plug sockets

[andyhesford]

we have hired antigua which is 240v does anybody know how many sockets are on boad and do 240v boats also have 12v cig lighter sockets also,we are taking an elecky cool box took it last year on madiera which is a 12v boat worked great it comes with both 3 pin and cig lighter plugs,any info would be great thanks less than 160 days and counting.

[BroadScot]

Hi Andy,

 

I would guess its a 240v Inverter but may have shore lead? I had the dual chill box and it worked off the 12v cigar lighter in my car,. But, I would check with the boatyard first. The boats are fitted now with electric fridges and IMO are a bit bigger than the old gas ones were.

 

As in all electrical items check with the boatyard first, best to be safe than sorry after the event?

 

Iain.

[Oddfellow]

In most cases, inverters on hire boats are not pure sine wave units and are therefore incompatible with some items. Hair Straighteners are commonly damaged by these non-pure sinewave power forms.

 

If the boat has an inverter, you need to think about the amount of work that the inverter does to produce 240volts AC from a 12v DC source.

 

Going from 14v AC from the alternator to DC is a VERY simple circuit to flatten (regulate)  the alternating waveform.

 

However, making a flat waveform turn on and off at 50Htz is not at all easy and then to boost the 12volts 20 times over to 240v is very complicated too.

 

Hence, just switching on an inverter and not plugging anything in will drain your batteries.

 

The best advise for an inverter is simple, if you don't need 240v, don't turn it on and turn it off the moment you have finished with it. Also, don't turn the fridge to max - dead batteries lie ahead if you do (very quickly!)

 

Think about using an inverter to, say, charge your phone.. Your phone wants a 5v DC power supply for charging it. Turn the inverter on, plug in your home charger and connect your phone. Simples. 

 

Now, think about what's actually happening. You're taking a 12v DC power source (the boat's batteries) and boosting this by a factor of 20 to 240v and making it switch on and off 50times a second. You're then getting the phone's charger to regulate the AC current to DC and drop down to just 5v. This is less than the starting voltage of the batteries in the first place and is HUGELY wasteful of battery power.

 

The more power you use, the harder your charging system has to work to replace it; the more fuel you will burn, or the less power you will have.

 

Worse is that people all too often blame the boat and call the boat yard to change batteries which causes delays and stress.

 

If your appliance naturally runs off a 12v ciggy socket, please use it and be careful how much you use it....

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

In my opinion, when people who are new to boating, and have no knowledge of electrics etc, they see a 240v socket, and straight away assume you run anything from it. When on Lightning, we NEVER use the inverter unless it`s a last resort or for the tv. One of the syndicate members has left an electric kettle on board, but i`m concerned that some might try and use it on the inverter, thus flattening the batteries as quick as a flash (i was going to say Lightning, but i did`nt want any comments), because of the sheer amount of power an electric kettle needs. This could cause premature battery failure, or even damage the inverter.

[webntweb]

Neil,

 

I think Lightning's inverter is quite small, I think only 1,000 watts (possibly !,500) and I think the kettle the member put on board is 2,500 watts so the inverter will trip out immediately, so it shouldn't damage it.

 

Roy

[webntweb]

we have hired antigua which is 240v does anybody know how many sockets are on boad and do 240v boats also have 12v cig lighter sockets also,we are taking an elecky cool box took it last year on madiera which is a 12v boat worked great it comes with both 3 pin and cig lighter plugs,any info would be great thanks less than 160 days and counting.

Andy,

 

I don't know anything about Antigua but if the 240v is just through an inverter you have to remember that most electrical items can peak at up to double their stated wattage when first switched on so can trip an inverter which in theory is big enough to handle the item.

 

Our inverter is 1,000 watt but we cannot run our microwave on full power (800w) even on new batteries that are fully charged.

 

Roy

[Matt]

I think ours must be 1500w or possibly 2000w. We can run microwave and Hoover (not at the same time!). Again someone had left an electric kettle and toaster onboard-we just leave them in the cupboard. Only any good on the shorepower but hardly any bother with kettle on the hob!

[LondonRascal]

As to Andy's first question - yes Richardson's 240v boats do still have a 12v accessory socket and as to the provision of 240v sockets, I've yet to see a boat equipped with an inverter from Richardson's that does not have at least two - one in the galley, one in the saloon.  Some even have one in the main cabin too.  These are what I refer to as 'proper 240v boats' that is because some boatyards have boats with inverters, but you only get one double socket usually in the saloon. I refer to these as 'partial 240v boats' and I don't know why I make the difference but there we go.

