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BroadAmbition

Broad Ambition - TLC Time Again

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I've just done a 'Robin'  :default_icon_eek:  that is I have gone and done an 'Impulse buy' with no thought or recommends from any third party whatsoever and ordered two of these for the windscreen clearing operation onboard 'B.A'  I wasn't even browsing for them either.  I saw them advertised on FB when I wasn't even looking for them.  Then I went searching on Ebay and Amazon, eventually getting two for just under £20 inc Postage.  Whether they turn out to be effective or any good, we will see :default_rolleyes:

Griff

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-2-IN-1-CERAMIC-HEATER-HOT-COLD-FAN-CAR-PORTABLE-DEFROSTER-DE-ICER-RED-517/323385736309?epid=3012008879&hash=item4b4b4abc75:g:DXQAAOSwX4dbaZp7:rk:10:pf:0

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Not wishing to p1ss on your parade Griff but been there tried that and no it doesn’t work sorry :default_xmas2:

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See?  This is what happens with impulse buys.

Well they are 150w with a fan so how come they didn't work?

Griff

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Sorry Griff tried them, best used for blowing cool air into your face on that one hot summer day.

paul

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image.png.badf8be6f390a5249f5aa8f09f7cccf0.png

I took one of these with us last year and using portable usb power bank it cleared the screen in no time with no heat, I got one from Roys at first £6 but they go for a few squids in Poundshop!.

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I've had a similar one for years now and it works OK but for a better result we just use tea light candles

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Fair enough if that works for you, I'm kinda wary of naked flames onboard (We do use various candles if bbqing on a bank) plus naked flames tend to produce moisture / condensation adding to the issue.  Electric fan heaters produce no condensation that I'm aware of

Griff

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Fog-X

It's Rain-X's mate and works nicely.

 

Then again my mum always cleaned her windows inside with neat vinegar and swore by it for keeping the condensation down on the glass. However, she never has the heating on, preferring a thicker coat, so what's there to condensate? :facepalm:

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Hi Griff I have one similar mines tubular twists and swivels had it over ten years it WORKS a treat it uses a  ten amps so you only want to use when engine running, i don't need it often so i haven't fixed it permanently but keep it in dash pockit, very handy and clears my 3ftx2ft screen nice and clear, can't understand how others dont get theres to work, warm air blown onto damp/wet glass car heaters do exactly the same thing, give it a try  i can't believe it wont work. John

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May sound strange but clean the inside side of the screen with shaving foam 

finny

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The problem is 150w @12v ain't a lot of heat. It was worth a punt but I think a longer term solution comes from the idea of having a matrix fed by the hot water coolant from the engine, that can then be ducted to the wheelhouse but also easily have duck and readily available vent kit on Ebay for cars to flush mount and yet direct warm, dry air up to the screen. 

Another option is to run easier, smaller 'hot water hoses' to units that have a small matrix and fan combo thus easier than the rather larger single matrix with 4 or 5 holes to which you attach ducting. This of course is really easy to think of and discuss but now try finding the space to fit all this in...

A hire boat I had once used a towel rail with lots of small holes drilled through it being sealed at one end and mounted below the windscreen to waft air up from the warm air heating. Suffice t say it did not work but good DIY attempt by the yard.

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By the way, talking of heaters..

Over on Independence My Eberspacher Airtronic D5 packed up a couple of days back now. It is now with Panks in Norwich being sorted (I hope).  I is just over a year since it was installed so it does not make me filled with joy to have an issue with it (it shut down after 15 to 20 minutes of use every time with no cool down cycle but also with no fault codes). This unit minus the installation cost and any ducting etc, was £2,730.00.  (The installed cost was £4,861.97)

I have watched with interest as 'cheap Chinese' heaters have begun to come into use more and more and now are no longer the preserve of Ebay but can now be got delivered free with Amazon Prime and backed up with the easy Amazon returns for... £209.99 This comes with all the other bits, fuel pump, silencer, exhaust, ducting and one outlet etc. The only thing you need to do to make them BBS compliant is not use the nylon fuel pipe they come with (and tank) but replace with appropriate BS rated rubber fuel hose.  But if you are okay to wait and want one sent from China, can be yours for £140.39. Both these are 5Kw versions unlike the video, so a potential saving £2.589.61 to what I paid.

