another few years!

Go on, have a go...............you might 'enjoy' it, and you'll get some 'brownie' points from the Mrs 

 

 

[wooster]

That is one clean bog, @Karizma you're inspiring me.

Another isssue for us is that the inlet pipe runs vertically to the right hand side of the toilet and after depressing the pedal you need to turn on a lever to allow water through. If I could change that to make the flush work at the same time as the pedal I'd be happier.  I'm guessing there was some mechanism to allow this originally but at some point this has broken and the yard has just done a botch job to keep it working. Does this sound likely and if so would it be a simple matter of replacing either a part or the whole toilet and connecting up the pipes? ( You can possibly tell I'm no plumber )

Are most toilets "standard" so I could just unbolt the one I had, disconnect the pipes and bolt on a new one, replace the pipes and then get what I want?

[wooster]

39 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

You can replace the toilet quite easily or refurbish the seals on the old one, I have done both, Boulters can supply or supply and fit if you don't fancy doing it yourself, if replacing seals I suggest having a pump out first.

Fred  

I'm assuming this answers my question above? If I did this could I get it so that would both the "ball" thing slides over and the flush happens by depressing the pedal without needing to do anything else?

[ExSurveyor]

A like for like replacement would probably be easier, you may need to adjust the water inlet back to what it was originally but that shouldn't be too difficult.

[Karizma]

1 hour ago, wooster said:

. If I could change that to make the flush work at the same time as the pedal I'd be happier.  I'm guessing there was some mechanism to allow this originally but at some point this has broken and the yard has just done a botch job to keep it working. Does this sound likely and if so would it be a simple matter of replacing either a part or the whole toilet and connecting up the pipes?

do you know the make / model you have? - there should be some markings on the pedestal that tell you the make / model of your toilet - then I'm sure you'll be able to purchase replacement parts to get it working properly - thats what I did with mine.

[Lulu]

And the  bravery award goes to…..  Karizma!  🥇

[rightsaidfred]

7 hours ago, wooster said:

I'm assuming this answers my question above? If I did this could I get it so that would both the "ball" thing slides over and the flush happens by depressing the pedal without needing to do anything else?

As I said before we use the shower head to flush, our system pumped in river water which isn't good so I did away with it, using the shower controls how much you flush and when if that helps.

Fred

[wooster]

9 hours ago, Karizma said:

do you know the make / model you have? - there should be some markings on the pedestal that tell you the make / model of your toilet - then I'm sure you'll be able to purchase replacement parts to get it working properly - thats what I did with mine.

No. I need to have a look when I'm up next week. If I could fix rather than replace that might be easier