mbird

Hi All I've just had a chat with James, who seems a very helpful fellow. James: "I can't picture your boat, is it similar to Luke's?" ; Me: "No, it's identical!" He has a hydraulic lift that is okay up to about 28' and 4.5 tonnes, but not much over that. He also has 2x 40' dollies, that get run down the slip, boat goes on, and then pulled back up. He has had an Ocean 37 (about 16 tonnes) out this way, and he says it worked well. As his workshop is busy at the moment, both his dollies are occupied, but one should come free in a week or so. I'm going to pop down to have a chat with him and see his operation, but I reckon he'll probably be the chap for the job. In and out the water and one months covered storage in the workshop can't be bad for £160, and he is quite happy for me to work on the boat myself.

At Brundall, which I'm guessing is pure fresh water

Intersting, I've just read the MG Duff site, and there is some interesting information. They recommend against Aluminium for prolonged fresh water use, as a layer of oxide will build up rendering the anode useless when returned to brackish or salt water. On the other hand, they do not recommend magnesium for any more than 14 days in one year in salt water, and no period longer than 7 days at a time. I think I'll stick with magnesium for now, and see how our sea-going pans out!

Jonathan mentioned aluminium anodes to me a while back as being the best for alternating between salt and fresh. I don't really understand how these would work though, as the outdrived themselves are aluminium aren't they?

Okay guys, yet another question from the newbie saltie corner ANODES! If I have read things right, I understand that the anodes should be zinc if the boat is used in salt water, and magnesium if used in fresh. Am I right so far? 1. How can I tell what the anodes I have are? 2. If the boat has magnesium fitted as it spends 80% of it's time in fresh water, does that mean that it'll start to rot as soon as it goes to sea (ie the other 20%)?

The legs were apparently serviced in July last year, but to my mind, there is no substitute for checking these things out yourself. I'd at least be able to aquaint myself with the soggy side of the boat and have a look at the condition of the anodes. I know a couple of my props have got chips in them too, so they could be attended to at the same time.

Many thanks Dave.

Come along with us Dave, and we can terrify ourselves together I'm so please to hear you are persevering mate, and getting back into the boat.

Hi Luke The £65 for the lifts, is that for both lifts, or £65 each way. If it's the former it does seem very good value. As for the hard standing, I'm not sure how that equates, but almost £100 per month for my boat seems a little high. Then again, I could be comparing this to C.Rickos storage price of £12.50 per BOAT per week. It might certainly be worth me giving him a call, as Beccles is easier to get to than Goodchilds for me.

Hi Jim Both the depth and speed are definately fixed through the hull. I wish it was as simple as a chunk of metal masticed down. Sounds very sensible to me

No that's a different sender Trevor. Mine isn't retractable (it's the ST50/ST60 fixed one). That's interesting Ian. After our little Breydon blast, it did seem to start working for a while. I wonder if the crap that grows on it somehow blocks the signals? I have just emailed Goodchilds to see how much they would charge for a lift out and a couple of weeks on the hard. I am pretty sure the sender will need changing, and at the same time I could check out the trim tabs and the oils in the legs for peace of mind. A lift and hardstanding at Brundall Bay would cost me over £400 which I can't afford at the moment You're not wrong David. Mine is the sort with the flap, but I didn't know if it was going to work. Now I've done it once, I'm fine as I know what to expect, but that first time was a clenched buttock and sweaty kneecap moment

Hi Col, yes David kindly pointed that one out. The problem with the ST model, according to JPC, is that is the vehicle version which has a different sensor, short wiring loom etc to the marine one and is not warranted by Webasto for fitting in a marine application. I tend to agree with David, though, that JPC are over-egging the differences as they want to flog me one, and the sensor can just be changed for an "S" model version for a few quid. JPC did advise against teeing into the fuel line though, due to the suction fom the engine when she's opened up draining the fuel line from the heater. Those propex's are looking more attractive again, especially as there is even a tee fitting in the gas pipe in the lazarette that used to serve the fridge

