LondonRascal

Thanks for that Grendel, I guess too especially in a boat where you may be running the engine for longer at higher revs something that is flat out 1,100RPM less than the other engine might last longer too.

Engineers, wizards or just wise people... This has been on my mind for some time and I can’t really figure it out: You have two boat engines one produces 80HP and the other 85HP. One engine and produces 80HP at 2,500RPM and is a 4.085 litre engine. The other engine produces 85HP at 3,600RPM and is a 3.168 litre engine. So the question I have is - the lower horse power producing engine is actually a larger engine as it’s displacement it just over 4 litres, but it revs a lot lower at 2,500RPM. The higher Horse Power producing engine is smaller but revs a lot higher but gives you an extra 5HP. Would the higher HP but smaller displacement engine give better fuel economy, or would a larger displacement engine revving slower give you more fuel economy?

Thank you Griff, but I this time I really did very little. It was you and the rest of the crew (not to mention the fine boat herself) who brought it altogether and put on a great show!

An exclusive video for this Forum we join MTB 102 and her crew on passage to and from the London’s St. Katherines Docks where she took part in a classic boat show. Motor Torpedo Boats (MTB's), were developed to be able to mount a quick response to threats from any seagoing vessel either warship or submarine. MTB 102 was designed (under the designation Vosper Private Venture Boat) by Commander Peter Du Cane CBE, Managing Director of Vosper Ltd., in 1936. She was completed and launched in 1937, and ran trials on the Solent. Credit has to be made to Charlie Griffin and Russ Jenkins for their camera work – first timers but naturals – and getting us to the heart of the action on board. Myself then filmed Richard Basey – Chairman of the MTB 102 Trust, Skipper and Chief Engineer on a guided tour of the vessel. As you can see we only touched the surface and one must really visit personally to appreciate and feel the history – right down to where in 1944 she carried Winston Churchill and General Eisenhower sat on their review of the ships assembled on the south coast for the D-Day landings, thus seeing the desperate evacuation of troops from Europe and their determined return. MTB 102 is kept afloat through generous donations - from visitors, friends of the craft and business sponsors – but as any boat owner will appreciate it costs money to keep boats afloat and in good order. Perhaps after watching the video you may like to help keep this truly remarkable and historic craft where she belongs - on the sea. Go to www.mtb102.com to learn about the history of this classic vessel and how you can donate or become ‘a friend of MTB 102’. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAC-ZF_aAB4

I’ve just had a fantastic weekend helping with MTB102 during her stay in St. Katherine’s Dock along with several other classic boats. At times the public were queuing to get on board and the donations tin has been in much use which is great news in helping keeping this historic boat able to visit such events and be out on the water. I’ve filmed a personal tour with Richard Bassey, Skipper, Chief Engineer and Chairman of the MTB 202 Trust and along with footage captured by the crew on the way down and back up will be put together into a video to be shared here. For everybody’s information they are heading back to Lowestoft now, having left London at 06:15 this morning, last update they had passed Canvey Island doing 14 Knots and calm and sunny.

My parents had been keen on both the Canals and the Broads since the early 1970’s – so it followed that at some point I would be brought along. I was 8 years old when I first came, Saucy Gem 5 a DC30 from Richardson’s. I remember three things about that first trip to this day: 1. My dad having a nightmare every morning trying to start the engine. 2. The fact I opened the window in the galley and as it did so the latch fell off, hit the side deck and went in the river – just along from St. Benet’s and I was so scared I would get into trouble I said nothing, until my dad broke a glass and I owed up about the window latch. 3. It had a black and white TV And that was it, years after year we came back – I never did go on the Canals and by 2001 I began exploring other places – Europe, America and suchlike and forgot the Broads for a decade until in 2011 I came back once more with Richardson’s and it all began over

Hang on a moment...Just got this photo of MTB102's mast and what is that I see next to the Radar Dome..? Yep an NBN flag

Latest I had from Griff as above from Grendel - They have a gentle 5m swell and have unblocked the heads (handy) the only thing is their AIS is not giving data as to where they are on Marine Traffic so can't track them in real time.

