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Oh dear! Has the NBF gone belly up again or is it just me?!


MauriceMynah

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I very much doubt that the hosting company is at fault here. It is likely to be providing a standard service which NBF needs to conform to. I suspect that the codebase isn't terribly tidy or compliant. In Mr Tearle's home environment, he had control over the server which meant he could switch on and off various elements in order to make scraggly code work.

 

I may be well off with my assumptions here, but having spent many years coding, I speak with some considerable experience.

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According to Facebook update, NBF will be on the move again to another hopefully more reliable hosting company.

 

All to easy to expect these forums to always be here for our benefit, but we should remember a large amount of time and often money is given for free by the owners and their support network of friends and moderators etc. All credit to the NBN for their support during this period. 

 

To posters such as Reedham I say the following, If I pay for a daily newspaper then I feel I have a right to praise or criticise it. The free weekly paper I just read or put in the bin. I don't see how I have a right to criticise something I got for free!!!!!!!

 

Thanks again NBN and hope NBF is back soon.

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My understanding is that business and individuals both contribute to NBF so I think they do have an obligation to keep the site running. I also run an enthusiasts site(rover800.info) and although I take no payment whatsoever for the hosting or time I spend keeping the site running I still feel it's my duty to keep the site running. After all a lot of people have come to rely on it as a source of information and resource to exchange ideas and information so it would be a little unfair for me not bother and let it die.

Anyway I'm more then happy on NBN and although I think it would be a shame for us to loose the archive of information that NBF provides I am glad that we have an alternative.

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Why do some people become so defensive when someone dares to criticise the NBF? The fact that its meant to be free doesnt mean anything. If the NBF took some notice of atleast some of the criticism aired about it and maybe did something about it, it may well return to being the useful resource it once was.

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I don't see it as "defensive" I just notice a selection of individuals who thoroughly enjoy sticking the knife in at every opportunity. Richard was advised by said people to go to a hosting server. He has, it didn't solve the problems so now they say not the fault of the hosters. Must still be Richards fault.

I have little doubt that when it fails again, the same people will find other ways to blame Richard.

If you don't like Richards forum don't go there, And keep those somewhat vitriolic views to yourselves.

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No names, no packdrill but this is the entire text (so not edited in any way) of a PM I've just received.

"Just to make my position very clear to you JTF, if I have a view and I wish to express it, I will OK."

I can't think why this wasn't said on open forum! I have no objection to anyone disagreeing with my comments, but I'm less keen on PMs being used for this, as I see it as threatening.

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Its not meant in a threatening way. I dont like to see people telling others to keep their views to themselves and Im not getting into a public debate about it, hence the PM. If you dont like what you read then dont read it or comment on it. Its not your place to tell anyone to keep quiet is it JTF? If you dont want people to come back at you when you have told them to shut up , dont put yourself in that position to begin with!

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I don't see it as "defensive" I just notice a selection of individuals who thoroughly enjoy sticking the knife in at every opportunity. Richard was advised by said people to go to a hosting server. He has, it didn't solve the problems so now they say not the fault of the hosters. Must still be Richards fault.

I have little doubt that when it fails again, the same people will find other ways to blame Richard.

If you don't like Richards forum don't go there, And keep those somewhat vitriolic views to yourselves.

 

 

I've always been of the opinion that in the long term, Richard had no option but to shift to hosted webspace.

 

I've never "stuck a knife in him" though, and never would, (or anyone else for that matter).

 

The popularity of the NBF has never waned, so it has the highest activity rate of any Broads forum. So the practicality of hosting it from a private telephone line and stand alone hardware has gradually become completely untenable.

 

Moving to hosted webspace is still the only viable future option, as the running costs and increasing time to repair hardware failure cannot realistically be resolved any other way.

 

The new problems with running the bespoke Coldfusion code on hosted webspace is not a failure of that concept, but a further step along the path to the long term cure. If the task of modifying the code is too great, then possibly it would be better for Richard to bite the bullet and move over to off the peg PHP forum software, which will run with minimal attention and maintenance.

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All seems exceptionally complex to me! Would it not have been possible to archive say the first 5 years of info on a seperare hosted server to make things a bit more managable size wise, would that have helped him carry on using his own hardware?

 

 

Don't worry about it sounding complex, this is fairly "Geeky" stuff, understanding the vagaries of hosting and active website code !

 

 

I don't think that would be much help I'm afraid.

 

The "live" day to day usage with the high number of concurrent users logged in is the cause of the bandwidth capacity and usage costs. The ten tears of archive data and it's storage space probably represents a very small percentage of the total traffic that was being funneled into the single home based telephone line.

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Code either works or it dosen't. This isn't a case of sticking a knife in; it's a fact.

 

So, if the code works on one computer and then fails when you migrate it to another, there are distinct differences between the two, even if they both purport to support the same code.

 

Now, there are various ways of making code work. One way is to tinker with the settings of the computer that is causing a problem with the code and this is perfectly possible if you control that computer. If you don't then you have to look at ways of changing the code so that it will work.

 

Like I said before, this isn't just my view. I've written more than enough code in my time to fully appreciate the issues of migrating software from one machine to another and, invariably, when my code hasn't worked when uploading to a hosted server, it's because my code isn't as perfect as it should be. Ask any programmer and the'll tell you the same.

