senator

Just to wrestle this back, the intention was not to start another motor v sail row but to beg that those that choose to sail allow enough room for things to go wrong when heading towards moored boats. I am sure if MoBo's had to tack against the wind then this would not just be aimed at sail and there are plenty of mostly hire MoBo's that pass far too close at speed to our mooring. Plenty of private go through a little fast but they don't tend to be so close. Hire MoBo's maybe way too close but they are heading in the direction of the river so are less likely to hit. Sail are the ones moving side to side, hence when they get too close they are either going to hit with the boat or the boom. Go as close as you like to the bank but if there is a boat there please tack away earlier to give room when things do go wrong.

Sorry to hear you have been hit Poppy but as to the yachtsman hugging the right bank I have to say, if the helm doesn't know what is happening then how is anyone else supposed to? The comment possibly highlights the issue very well. There may be a great skill in hugging a bank to catch a wind that isn't present 20 yards off the bank but, given the mobo has taken avoiding action and decided to pass starboard to starboard what happens when the unpredictable wind dies and the sailing helm decides they want to tack. I would argue that the correct course of action, given there are other river users about, would be for the sailing Helm to give up their secret wind and go back to a more predictable course that means if nothing else at least "he/she" knows where they are going. Different if there are no other boats on the river, if that is the case they can do what they like

Absolutely Iain, This only becomes a problem though when they insist on getting to within inches. If a 3m margin for error was left then I am sure most of the collisions would be removed. We all make mistakes but why turn a mistake into a collision when there is no reason. Different when coming in to moor as there is no alternative but to get close.

Poppy I am talking about moored boats here, how am I supposed to stay a reasonable distance away if I am tied up? Every incident I have recounted has been people who are moored being hit by sailing boats purely because they want to use every inch. Smelly Loo I can see why they would want to but that doesn't make it right, If another tack is needed to stay a safe distance away then it should be taken but where we moor the majority are waiting for the bridge, not trying to make way, there is no reason whatsoever to get close.

There has been much recently about speeding and the effects this has on moored boats and how terrible hirer's are but on the Southern Rivers there seems to be a much more dangerous animal. Why is it that those who choose to boat without an engine also believe themselves to be such masters of the weather that they can get within inches of moored boats and know there will be no gust of wind? Our pontoon neighbour suffered a large amount of damage from a sailing boat while he was moored outside of the Reedcutters on Saturday. We now moor riverside and are constantly subjected to yachts getting within a foot or less of us while milling around waiting for the bridge at Reedham. The person in our space previously was hit on three occasions by Yachts. While mooring anywhere around Coldham Hall it is purely a lottery as to who's boat will get hit. So my plea. You may not worry about damage to your sailing Boat, you may intentionally spend much of your time in reeds, you may be the most skilled yachtsman in the world but please, please, please, have a little respect for other peoples property and stay a reasonable distance away.

Sign at Haven bridge is way to late, if you think the flow through Yarmouth is strong you should try it through Haven Bridge. A diagram at the Helm would help but surely in this day and age you could fit a radio transmitter on the quayside and have a really loud alarm and flashing lights in the boat if you go past it.

Quoted them for the reason I stated in my post, Broads navigation Bye laws are more or less an exact copy of Col Regs and as I said I would be surprised if the lights section had any major differences. Happy to be corrected if that is wrong, are you saying that that is the case?

That would probably be why I stated that col regs do not apply on the broads then Poppy

Have just gained a thruster for the first time in 8 years of boating and it is brilliant. have not had to use it for more than 2 seconds but in that 2 seconds you can change the whole dynamic of the maneuver. to my mind it is more about stopping the bow going where you don't want it to than it is making it go where you do. Fantastic for stern mooring with the wind on the bow, no more bow turning round and messing things up.

Maybe a quantity discount would be a good idea then, our tanks hold 1200 litres and despite owning the boat for less than 6 weeks about 1400 litres have already been used. Couldn't do that ongoing but the chances are most seagoing boats will be taking on 500 litres plus at any one time. if this is repeated 4 times a year it is going to be a really nice meal.