I've just received this photo of the crew of MTB102 - old sea dogs if ever I saw any... They got on board at about 22:30hrs and signal permitting will update tomorrow during their passage.

What will happen is they will raise the money to paint the other part of the bridge - but this will take so long, once work is complete the previously painted part will now be peeling and a new campaign will be launched to re-paint that. Now where is that other red railway bridge that needs painting a lot...

@donnygeoff: You made me laugh - yes one of the hottest days of the year and I go off in the wrong direction. But then I make the mistakes so others don't have to

Well all I have to say on the matter is the BBC are paying him too much

I can't remember the boat sadly, but I do remember some time back seeing on a Brokers site a boat with three engines - I thought this was odd when I saw a triple throttle binnacle control on the helm. It was a displacement boat and the two larger engines port and starboard with the smaller engine where you would normally find it - in the middle. Anything is possible - I below is a video from Sweden where someone with a great deal of money was unhappy with their Fairline boat only being 36ft long, so had the boat extended to 42ft simply long so they could have their dinghy sit on the swim platform but still leave plenty of space for outside entertaining in the aft cockpit. Oh and have a stern thruster fitted too. Watch how they did that here: If you are in the business of super yachts instead of looking into fancy new propulsion techniques and hybrids, to save fuel costs the fit outs are featuring more carbon fire and aluminium and generally where possible saving weight. That is easy to do without a lot of research to be done - thus smaller engines can be fitted saving fuel (client likes that) but giving the boat the same top speeds (client also likes this) and the costs of the more expensive materials used - well everyone likes carbon fibre and 'aircraft grade aluminium' right? I mean it just sounds faster. So even if you have the money like Eddie Jordan who spent £32 million - have a look at his interview about it here: If you have such money to spend on a new yacht you're going to have the added resources to pay for crew and fuel - so why go to the bother of being 'green'? What it needs is for some millionaire geek/app developer to buy a boat and one day have a bit of a brain wave as to how new tech and ideas can be incorporated and come up with something outside the norm as far as design and propulsion goes - and while they're at it come up with new fancy navigational equipment that could be controlled from your watch and call it something like 'smart boat' or the iBoat. Once you get those in San Francisco thinking they can make money through technology, improve the environment and showing off the sky is the limit. After all, who would think an Internet search engine would one day make driverless cars?

It depends how much you are comfortable to do walking – but on my last trip I moored at Paddy’s Lane (close as makes no difference to Barton Turf). I then walked to the White Horse Pub in Neatishead and found it a very nice walk through the Norfolk countryside. The Pub after its recent refurbishment was lovely too. Another nice thing to see is the Barton Boardwalk (or is it Broadwalk I am never sure) – this leads to the viewing platform over looking Barton Broad – you can get to this from Gays Staithe. Moor at Sutton Staithe and walk into the village, once you have crossed the busy road it is nice and you can visit the Pottery.

This is not going to be embarrassing at all... For Griff this is how you use the video function on your camera. I thought best do a video than a long long post trying to explain what buttons do what. Hope makes sense https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnZxe8tOlGU&feature=youtu.be