Hi All I am going through one of those phases where nothing seems to work, and we uncover more issues as we go . I knew we had speed log and depth sounder issues from our trip out at new year, so I have decided to try to get them resolved. The log transducer I have removed from the through hull fitting and put the plug in (VERY scary taking it out of the hole and watching the water come in unti lI could get the plug screwed in , but seemd to work as planned). The paddle wheel is covered in ant-foul so I reckon that's not helping. I've purchased a new paddle wheel, so hopefully that one will be sorted. The depth sounder issue is a bit more involved, and starting to look expensive. It's readings are somewhat erratic, and sometimes it decides to flash, which the manuals tell me is a lost signal. The sounder is an Autohelm SeaTalk, and is probably about 15 years old installed on the boat from new. I have had the display unit rigged up to a test transducer in a workshop at Cliff Marine Services, which was suspended in a tube of water about 4 ft long, and the reading was correct and steady. Next, the test transducer from the workshop was taken to the boat and suspended in the water over the side. The display ranged from 6 feet to 33 feet deep (in 6 feet of water) without the transducer being moved. We did wonder if this was due to a rapid temperature change from the workshop to the water in the marina? The problem seems to be no signal from the transducer installed in the boat, but I am also not sure if the display unit is giving the right reading even when there is a signal provided. Anyone had similar problems? I am hoping to borrow another display unit from CMS on Wednesday to take to the boat to see if that points to the my transducer being cream crackered. If it does, then its a £200 lift to fit a £60 transducer.

No mate, no holes where ducting went etc.

Good job you didn't then

Well that is cheaper than the 2.8kw Propex, so would hold up on that side of the argument David. I would guess the skin fitting would be about £50? and the copper fuel pipe would be extra too, but other than that it would work out about the same. I have now investigated further into the lazarette where I intend to fit the heating unit (whichever it is). There are two flow and two return fuel pipes passing through there, so I assume I could tee into one of the flow pipes without disrupting the flow of fuel to the engine would you think? By pure concidence the gas pipe also passes through this locker too, so it would seem both my fuel sources are in the right place

Panic over, as the guy has responded and is happy to cancel the bid as it was a genuine mistake. Thank heaven's there are still decent people about .... phew!

Right, I have just dropped an almighty clanger I saw a Webasto unit on ebay last night for a very, very good price, considering it is new. I placed a bid and am currently winning. What I didn't realise is that the unit is petrol, not diesel , which I only spotted by chance when looking at the photos again, and noticing a pic of the original invoice mentioned "12V Petrol", which wasn't obvious until I enlarged the picture. I have sent the seller a message asking him to retract my bid, but under ebay rules he has no obligation to do so. Assuming he won't cancel the bid for me, does anyone know what the physical difference between a petrol and diesel Airtop 2000 actually is? Could it be something simple like just a different fuel pump for example? This could be an expensive cock-up

Hmmm, Just to throw a spanner in the works now, I had a good chat with Col after bumping into him at the Boat Show yesterday about this subject. I am going to do some investigation now, about the cost and availablility of second hand Webo's. If I can get a second had unit and replace the burner and glow pin easily, for the same cost as a new Propex unit, then I think I will revert to the diesel option after all, possibly putting in a small secondary fuel tank that I can stick either paraffin or Derv into. I will have to check again, but I just don't think there's an easy way of tapping fuel from the main system, though I am on my way to the boat now to investigate this further. When putting in a separate tank, the BSSC guidline state that if the capacity is less than 27 litres, there is no need for any filling overflow arrangment, making installation a little more flexible. Why are decisions about boats so flippin difficult? I was looking at cvhart plotters yesterday at the show, and the ranges are just bewildering

I did look at the primary filters, but they are not a Lucas type, and I couldn't see any spare ports like I would have expected. They just seemd to have a one-in. one-out arrangement.

Don't worry Jonny, I don't think you are being sarcastic . In all seriousness though, I wouldn't entertain anything like that on any boat, let alone a tippy sea boat. I hated the Thermx heaters we had on TB, which is why I got rid of them and put in Propex's, and at least the Thermx were fixed to the wall. I have no problem with gas on boats, as long as it is properly installed, but those things would be an accident waiting to happen. Ok in a house, but not in anything where the floor moves.

