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TheQ

The Northern Distributer Road AKA Norwich Northern Bypass

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Another accident at the Wroxham / NDR roundabout, there is a section of fencing missing that protects pedestrians from going over the 20ft embankment  into Dobbs Beck. A large section now has police aware tape over a missing bit of fencing, so someone took a flyer..

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I drove the new road a couple of times this year, from Wroxham to Postwick and couldn't see why it should be so much trouble, to a driver with intelligence. Some of the entry and exit roads are rather sharp corners and I am not sure I could get a 40 ton arctic round them without having to encroach on the lane beside me.

I can't see that choosing the correct lane for the exit that you intend to take, should be any problem at all. You've only got to read the Highway Code!

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4 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I drove the new road a couple of times this year, from Wroxham to Postwick and couldn't see why it should be so much trouble, to a driver with intelligence. Some of the entry and exit roads are rather sharp corners and I am not sure I could get a 40 ton arctic round them without having to encroach on the lane beside me.

I can't see that choosing the correct lane for the exit that you intend to take, should be any problem at all. You've only got to read the Highway Code!

Now therin lies the rub, assuming that some of the drivers out there have intelligence and use it.

after all we have seen drivers try and drive along the railway tracks at a level crossing because their sat nav told them to.

so until this road and its roundabouts appears on all of the sat navs I suppose such accidents are to be expected. after all if the sat nav tells them they are driving across a field, who are they to question if it gets a bit bumpy as they cross the roundabouts.

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17 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

I drove the new road a couple of times this year, from Wroxham to Postwick and couldn't see why it should be so much trouble, to a driver with intelligence. Some of the entry and exit roads are rather sharp corners and I am not sure I could get a 40 ton arctic round them without having to encroach on the lane beside me.

I can't see that choosing the correct lane for the exit that you intend to take, should be any problem at all. You've only got to read the Highway Code!

the highway code doesn't tell you which lane to take, it tells you to read the road signs, sadly this seems to be impossible with some people. not helped by there being no consistancy between all the roundabouts..

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I am sure the last time I saw the Highway Code it had drawings to show you how to approach a roundabout and which lane to adopt - even if there were no lanes marked. Surely you know, when you approach, whether you are going to go straight on, or turn off to the left or right? So maybe it is a lack of consistent signage, that is causing the problem?

I must say, considering the thousands of acres of countryside that they seemed to need to lay waste in order to build the thing, they might have made the roundabouts a lot bigger, with more gentle curves.

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Many roundabout I have been on,

 Have left hand lane left

Right hand lane right,

Right and centre lane straight on.

Most of those on the NDR have left and centre going straight on this means with someone coming on from the right to turn right you can have 3 cars /vehicles, trying to exit into two lanes.

But my personal opinion is the main problem is many of the roundabouts have very tight turns and not consistant.

If you join the NDR from the Coltishall road (heading towards Taverham) it's a simple curve round to the left. if you leave the NDR at that roundabout to head into Norwich (from postwick direction) it's left sharp bend, curve to the right, left sharp bend.

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The earlier versions of the Highway code, at a roundabout with four exits, preferred the left hand lane for the motorist taking the second exit. no signal on entering and signal left on passing first exit. The right hand lane could be used (2 lanes going in) but the left was as I said "preferred".

Has that changed?

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The problem at most roundabouts is that people have forgotten how to turn the steering wheel! There is a medium size roundabout near me with a left hand exit and a straight ahead exit, but no right hand exit. There are two lanes onto the roundabout and two lanes around the roundabout. The straight ahead exit has two lanes of the roundabout. The left lane can be used for turning left or going straight ahead. The right lane for going straight ahead. So many people who are planning on turning left straddle both lanes on approach and on the roundabout. Or if traffic has given way and there is now a car in both lanes, it is not uncommon for the car in the left lane to simply enter the roundabout and cross both lanes and then turn left off the roundabout, (as if turning left at a junction) forcing the car in the right lane into the roundabout. Rather than entering the roundabout, following their own lane, then turning left off the roundabout. Yes it means moving that thing between their hands a little bit more, and following a lane, but it allows two cars to use the roundabout at the same time, rather than one lazy driver taking both lanes.

Near where I live there is a ninety degree bend in the road. It is a 30mph limit road, and again people seem to find it impossible to steer round the corner on their own side of the road. Slow down, turn the wheel a bit more and stick to your lane. 

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it also means exercising the thing between their ears too.

we used to live in a house on the apex of a right hand bend (the first bend in an s bend) there was a substation in the corner of our garden, and many a night the screech of brakes followed by a crump noise was heard and many a morning fresh damage was found on the sleepers positioned either side of the substation gates. you just got used to it.

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Drove along the whole length for first time last Saturday. I thought the roundabouts a little small. I don't know if it was because l'm unfamiliar with the road but the road seemed to slightly rise just before, and then dip into, a couple of the roundabouts giving a false sense of distance. I did like the one with the left hand through lane for going straight on though.

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Rule 184

On approaching a roundabout take notice and act on all the information available to you, including traffic signs, traffic lights and lane markings which direct you into the correct lane. You should

  • use Mirrors – Signal – Manoeuvre at all stages
  • decide as early as possible which exit you need to take
  • give an appropriate signal (see Rule 186, below). Time your signals so as not to confuse other road users
  • get into the correct lane
  • adjust your speed and position to fit in with traffic conditions
  • be aware of the speed and position of all the road users around you.