I’ll use this thread to say thanks for those who enjoy following my travels and Blogs – over the years I try to always improve and add to them and it is always nice to know people enjoy watching them – even rediscovering the Broads after a period of absence through watching a video I’ve made. You might even have a chuckle as you read on... Fear not there will be a lot more ‘as it happens’ shared with you all here in time. I may not be Delia and put a run on Eggs when she bakes something, but I will endeavour to encourage my viewers to join a forum where there just feels more space to spread your wings shall we say. As far as matters with forums go generally, I could have replied more to my post ‘over there’ but would that help? I doubt it just add further fuel to the fire and sometimes in life you just have to let the fire burn and walk away. It is I feel foolish when the clatter of unease amongst your most prevalent posters and contributors gets louder and louder and ‘the management’ - if you wish to call it that, continue to turn a blind eye – do not change and worse still seem unable to understand what exactly is going on. It is times like that where clear leadership is needed and a willingness to listen, and change. Together though in recent days there has been a swell of activity here, long may it continue and I think the team who run the NBN should be patted on the back. It is much like a village with three pubs – a large one a medium sized one and a tiny one. The largest was the Norfolk Bitten & Fox- a great hive of activity – it was near the Clock Tower and Duck Pond and people naturally came to it as a first point of call. They had a quiz night and all sorts of things would be going on in there whatever the day of the week. The medium sized pub, Norfolk Boar & Nymph was really much nicer more cosy and friendly place, but being down the lane it did not attract as much passing trade and things may be a little quieter there. The smallest pub alas, the Norfolk Blacksmith & Owl - well it was nice and all but you were never quite sure what would be going on or when it may be open so you tended to not pop along unless there was an occasion they were putting on like an awards do. One day the Norfolk Bitten & Fox got involved in some tie up with a new brewery and went from serving good fine Ales to new fangled larger and imported French stuff, the Landlord did not seem to be about as much as once and those who were behind the bar tended to get very much more dominant and telling the locals to ‘keep it down’ in latter times they were made to feel more unwelcome than the new drinkers who were passing through. While this was going on, down the lane at the Norfolk Boar & Nymph they had made some changes – redecorated, got these new ‘faster pouring’ Ale pumps all shiny and new – even the Bar looked a lot sleeker and newer than the Norfolk Bitten & Fox’s and many a local would complain about the slowness of being pulled a pint and sometimes the pumps just giving up completely! But you know the Norfolk Boar & Nymph just carried on doing their thing, and as people popped in from the Norfolk Bitten & Fox they were made to feel welcome – not pushed to stay or told the place was better than the larger pub and that along with the surroundings made people come back, more and more. I hear it be said you were even allowed to recall tales of the salty high seas there. Alas, the Norfolk Blacksmith & Owl remains the place you pop into for a quick half – nothing really wrong with it, but never really anyone there to share a tale or two over a drink but none the less would be missed if they ever were to close so I always make a point of popping along to help keep things ticking over. I doubt the Norfolk Bitten & Fox will close, the brewery has some good connections that seem to intervene whenever things get a bit tight and what with the new management and European fizzy stuff there is always going to be people who prefer that – which is fine, but it is nice to see the Norfolk Boar & Nymph doing a good trade and making the locals have a good warm place to gather and talk over the days goings on.

Ok first of all for the Perkin's lovers - just when you thought you could not get a new 4108 ..along comes this - look no smoke https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKmhPYURtNc And Jason, just for you a nice 4.236 (4M90) for you... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FVxJR-2_to Right ok, so...back on track The BMC 1500 engine began life in 1954 in the Morris Oxford and Austin Cambridge - I sinceerely hope in 60 years skilled workers around the world managed to advance somewhat since then in engine technology and design, otherwise we would have a Morris Oxford engine in a 2014 Mini. Personally speaking if money was no object then you should be looking outside the envelope - perhaps getting some skilled people to design from scratch a new engine/electric drive system - would things be more efficient doing away with a propeller and having a 'water jet' type drive, would one engine driving two electric motors to turn two screws help? - research, test and figure it out - in short to have the best performance which required the least amount of servicing and consumed the least amount of fuel.

Well I have been a bit slow to this thread and the new members - so hello all It matters not what a forum is about, but it is nothing without its members – this forum has a far more open feel about things, a friendly place somewhere views can be discussed and shared freely. I’ll be posting more here keeping you at times entertained, and at others shouting at the monitor for the errors I make – I’ll also be supporting it where I am able and spreading the word.