I hope you're not serious Jonny! I can imagine that flying around the boat as we bounce of waves at 30kts! Plus those things give out more condensation than heat, just like the old catalytic Thermx heaters. It's hardly rated for marine use and I can imagine the field day the insurance would have if the worst should happen IMHO that sort of domestic appliance should certainly not be used on a boat of any kind. Hi Jim I have no personal experience of the Webo/Ebers, so only go by what I hear and read. In our experience of the Propex's over 2 years though, we never had a single issue with them. They are so simple inside there is little to go wrong, and the fuel source is of a known quality, of course. Hi David Yes, I agree with that, in as much as we used to turn it up a bit if we got chilly and then down abit when we got warm. The stat perameters are just a little too far apart to maintain a rock steady temperature. Having said that, it never caused us much of an issue, and from what I have read here about the Ebers needing to be run either full blast or turned off, I wouldn't have thought that was much different. I'd love to get an outlet in the heads, but I think the only route through is via the bilge. I'm pretty sure, though, there is a moulded bulkhead I would need to get the duct through, and I'm not sure I fancy taking a hole saw to a structural member . You never know though

Hi All I know this has been discussed on several different threads, but I thought I would start a new one, based on the fact I have now made the decision as to which way to jump. I intended to investigate putitng in diesel heating, despite being very happy with the performance of the Propex's I installed on our last boat, mainly because of the restriction of the size of the gas bottles I can get into the locker on Serenity. At the moment we are limited to Camping Gaz 907's (2 off), due to the size of the hatch into the locker. The smallest propane bottle is 3.9kg which is 240mm diameter, but the opening of the locker is only 230mm! I think it would be possible to open up the hatch a little with some judicious use of a jigsaw, but then the aluminium locker itself isn't wide enough for two propane bottles. Having looked at the situation again, the big problem with installing diesel heating will be getting to the fuel tanks. They are both amidships beneath a bunk, but are not readily accessible without dismantling the bunk completely, as the only access provided as standard is a small hatch to the top of the sender units. The take-off pipe would then have to be fed through a bulkhead into the lazarette locker, where I intend to install the heating unit. There is an argument for teeing into one of the fuel delivery pipes that supply the fuel filters, but I am very wary about this incase there becomes a problem with any fuel starvation to one of the engines when running at speed. I have no idea how you would get to the tanks if one split for example; I think you'd have to take the boat apart! I'm therefore back to square one again, and am going to go with a Propex unit running from the Camping Gaz. This is a more expensive option from a fuel point of view, as the 907 bottles only contain 2.75kg of gas and are about £20 a refill. What I have now worked out though, is the initial expense of the units offsets this dramatically, combined with the inherant reliability problems that so many people seem to suffer with the diesel option. Basing calculations on a diesel cost of around £0.90p per litre (not sure if this is a bit high for the 60/40 split?) the Webasto 2kw unit costs £0.22p per hour to run at maximum heat. The 2kw Propex unit will cost £1.03p per hour if running on the more expensive Camping Gaz at £20 per bottle. This sounds a huge difference until you consider that a twin outlet Webasto unit is £1150 (price from JPC direct), whereas the Propex twin outlet kit is £587 (Norfolk Marine). As there is a difference in the per hour running cost of £0.81p, this means you could run the Propex unit for 695 hours continuous operation to make up the difference in the cost of the Webasto unit. I think my calcs are right, though the other thing I haven't factored in or course, is that the Propex units cycle (ie turn on and off) to maintain the temperature, whereas the Webastos speed up and slow down instead, and the website states a fuel consumption of 0.12l per hour when on low, whereas the Propex will be nil. Also, the diesel units require regular servicing, which the Propex's don't. The biggest issue, as I see it, with the gas option is going to be that the bottles will only last for 19 hours continuous use. As the units cycle to maintain temperature, this will work out to 20-30 hours of actual time the unit is switched on as the burner will be off for some of the time, depending on the ambient temperature outside. The only think I have to decide now is whether the more powerful 2.8kw unit would be better in order to heat the cockpit quicker when it's cool, though this is £180 dearer

I saw these the other day, and wondered if they had grown any bigger with the freezing temperatures. They are being formed by cars splashing melt water over the bushes and then it freezes (just shows salt & grit are no bloody good). They looked quite specatacular the other day, but unfortunatley although they are now bigger, they are gaining a pooh brown tint This next photo shows how they are being formed And finally what happens when your wife tells you too late there is a car coming and you can't take cover. Good job EOS 50D's are splashproof

I was wondering that too; whether I could get something sorted to use the lazarette locker for gas. The problem is I think it is too low so the drain would be below the water line, which wouldn't be a good idea!