 

It's a shame that the migration has taken so long, but as Strowager says, it really was the only option if the system was to continue without major changes and loss of archive data. I am certain that the cost savings will be hugely beneficial in the long term and am pleased that NBF can continue on a more solid footing (both technically and, I assume financially).

 

It is also a shame that too many people view criticsm of NBF as negativity for the sake of negativity. Often, criticsm should be viewed openly and seen as an opportunity to change and improve. After many years of battling with the old system, it seems that Mr Tearle has chosen a route that was so obvious to others but for reasons best known to him, he avoided. I hope, for his sake and the future of NBF, that the choice to host it elsewhere was the right one.

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Personally speaking, I do not mind what something is called or how it may look aesthetically it is down to the question ‘does it do the job’?

 

The NBF may not look very ‘web 2.0’ (though frankly we a probably in something like ‘web 7.0 where everything needs to be grey and flat in appearance) but it has, in the main worked.  Above all it has had – and I am sure will continue to have, a large amount of discussions going on.

 

You cannot make all the people happy all the time and If I had made a website and people came along and used it as a place to ‘hang out’ and talk about things to do with the Broads, I would not really consider too much as to how it might look or smoothly it may run – after all, it is not my business and single income stream and so this can be said about the NBF.

 

Richard did not employ somebody to come up with the website, then pay them to keep the content up to date, code working and site live and hosted. He did it alone and got people who were passionate about what began to take off helping out – moderators, contributing to fund the costs of equipment and running the site as it grew and grew.

 

Perhaps its popularity was also its Achilles Heel – as more and more used it, uploaded content more strain was put on the servers and line out ‘to the web’ coupled with a few hacking attempts thrown in to the mix.  Something that began as an interest must have felt to Richard as if had grown into a goliath.

 

This leaves aside anything to do with finance and the most financially savvy way to run a forum. 

 

At the end of the day just like a business, the forum (this included) will live or die by how popular it is and how many people use it.  This is especially so when it is a forum, a place to share, discuss and inform.  Sometimes politics gets involved, other times it is someone’s opinions grate with another’s or plain old not being very nice to others.

 

That happens in real life all the time, and we all accept and deal with it – and so this and the NBF etc will mirror ‘real life’ since it is a canvas that real people come to and post on.  Personally speaking since life has no moderation, I think a forum should be open – look at the mess Google has caused with You Tube trying to ‘clean up’ the comments requiring – forcing – people to use Google + to post a comment and so on. People have not liked it, because people don’t react too well to being told what to do.

 

At the end of the day I am sure many people who a registered users here look at the NBF (and other websites related to the Broads) and post here and there – some may have a particular preference and feel more at home on one site than another, and then you have people who are not registered and just come and look and read.  I think it is good we have people who run such forums – freely to the end user – and only ask for donations for their running costs.

 

Surly it is important that we have places like this regardless of if on a personal level you may agree or not with people on there and what they may say in a discussion – much the same as a pub one person may dislike and not want to go to, another would love and be comfortable in it and with the clientele of it. 

 

A far as I go I am an ‘equal opportunities Forumite’

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Just had to laugh reading Robin's post! I'm an avid reader of what he witters on about both here and on NBF. Like many others, he is an assett to whatever forum he contributes to.

 

He's surpassed himself this time though! Never ever short of five words when one might have done usually. This time Robin, I truly dof my cap to you. That's a really well thought out and balanced view. Well done and thanks!

 

Trevor

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Just had to laugh reading Robin's post! I'm an avid reader of what he witters on about both here and on NBF. Like many others, he is an assett to whatever forum he contributes to.

 

He's surpassed himself this time though! Never ever short of five words when one might have done usually. This time Robin, I truly dof my cap to you. That's a really well thought out and balanced view. Well done and thanks!

 

Trevor

Vet,

I was looking for the accompanying video

:Stinky

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I can see from this that the NBF certainly has its critics, but I feel a great deal of sympathy towards Richard for the trials and tribulations he is going through, he must feel like ripping his ample head of hair out.  I noticed that the NBF was up and again today and then off again the frustration he must feel at times would be overwhelming I would think.  I have been having computer troubles lately and have been described as a dinasour by my wife ( i think she means in every sense, probably right :wacko: ) as I try to sort them out.  This laptop has come very close to ending up in the grey wheelie bin.  So good luck Richard I hope you get it all sorted. :)

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Dont use the forum anymore due to a handfull of over opinionated posters who feel they have the final say on what happens on the forum and what goes on and who holidays on the broads. Although supposedly a free forum theres plenty of tin rattling going on and then the clique squabbling to post whos made the biggest donation. Each to there own like someone else mentioned, if you dont like it, vote with your feet. 8000+ members and probably 50 odd properly active members kind of speaks for itself as to how many people are put off from atmosphere on there to be fare though the place is a hive of information

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I think a site should be judged by how many members actually log in more than once, or weekly. As dave says probably nearer 8 thousand of those members might have visited once said or asked what they wanted and forgot all about the site. Have to say I agree with you Dave. I heard sheep noises eminating from my speakers each time I visited the site!. Maybe I just have a faulty sound card! But each to there own and it is still a wealth of information.

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