 

From the point of view of a hirer having the ability to run 240v items is a real boon – but as has been said just because you have the ability to and a socket to use certainly does not mean that it is the same as when at home.

 

I also feel to an extent that some boatyards, like Herbert Woods took the dive into equipping their entire fleet with inverters so their customers could be told ‘yes you can bring a hair dryer’ or ‘yes the games console will be able to be plugged in’ but then the customers finding rather quickly about the physics of storing power – there is only so much available before it is gone and can take rather a long time to put it back into the batteries again.

 

I think the only way you can have a true ‘home like’ system is either by generator or shore power – perhaps to save the cost of inverters and extra batteries that get ‘knackered’ by their use, equipping boats with shore power only may be a solution – you can have the freedom of 240v, just so long as you moor at an electric post.

 

I do feel it is a bit of a lottery when it comes to boats and batteries anyway, having had trouble free few hires after going from Womack Water in the North to Beccles in the south you can imagine my annoyance in the evening when the fridge was trying to run but the batteries were having none of it – and because the fridge was a domestic 240v one it meant the inverter was then beeping ‘low power’ every time the fridge went to run. 

 

Because the fridge had been changed at some point to a different model, the switch to turn off the fridge was not wired in – so you could not turn it off and so followed an evening of beeps before I figured how to isolate the 240v side of things and peace was restored The cause was one of the batteries wired to provide 24v had gone down and sucked those attached to it down too.

[ranworthbreeze]

Hi Robin,

You and your batteries, I am surprised that you do not carry spares just to keep all of your gear running   

 

It is a constant issue on most boats be they on the Broads or elsewhere even if you do not use an inverter we when hiring boats are advided to run for at least 5 hours a day every day.

If you were just on the Northern Broads five hours a day every day for a week would mean covering a lot of the ground over and over again.

 

We have all been moored next to someone on these all electrical appliance boats having to start the engine at "what time o'clock in the morning or evening" just to get a shower or to boil a kettle.

 

Shore power for us every time when possible.

 

Regards

Alan

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

Neil,

 

I think Lightning's inverter is quite small, I think only 1,000 watts (possibly !,500) and I think the kettle the member put on board is 2,500 watts so the inverter will trip out immediately, so it shouldn't damage it.

 

Roy

 

Hi Roy, yes, i would`nt use any of the 240v stuff unless hooked up.

 

In truth, i still think there`s too much reliance on 240v stuf on boats. Yes it`s fine if you can hook up, like we can, but hirecraft should (in my opinion) still be 12v. When we had Maffett cruisers kestrel last year, and their Kingfisher the year before, they still had 12v teles with dvd built in, as well as a usb port and media card slot. So with these tvs readily available, why are yards still fitting 240v units that flatten batteries, which means increased engine usage at peaceful moorings, along with unessecary extra fuel usage, and exhaust fumes in other boats. I think i`l investigate these 12v tvs and see whats available, as i think they would be more beneficial, even on Lightning.

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

Having said that, at least with a 240v hook up, Karen can still use her hair dryer, those 12v ones, although they do work (just), are pretty poor.

[Oddfellow]

We fit 240v inverters because people want to be able to use such devices.
It's not all about the televisions.

 

However, we are always at pains to point out that careless or excessive use of the 240v mains will simply mean it becomes unreliable. It's is there for occasional use, not to be left on permenently.

 

Boats without 240v systems are generally less popular.

[Matt]

I think i`l investigate these 12v tvs and see whats available, as i think they would be more beneficial, even on Lightning.

Do you still have a 12v socket? I think ours is long gone?

Touch wood Thunder had never had a problem with battery power-they are drop tested every year and replaced as necessary.

Matt

[Viking23]

Andy,...

Our inverter is 1,000 watt but we cannot run our microwave on full power (800w) even on new batteries that are fully charged.

 Roy

An 800w microwave is probably describing the output power used for heating the food.

The actual consumption from the supply will be greater than this, a minimum of 1000w and close to 1500w.

There will also be a surge, or starting current, so a much larger inverter is required than the one you have.

In addition, microwaves work better with a sine wave, which can make an inverter very expensive.

You can of course use an electric generator, however if this is petrol powered, then it has to be stored and used in a safe manor, including the storage of petrol, and ventilation for exhaust fumes.

Refilling a hot petrol generator is not without it's risk, from spilled vapours and the high risk of explosion. There was a recent explosion on a boat on the inland waterways recently.

[andyhesford]

thanks everone sorry for not getting back sooner but laptop was on the blink fixed now, I did think they all had 12v sockets but if in doubt ask. 133 days and counting