Heavens above! We are on the verge of taking a topic...off...topic! Some things need to be said, I said them and I'll leave things be 'over there'.

I thought Kia cars came with a 7 year warranty - and it all feels like their concept is buy now cheaper, and in 7 years will you still want that car or 'upgrade' to the new model. Bit like mobile phones just 'throw away' culture. Saying this, if you had bought a more expensive Audi, would those parts be cheaper because your initial outlay on the car was more I don't think so.

No, but then neither do Tesco - the point is increasingly these days people are daring to try the unknown. Take me using a Samsung expensive monitor for my computer, even my TV is Samsung, the one downstairs Sony. One day the Samsung monitor stopped working, I looked to reaplce it and found Hans.G - I've now got two 25" Hans G monitors for less than the cost of one Samsung - they are just as vivid, clear and nice to my eyes as the Samsung - they have both worked a treat since 2011 so it has very much made me question brand loyalty.

This is purely from my point of view, and usually as I have found that is contrary to most peoples Honestly how good are most warranties? When you look into what is not covered and the fact you have to do so much to comply with what is, I am left thinking if they are all that worthwhile coupled with the fact some don't include the really expensive factor - labour. As to comparable prices that is another bugbear of mine - how hard is it to get prices for engines online - Vetus, Penta, Beta, Nanni, Solé, Craftsman etc you have to make an enquiry and they give a quote and that makes me feel like you might get a different quote than another person from a different part of the country for the same engine. It's not so transparent. I mean you may get a better price, or you might end up not and paying more and you would never really know. At least with these you can see right from the start the price lists and if you do a deal even better. Perkins or BMC engines of course have been very good diligent units for many many years but I personally would not want to have something which had done goodness knows how many hours, for which spares are getting harder to source and which are using increasingly reconditioned parts. Yes they are good engines because they go on and on but they are not at all smooth and many of them (in hire boats) drink oil rather a lot. More over the low sulphur fuel now being used over the Broads is fine for new engines, but is not nice at all for the trusty old BMC's and Perkins out there slowly but surely their time is coming to an end. Now these engines only suit really inland boaters, it is where a lot of the other marine engines have their sweet spot too - you don't see Nanni engines in high value sports boats - Volvo Penta have that market pretty much to themselves. A good example though would be someone owning a Seamaster 30 with either a pair of 4108/4107 Perkins or BMC 2.5's in them - the boats are worth about £25,000 but some I have seen down to about £21,000. To replace those two engines with a pair of 'branded' engines would probably not leave you with much change from £20,000. But your boat, while now more appealing to a new purchaser one day would not claw back anything like the original outlay of the new engines - so it does not make economic sense, to do, so that's why you never see people putting new engines in these boats - they make do and go on, especially as it seems many boaters buy a boat then 2-5 years later sell it on and get another - usually larger, or slightly newer and 'move up the ladder' of boat ownership. But if you could get a pair of 60HP engines for under £9,000 which includes VAT and a branded PRM gearbox - it suddenly makes it seem like a more promising proposition . It might add some value, it might not but if it was me I'd be thinking purely about the fact I now had brand new engines under the floor which with care, should last - even if they went kaput after 10,000 hours at this sort of price you just throw away and replace. I know morally one has to ask is it right - I mean there is a reason there are cheap, I don't think it is down to being poorly manufactured, (look at the pictures of the factory - looks pretty clean/deent to my eye) but more the people (let's face it skilled engineers) are being paid peanuts which workers in the UK or indeed the EU would never get out of bed for, there is also a whole supply chain and network of dealers too who would very much suffer if too many started ordering engines in pallets from the far east but I think it is worth thinking about if you have a choice of keeping what you do and paying out on parts and keeping them going or being able to afford a new engine even if it is not from someone you know. It is much the same as stopping using Tesco, and getting your shopping from Lidl - once you have got used to the taste it is hard to justify going back to Tesco and spending more.