Now I am sure the next thing to consider is 'do you trust them' well so far I would say yeah, because so many are now using these in campers, boats and caravans and speaking well of them online and nobody's gone up in flames. I prefer the look and back up with a warranty of the Planar Heaters (made in Russia) but which have a UK distributor but I found this video having a good old man in a shed show us how they work:

 This is the cheapest style (in the red case) but provides 5Kw of heat. I rather like the idea of using one as a supplemental heat to mean one part of the boat has one and the rest another to cause a more event heat. You can also get a self contained unit for 'outdoor' heating needs so long as you can remove the exhaust  gasses for just under £200.00

 

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Are the units sent from China CE marked? I wonder.

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There's a few more videos on these heaters Robin, I think there was an earlier issue with them but they do seem to working now. There's a few also from intrigued youtubers (whom seem to understand these things) who have stripped them to have a good look at the inners and operation and they do seem to be lacking some parts I think meaning they may die quicker (Meshing, thermometer sensors). Also the exhaust systems will not be safe for marine use out of the box, I believe (although guessing here) they can be made marine use by adding the marine exhaust system as you would find in a marine kit from the main webasto/ebber units although the price will then go up. 

I'm not overly sure I'd trust one yet although they have been around for a few years and do seem to be getting good. As always though it's not only us users/owners who need to happy to use, it's things like the BSS guys and our insurance companies, the latter who will do all they can to get out of a payout and it's this that's then a problem with these, I doubt china will address this and make insurance approved anytime soon sadly. But I guess if you have a cheap boat (like a fishing boat) which is away from BSS waters with only 3rd party insurance and you can monitor it's use and botch it to work then it may work. 

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Depends who you get them from, some are, some are not - I know the most expensive Planar heaters are.

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2 minutes ago, JawsOrca said:

I'm not overly sure I'd trust one yet although they have been around for a few years and do seem to be getting good

I am with you on the Chinese ones simply because with China you either get good or you get bad. There are clones of clones so it is finding the original factory who has the certificates and supply and that can be tricky.  Therefore, if was me I would spend a couple of hundred pounds more, get a Russian made Planar, sold by the UK distributor and backed up with their guarantee  They also supply the correct fuel hose, intake silencer and exhaust 'skin fitting' which the Chinese models do not come with as standard.

At the end of the day, at under £200.00 you can just buy a few and replace when they pack up long before you reach the cost of a 'branded' one.  I have had issues with mine, with limited use within a year and the install was shocking - loose brackets, exhaust pipe not sealed tight, ducting loose and hanging off so I'd not be going mainstream again with one.

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Just now, JawsOrca said:

Of course they have a CE sticker on them ;) 

What you need to do with Chinese stuff is get a copy the certificate - not just a sticker. Many will promote this and be happy to supply to prove they have been certified - those who do not have or are not willing to back up they are - avoid!

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3 minutes ago, LondonRascal said:

I am with you on the Chinese ones simply because with China you either get good or you get bad. There are clones of clones so it is finding the original factory who has the certificates and supply and that can be tricky.  Therefore, if was me I would spend a couple of hundred pounds more, get a Russian made Planar, sold by the UK distributor and backed up with their guarantee  They also supply the correct fuel hose, intake silencer and exhaust 'skin fitting' which the Chinese models do not come with as standard.

At the end of the day, at under £200.00 you can just buy a few and replace when they pack up long before you reach the cost of a 'branded' one.  I have had issues with mine, with limited use within a year and the install was shocking - loose brackets, exhaust pipe not sealed tight, ducting loose and hanging off so I'd not be going mainstream again with one.

