Does your boat have a Carbon Monoxide Alarm?

[ExUserGone]

I think the reason why bss only reccomend co detectors is the fact that they can't actually test them without lots of expensive equipment (that we don't want to pay for), my boat passed it's first bss on ventilation as all the vents measured up ok but the previous owner had put 1" polystyrene between roof and wooden headlining blocking the gap between the outer and inner vent covers, I only found out when taking it down to run some wires, it had no lower door ventilation till I put them in so with a family of 4 on board it's probably only that they smoked a lot and opened the windows that they are still alive now (also had unflued gas fridge in cabin with a black soot patch above)

If your boat has vents make sure you can see all the way through them, if they don't line up check the gap is clear, don't just assume....

[ranworthbreeze]

I know Hylander is aware of another carbon monoxide incident on Windermere, a woman and her two children had to go to go to a hospital in lancaster last week with carbon monoxide poisoning after being on a friends boat that had its canopy up with the engine running.

Just a message for everyone to check their installations and to be careful.

Regards

Alan

[DaveS]

I have a Carbon Monoxide detector fitted in the cabin of my boat.

But of course, unlike a smoke detector, there is no easy way of testing it.

I can only assume (hope) that it will work if its ever needed to.

Dave

[Hockham Admiral]

I have a Carbon Monoxide detector fitted in the cabin of my boat.

But of course, unlike a smoke detector, there is no easy way of testing it.

I can only assume (hope) that it will work if its ever needed to.

Dave

Take it out, start your car, put it in exhaust fumes..... QED!

[brandenjg]

You could always buy a pet canary for the boat, it'll sing away and when it stops and drops, you've got a gas leak

Turned out the deaths were caused by a dodgy generator they had on the boat to power a heater.

A week later and more people have died due to bad ventilation aboard. See link http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-22063269

Glad to hear people are buying the alarms but i think knowledge will make the biggest difference. I've avoided a big gas bottle on the boat opting for more blankets when it's cold and a camp stove for cooking on land at moorings. Small gas canisters with auto cut off.

[teadaemon]

You could always buy a pet canary for the boat, it'll sing away and when it stops and drops, you've got a gas leak

Turned out the deaths were caused by a dodgy generator they had on the boat to power a heater.

A week later and more people have died due to bad ventilation aboard. See link http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-22063269

Glad to hear people are buying the alarms but i think knowledge will make the biggest difference. I've avoided a big gas bottle on the boat opting for more blankets when it's cold and a camp stove for cooking on land at moorings. Small gas canisters with auto cut off.

I take it this camping stove is stored in a way that's compliant with the BSS* (and no I don't mean in the boot of the car while the examiner is watching)?

*Basically in a gas locker or other location where any leaking gas will be directed overboard and not into the interior of the boat, like an outboard well.

Personally, I'd avoid the portable gas stove on a boat if at all possible. I've spent two years without a stove on my boat (admittedly we've only daysailed on her so far) because of this, but lucked out last weekend and found a two burner Origo meths stove for £50. Now I just need to extend the galley in order to bolt it down.

[mbird]

I have a Carbon Monoxide detector fitted in the cabin of my boat.

But of course, unlike a smoke detector, there is no easy way of testing it.

I can only assume (hope) that it will work if its ever needed to.

Dave

Dave, the CO detector I bought said in the instructions that a burning incense stick will produce enough CO to test the detectors operation if held close enough.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[brandenjg]

It's stored at home under my bed so i should be alrite. Alot more convenient to use than collecting wood and starting a fire up . I wouldn't use it on the boat as i wouldn't use it in a tent. Common sense is the main approach.

[teadaemon]

It's stored at home under my bed so i should be alrite. Alot more convenient to use than collecting wood and starting a fire up . I wouldn't use it on the boat as i wouldn't use it in a tent. Common sense is the main approach.

That must make it quite hard to use when you're out on the boat, where does it live when you're aboard?

[brandenjg]

The actual cooker would sit somewhere in the front cabin in its case and the gas cans will be in a dry bag next to the fuel tank in the self drain well. Before you say, the dry bag gets folded rather than sealed shut so it keeps the rain out but allows ventilation. I keep my wd, oils etc in it at the moment.