Col Regs Rule 20 Application no other lights shall be exhibited, except such lights as cannot be mistaken for the lights specified in these Rules or do not impair their visibility or distinctive character, or interfere with the keeping of a proper look-out. Not to hand but there are very specific rules and regulations concerning the specification of Nav lights and it most certainly does not include having a light that can illuminate specific objects as this would wreck everyone else's night vision. Col Regs don't actually apply on the Broads but the regulations used are pretty much a direct copy, I would be surprised if they are different when it comes to lights but I may be wrong. There is nothing stopping you using a spot light to identify objects occasionally but you cant have it on constantly, the problem with using it occasionally is that every time you do it will take you 10 minutes to get back your night vision Comparing lights to driving on high and low beam has no relevance whatsoever, in a car all are using lights so you are not ruining someone else's night vision for 10-15 minutes, just blinding them for a couple of seconds. Just try sitting in a dark room for 20 minutes you will find that you can see enough to make out shapes, the idea is not to be able to admire the plumage on the wildfowl but to miss the big shapes. even a small low level white light used to look at a chart could blind you for 5-10 minutes which is why red filters are used to read a chart at night, if struggling for night vision could it be that you are going back and forth into a lit cabin or you are actually sat in a cabin where someone has lights on behind you.

How come Diesel is 20p a litre more on the Broads than on the South coast? I know competition effects the price but 20p a litre is a bit much Hamble was 84p litre last week apparently

I have 250 gallon of storage available to anyone who wishes, I will even move it around so the tax man can't find it, unfortunately a small amount of the stored fuel may be used up in the game of cat and mouse.

Need 493 for a thousand now. Not sure but if it is an e petition I think it requires 10,000 signatures to be guaranteed a reading in Parliament. If that is the agenda then it needs another 9493 so keep sharing.

I signed a few days ago,

petrol is already much more expensive than diesel in the majority of places that supply it so I'm guessing no, especially if they call it MARINE Diesel.

Holland at 100 miles, (112 n/m from ijmuiden 4 weeks ago) would be 224 there and back, at 1 mpg that is 224 gallons, even at £1 per litre that would be £1020, bit much for most on a weekend. The alternative is to move where there are more ports of call in a local area. Brightlingsea for instance has a whole plethora of places to visit within 20 miles. The Harwich area has lots of places to go in economic distance and if you do go to the South coast 10 miles would probably be as far as you went on any weekend. The Broads are unique and provide a great way to use your boat without the uncertainties of coastal work. Big boats on the Southern Broads have fairly good access throughout if the bits that are supposed to work do, it is when the bridges and locks break that the problems start. In the grand scheme of things the toll cost on the Broads is fairly small as a percentage of annual spend for a larger boat, it is the arrogance of certain parties that seem to think they can continue to offer a steadily decreasing level of service while exponentially increasing the charge for it that is the problem. Boating is a hobby and as such most will shrug their shoulders for so long. Once the exodus does start it will be too late to stop it.

I know to a number of boats that are already exiting the Broads and choosing the other side Peter, so he is seriously exploring the point of no return already. The problem for Norfolk is that it can not offer enough cruising for owners from outside of the area without the Broads. Being realistic about fuel costs and usage, if you are running a boat that is returning around 1 mpg at sea and are not one of the mega rich society, who all base their boats on the South Coast anyway, the only real destination reachable in sensible economic range for a weekend is Southwold. Lovely as it is I think a years boating made up of visiting Scroby sands and Southwold is going to get a bit samey for anyone. Packman will not only be starving the Broads but also the local area of the income surrounding what he sees as a cash cow. If only the local MP's could see what he was doing they may start to challenge his empire.

I think there have been a few goes at this, If I remember correctly a company called Challenger were responsible for a lot of Birchwoods 330 and 360 production boats with their syndicate model that was used in Norfolk and Suffolk. Not sure of the reason for failure, it is not necessarily a bad idea just because it goes bust.