I'm sure though Robin that a new weber unit for example is quite cheap compared if you don't need a full kit, I'm sure we had a quote for about £500 just for a unit (Webber Air heater), it's when you need more than just a unit that the components add up and making them compatible for marine use then clearly is where we get robbed. We need to look at sorting one of our dry heaters, we thought of this but I don't think so yet.

As you say though this is a good thing out of china, I think it's too cheap at the moment, but I do suspect and hope we will see a slightly better company take it on and thus be a good offering as these heaters are far too overpriced for this market really. 

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1 hour ago, LondonRascal said:

By the way, talking of heaters..

Over on Independence My Eberspacher Airtronic D5 packed up a couple of days back now. It is now with Panks in Norwich being sorted (I hope).  I is just over a year since it was installed so it does not make me filled with joy to have an issue with it (it shut down after 15 to 20 minutes of use every time with no cool down cycle but also with no fault codes). This unit minus the installation cost and any ducting etc, was £2,730.00.  (The installed cost was £4,861.97)

I have watched with interest as 'cheap Chinese' heaters have begun to come into use more and more and now are no longer the preserve of Ebay but can now be got delivered free with Amazon Prime and backed up with the easy Amazon returns for... £209.99 This comes with all the other bits, fuel pump, silencer, exhaust, ducting and one outlet etc. The only thing you need to do to make them BBS compliant is not use the nylon fuel pipe they come with (and tank) but replace with appropriate BS rated rubber fuel hose.  But if you are okay to wait and want one sent from China, can be yours for £140.39. Both these are 5Kw versions unlike the video, so a potential saving £2.589.61 to what I paid.

Now I am sure the next thing to consider is 'do you trust them' well so far I would say yeah, because so many are now using these in campers, boats and caravans and speaking well of them online and nobody's gone up in flames. I prefer the look and back up with a warranty of the Planar Heaters (made in Russia) but which have a UK distributor but I found this video having a good old man in a shed show us how they work:

 This is the cheapest style (in the red case) but provides 5Kw of heat. I rather like the idea of using one as a supplemental heat to mean one part of the boat has one and the rest another to cause a more event heat. You can also get a self contained unit for 'outdoor' heating needs so long as you can remove the exhaust  gasses for just under £200.00

 

You do seem to have a lot of issues with your boats that you own, and at the end of the day, it does make your wallet a lot lighter. I think the lesson of today is that if you can afford it and you are not too knowledgeable about boats, then you keep the marine engineers employed.

If you are on a budget, learn your boating upkeep skills well!

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6 minutes ago, KaptinKev said:

You do seem to have a lot of issues with your boats that you own, and at the end of the day, it does make your wallet a lot lighter. I think the lesson of today is that if you can afford it and you are not too knowledgeable about boats, then you keep the marine engineers employed.

If you are on a budget, learn your boating upkeep skills well!

I would suggest that there will always be issues with boat maintenance and Robin is regaling this forum with the way he deals with them. I find his experiences fascinating and I am sure that many other members are learning from them. Thank you Robin, for the way that you animate this forum.

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I think the reason for the fans not demisting is because they blow to much air which isn't warm/hot enough my small tubular one blows moderate airflow but quite warm/hot so disperses the condensation and is closer to the glass.  With these small diesel heaters Webasto/Eberspacher i have found is when they go wrong you have to replace half of the heater, when they go wrong, i have had a Webasto water heater loverly pierce of kit lashings of hot water but when it went wrong only a diode i suspect on the circuit board, i couldn't testfix it because it was encased with a strong plastic envelope, to replace the circuit board i had to buy the whole combustion chamber. when i built my present boat i fitted a Hurricane heater from Canada they use them in their log cabins they are larger in size but ALL the components can be replaced individually they can also run on/off cycle like a household boiler without coking up unlike the small Webasto/Eberspacher ones which like to run constantly. they are also more economical with the fuel . John

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As of yet the two impulse buy fan demisters have not arrived so I can’t test them or therefore report back

Griff

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