I thought I would share this with owners who might be thinking about the need for a new engine. There are plenty of manufacturers out there but it would appear on the Broads the choice for the smaller inland river cruiser comes down to Beta or Nanni. You sort of 'know where you are' with either makes, and it is easy to find out information on them, visit someone who has one and get fist hand testimonials. However I was reading with interest on a other forums old posts from a few years ago about MP Marine Solutions - www.marine-power.net - they import engines from China and it seems that is where everything roles their eyes those words 'from China'. Well now as we are in September 2014 they (MP Power Solutions) are still in business which is nice to know for anyone who bought from them 3 years ago wondering if they would be. I'm not a boat owner, but even I thought 'where is the catch' as if they would be some horrid cheaply made things that either work or just go bang in a week. Of course information is sparse online and it has taken some digging - the easy part is finding out who makes and supplies hem and they are generically known as TD-ME engines and you can buy them direct from the factory. The lower HP models you need to buy at least 2, the higher HP models you can buy individually and shipped over here on a pallet in about a fortnight for between $2,000 and $10,000 ready to go complete with gearbox. Then I found a You Tube Channel (out of Russia) who has many videos of the various engines but it is all in, well Russian. You can set You Tube to translate the words into subtitles but that is a bit hit and miss. Then I found www.td-power.ru and if you use Google Chrome (Internet Browser) it translates it all into very good English. From there one can find testimonials, videos of the engines installed into various boats - one with over 3,000 hours and looking as fresh as the day they went in. This then got me wondering if these engines are being bought all over the world surely if they were bad the Internet would be littered with information about how to avoid them, but it does not seem so. The smaller blocks seem based on Kubuta engines, the larger on Izuzu or Nissan blocks - they are simply constructed units so nothing fancy. So by using the links if anyone is thinking about re-engining and money is tight, these might just fit the bill. Sure your not have a nationwide network of dealers, spares will have to come in from China (though Marine Power Solutions has a stock of for next day dispatch) and if you bought through them you do get up to a 3 year warranty but you pay more since you're dealing with the 'middleman' not the factory, even so there is no getting away from it they are cheap and if you have a boat that has a smokey oil drinking BMC this could well be an option to consider so I thought I'd share what I had found out here

Be good to see you all and MTB102 'in my manner'. I'll have to show you how to shoot video too I spose, oh and show some Yorkshire men some decent pubs (though it is London so your need a second mortgage naturally) and can give you bit of history along the way Hope you have a safe passage and a great time too!

In very simple terms the ‘MiFi’ unit is very much the same as your home Broadband Router – it has no sockets however. It emits a WiFi radio signal just the same as your home router would, so if your Thinkpad works at home on WiFi it would work on the Boat with the MiFi unit – or the train, sat by the sea you name it. As to data use, this really is very hard to work out – but let us say an hour programme on iPlayer in Standard Definition used 600Mb of data and you have 3,000Mb (3GB) of available data, you can see you could watch 3 hours of iPlayer and have just about 1.2GB of data left to use. With normal web browsing – forum, email etc (not video or music) your data will last a lot longer of course – a couple of weeks would be easy to achieve. However it is like asking how long a piece of string is my usage would be different to yours and yours different to another’s. I think £15 for 3GB is not the best value considering how cheap home broadband is, but what you get is the ease of getting online as you’re moored at How Hill so it does have its advantages. I also have a Vodafone USB dongle for my laptop for backup, but it simply does not get as good as signal as Three, and is very much slower also because fewer people use Three compared to the likes of Vodafone, Orange, T-Mobile (EE) and O2 Three’s network capacity has more room and so drop outs and slowing down during peak usage times does not seem to happen. What is important to know is even if you are very frugal your data will expire after 30 days anyway. So if you still had 500Mb left that would not roll over. Now because I am not away all of the time that is ok for me, if however I was going to be on away a lot more often then a Contract may work out better in the long run and I may then be able to get the unit ‘free’ and just pay a monthly fee. Hope that helps.