[MBA Marine]

The actual cooker would sit somewhere in the front cabin in its case and the gas cans will be in a dry bag next to the fuel tank in the self drain well. Before you say, the dry bag gets folded rather than sealed shut so it keeps the rain out but allows ventilation. I keep my wd, oils etc in it at the moment.

Tell him you also put a strap over it to secure the gas cans in place! Im over the basin tomorrow but the opposite corner to your vessel (unless yours has moved)

[teadaemon]

The actual cooker would sit somewhere in the front cabin in its case and the gas cans will be in a dry bag next to the fuel tank in the self drain well. Before you say, the dry bag gets folded rather than sealed shut so it keeps the rain out but allows ventilation. I keep my wd, oils etc in it at the moment.

That's compliant with the BSS requirements (providing that the cooker doesn't have a gas canister installed - if it does it should be stored in the self-draining well with the spares).

I've been doing a bit of research into these stoves, and to be honest I'm amazed that they're considered safe to use anywhere. The canisters will fail if they reach a temperature of around 100 degrees C (the sources I found were American and gave a range of 200-225 degrees F), due to expansion of the contents. Some of them are designed in such a way that if they fail they release a relatively controlled stream of gas, producing a ball of flame around the stove that's about 18 inches in diameter and lasts for long enough to set fire to most things in the vicinity of the stove. The ones that don't have that safety feature fail catastrophically, causing what's known as a BLEVE (Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapour Explosion), which is a fireball about 8 feet in diameter, easily capable of causing second degree burns to any exposed skin and setting fire to clothing, etc (I've seen pictures of the aftermath of such an explosion, which caused both of those to occur).

Scarily enough, apparently one of the common causes of the installed canister getting hot enough to fail is using a pan larger than the burner, so that it overhangs the gas canister (like a large frying pan would). From some reports I've seen, it would appear that it only takes 5 or 6 minutes of using the stove in this manner to heat the canister to the point of failure.

This is a subject that has come up recently on a surveyor's discussion board I frequent, as a number of boatbuilders (although not any on the Broads as far as I'm aware) are supplying these portable stoves with new boats in order to get around the requirement for fixed gas systems to comply with the RCD (basically to comply with similar requirements to the BSS). The general consensus of all surveyors who commented was that if we saw one of these stoves on a boat during a survey, we would all be recommending it's removal.

[brandenjg]

It's still there but looking rough with tarps over it until i finish making the new canopy. I'll warn you that theres now 2 horses over the island and a length of rope across the bridge. Once you move the rope they're ready to run over the bridge.

Teadaemon: i know with my gas cans they go really cold to the touch when being used. I can see how a pan would blow it up though as theres an opening to see if the gas can is installed properly, but a large pan would cover the hole and heat the gas can at the point where it plugs into the cooker.

All this aside the op was about carbon monoxide on boats/ enclosed spaces and the fact is that if you run any fuel burning device (cooker, heater, generator) on a boat you need ventilation, professional fitting of the device and an alarm.

[teadaemon]

It's still there but looking rough with tarps over it until i finish making the new canopy. I'll warn you that theres now 2 horses over the island and a length of rope across the bridge. Once you move the rope they're ready to run over the bridge.

Teadaemon: i know with my gas cans they go really cold to the touch when being used. I can see how a pan would blow it up though as theres an opening to see if the gas can is installed properly, but a large pan would cover the hole and heat the gas can at the point where it plugs into the cooker.

All this aside the op was about carbon monoxide on boats/ enclosed spaces and the fact is that if you run any fuel burning device (cooker, heater, generator) on a boat you need ventilation, professional fitting of the device and an alarm.

The gas cans go cold due to evaporative cooling (aka the Kelvin effect).

Even without a hole in the stove, a large pan deflecting hot gases from the burner over the area where the gas canister is will heat it up sufficiently to cause failure (as would placing one in a pan of boiling water, they really don't have to get very hot at all).

Sorry we do seem to have drifted a bit from CO, but to be honest, I don't think there's much to be gained from discussing hazards in isolation. Gas appliances (fixed or portable) bring potential hazards on board in the form of CO, leaking gas, and fire, and all of them are really bad things to have happen on your boat.