Rule 185

When reaching the roundabout you should

  • give priority to traffic approaching from your right, unless directed otherwise by signs, road markings or traffic lights
  • check whether road markings allow you to enter the roundabout without giving way. If so, proceed, but still look to the right before joining
  • watch out for all other road users already on the roundabout; be aware they may not be signalling correctly or at all
  • look forward before moving off to make sure traffic in front has moved off.

Rule 185: Follow the correct procedure at roundabouts

Rule 185: Follow the correct procedure at roundabouts

Rule 186

Signals and position. When taking the first exit to the left, unless signs or markings indicate otherwise

  • signal left and approach in the left-hand lane
  • keep to the left on the roundabout and continue signalling left to leave.

When taking an exit to the right or going full circle, unless signs or markings indicate otherwise

  • signal right and approach in the right-hand lane
  • keep to the right on the roundabout until you need to change lanes to exit the roundabout
  • signal left after you have passed the exit before the one you want.

When taking any intermediate exit, unless signs or markings indicate otherwise

  • select the appropriate lane on approach to the roundabout
  • you should not normally need to signal on approach
  • stay in this lane until you need to alter course to exit the roundabout
  • signal left after you have passed the exit before the one you want.

When there are more than three lanes at the entrance to a roundabout, use the most appropriate lane on approach and through it.

Rule 187

In all cases watch out for and give plenty of room to

  • pedestrians who may be crossing the approach and exit roads
  • traffic crossing in front of you on the roundabout, especially vehicles intending to leave by the next exit
  • traffic which may be straddling lanes or positioned incorrectly
  • motorcyclists
  • cyclists and horse riders who may stay in the left-hand lane and signal right if they intend to continue round the roundabout. Allow them to do so
  • long vehicles (including those towing trailers). These might have to take a different course or straddle lanes either approaching or on the roundabout because of their length. Watch out for their signals
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Having been down to Oulton and back what cars are missing for turning corners are bow thrusters.

They must be better than turning the wheel by all the sounds we heard.

paul

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I was mud weighted in Ranworth on Saturday when a boat came down into the Broad and did a full circuit of the Broad and left. They didn't turn the wheel once! All you heard was the sound of the bow thruster every 30 seconds or so until they were gone.

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Drove down the  NDR to the A47 on the NDR for the first time over the weekend, although the design of the A47 junction seems wierd, I went both ways without problem

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Interesting - they are putting cones out this morning on the Petans car-park roundabout ( behind the airport ) taking it down to one inside lane each way. Roundabout improvement work ?

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It's interesting that of the four roundabouts I regularly use, two of them now have the cameras on, and one will have reduced speed limits while they do repairs. The fact that the repairs are scheduled to take 3 weeks, shows you the amount of damage caused by the accidents in just 3 months of use.

 I've not spotted all the cameras but certainly they have them on all the approaches, I hope they have some looking at the roundabouts themselves. it's the only way they'll realise having up to 3 lanes of traffic merging into one exit lane over one car length is a recipe for accidents.

Meanwhile they were shoring up the embankment on the Wroxham road roundabout again yesterday, ( on the left as you exit for Wroxham)

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I think one of the biggest problems with the roundabout that are on the NDR has 3 lanes but all the joining roads only have 2, this means you end up in the middle lane and people on the NDR assume you are turning right so pull out in front of you when you want to go straight on.  I have had this happen on many occasions.

 

The postwick roundabout still confuses the hell out of me as the sinage is rubbish causing you to be in the wrong lane.

Edited by brundallNavy
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I absolutely agree with this post, and we have had similar experiences e.g you are in the middle lane to go straight over, someone joins from the left and accelerates on your inside, and you cannot safely leave the roundabout. The person on the left sees no reason to give way, as he/she is in their lane, and there is no give way line. 

I've tried to stay positive about the NDR layout, but on leaving Wroxham to go to Norwich on Tuesday, I was super careful, and found myself again in this situation.  On reflection, 3 lanes on a roundabout now seems crazy. 

I also agree with the Postwick layout also. Very confusing for people. We saw a bit of road rage over this, this morning :-)

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Ok which Bright spark has decided this weather is perfect for planting more trees around the Wroxham road roundabout yesterday, when already many of the fir trees planted along the NDR have died..

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Just about every tree I see has gone brown, We'll see if any survive next year..

Mean time on the Norwich Exit of the roundabout from Wroxham, two cars were stopped yesterday after noon with Side panel damage. Either both were trying to exit and there wasn't enough room due to insuffcient merging length of road, or the inner car tried to exit and the outer car tried to go round the about..

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I just don’t understand people’s mindset with the roundabouts on this road as I use it every day 

every other car that uses the islands go from the first lane then when they reach the islands cut into the 2nd lane or even third to go straight across why!!  

If your in the left lane going straight across stay in the left lane around the island simple

Whilst I agree it’s not the best design it’s mainly down to rubbish driving

John

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Well they've been at it again another car has gone off the embankment at the Wroxham road round about. Managing to go through the police aware tape from the previous one. 

This morning I thought the tape had just broken,  but coming back to night there is a new skid mark from the road centre raised triangle of kerbs across to and through the tapes.. 

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