The so called Gin palaces are being hit hard by the Broads Authorities inability to manage the navigation. I don't class my boat as a GP, I guess some would but to us it is a family boat that gives us most of the comforts of home within the beauty of the Broads and also the ability to adventure at sea. Unfortunately through a few years of Network Rail bridge failures that the BA decided not to fight as they were too busy taking houseboat owners to court or trying to be a national park and the failure of of Mutford lock for a good part of last year, the start of this and fairly likely the end of this, meaning it is very difficult to get to sea. You have to ask the question. Why would anyone keep a sea going boat on the Broads? why would they pay £500 plus in tolls just to line Packmans Pocket? Why would they support the local economy when they can not go anywhere. Mr Packman and Co. are draining the life out of boating, they are clever enough to start where they get the least resistance but make no bones about it, unless it is made of wood and preferably has no motor, they will be coming for you. Once the boats are gone Sandford can be welcomed into the Broads National park. The Empire will be complete. In the Meantime enjoy it while you can, the south is gorgeous, true it is better suited to high boats that can see over the reeds that line many of the banks but well worth a visit even in the lower stuff, true you will have to go further inbetween the picturesque bits but they are definitely worth it. The north is so Chocolate box I am surprised Cadbury's didn't try and acquire them when they were a British Manufacturer, before they decided to rebrand as the USA.

Ooops, Sorry Mark my post was tongue in cheek, this is a subject that has been lots of times and I appologise to the OP for messing up his thread. Just a hint and hopefully this does not stir the hornets nest but if you are in that situation again, you could always try slowing right down, that way the other boats can pass you safely at a speed that doesnt create a big wash and then get on with what they want to do, if you are doing 6 knots they cant , let them pass at 2 or 3 they can be round and gone without upsetting anyone. No excuse for the overtaking and the trauma you were put through but just something that most people in boats that will not exceed 6 knots would ever think about. Again my post was tongue in cheek and adds nothing to the question originally asked, please ignor

Probably the quickest way is to drop through Mutford lock, if you do it right you can get the lock, the rail bridge and the road bridge all open so that you don't have to hang about too much. The speed limit in Lake loathing is 6 knots and the moored boats on the port side opposite Haven Marina all use Loud Hailers if you go past at more than 3. Do not even think about moving off in the bridge channel until the lights are green to confirm the Bridge is locked and remember to radio for clearance to enter the bridge channel and to proceed to sea. Once out of the Harbour you can open up as fast as you like but don't cut inside the yellow cardinals to port. It is 6 nm to the entrance at Yarmouth so that should be about 15 minutes, then radio in again to Yarmouth and ask permission to enter the harbour. The speed limit in the harbour is 6 knots and there are a number of ships moving around that will sink you without feeling the bump. If you are really lucky you can now get Haven to open for you, you did remember to book the lift giving a minimum of 24 hours notice didn't you? If not or if you were held up for 10 minutes by Lowestoft Road Bridge, or not allowed to leave Lowestoft or Enter Yarmouth due to ship movement, causing you to miss the booked lift, then you can now tie up on town Quay as there is no chance of them lifting the bridge today. Don't worry most of the drunks and druggies are friendly, peeing on your boat is like a handshake to them. Providing you have gotten through you will probably find that someone has put a barrier up to stop any traffic going into the accident area that some refer to as the Northern Broads, I think the barrier is called Vauxhall bridge and it will have taken you between 1 hour 10 minutes and 5 hours, dependent on how well you timed the bridges etc.. Limbo under this barrier at your peril, far better to turn Left, get the nice man in Breydon bridge tower to lift, he will do this at anytime on demand and get back onto the safety of Breydon and the Southern Broads. Quickest way from Oulton Broad to Vauxhall Bridge and also an explanation as to why they should leave the speed limit alone on Breydon so that sea going boats can test their engines instead of just popping out to sea as has been suggested in the past by some. Sorry tongue in cheeck but couldn't resist, may be get back to sensible answers to the OP now

Seem to remember some time ago when the aux/volunteer rangers were being touted that a large number of people were quick to ask what qualifications they had to question the experienced skipper of a private boat. Looks like there are lots of newly qualified Nav Rangers about now but I would seriously question there ability to tell me as a skipper what to do with my vessel. Maybe a great opportunity to re form the home guard?

MM your observations are 100% correct. A wash running with the current at 6mph will actually be less than one against at the same speed as the flow of water will stand up the wash. Exactly the same as wind against tide stands up the sea, go with and the flow of water will smooth the wash out. If you are stationary in the water at 4 mph then yes you will be making a wash equivalent to 4 mph but the wash will also be hitting the bank in exactly the same place, as long as there is no boat in the location you won't rock anyone, if there is then yes you will continue to rock them.

Sorry Neil it appears you posted while I was typing but same thing different words