Dan

Or is this just a more convenient way to group them? To me they are just a newer, more viable and much less costly alternative to the previous offerings, that has come about through the changing times the internet has brought and the ability to offer a different service with much reduced overheads and therefore small fees to the operator as no brochures, no TV adverts etc but one central place to book and I am sure occasional visitors particularly may well use this site each time, much in the way at one time they may have always picked a Hoseasons fleet. It has also made it viable to run one/two/three boats which a tie up with Blakes/Hoseasons would at one time have made quite un-viable. It is a bit of a different ball game to Blakes/Hoseasons, undoubtedly, I fully agree, but I suspect without them some of the fleets represented by them would not be able to continue or would run a smaller fleet or have a different structure (repairs, moorings but no hireboats?) so I think really they are an agency of sorts, but it certainly does show what could be offered at a much lesser cost and as an alternative to going with one of the big two that was probably your options twenty years ago. Dan

I wasn't trying to say they were necessarily in a mess, just that they would be interesting to look at to see how easy it was to lose a big agent and go it alone, with Waterways alone onboard other than their own efforts. I suspect it is possible to not need them, but not by any stretch of the imigination easy, especially if you were truly relying on your own efforts with no other external agents/introducer or whatever you call them's help Dan

A few more thoughts... Another angle to think of is that Herbert Woods were with one of the big agents until a couple of years ago. They would probably be a good case study for whether agents still have a place, especially as a large fleet. Since this decision has the fleet been able to let as well or almost as well as before? What have we since this decision? Extreme discounting including 50% off Summer Holidays sticks in my mind and gives a lot of clues and raises several thoughts (unless they were just drunk or feeling generous?), though it must be remembered they are still not fully independent as they are using Waterways Holidays still. Without that agent what else would we have seen or what would the success level be? Does independence offer success and ok booking charts or in quieter spells could it contribute towards panic, un-maintable short term offers that help cash flow & survive this year but de-stabilise the long term security of the industry... it all depends how much demand is there I suspect, but I think getting the bookings is perhaps not as easy as it may first appear, but perhaps if a yard is to focus heavily on a good website, regularly updated, be all over pricing permantly as well as doing a whole mass of other things you probably could get by without an agent but I reckon it would be hard, especially at the minute, but perhaps over a longer period some years where demand is stronger could be ok. Dan

Hi Robin I see this a lot, but booking through an agent can offer some benefits. I often used to book my Richardsons holiday at a travel agent through Hoseasons because I had some Thomas Cook vouchers that I had either won through work promotions or bought cheap off an internet auction site! More recently I sometimes used to still book through the agent because I decided on my holiday in my leisure time, which has nearly always been in evenings and until fairly recently some of the companies I liked didn't have online reservations (this seems strange to think of today, but it was not that long ago really) and I did not want to call the following day, or was not able to due to being in work, so the added convenience the agent then offered won the business. If truth be told, if it were not for a loyalty scheme of booking direct I may still be doing it that way as they never gave me reason to be unhappy. I feel the service has diminished in recent years though, as I think everything going online has reduced the expertise on hand. When I rang up to make a reservation to be told they would not be letting that particular boat (something I knew to be completely wrong but they were not prepared to enquire further) and I should ring the operator direct (A suggestion I was rather disgusted by as sending a paying customer away from your business un-necessarily seems rather shameful to me!)... so I did and decided they would be unlikely to get any more of my business if I had to fight them to give them my money. Still, as with all businesses you are only really ever as good as the staff you employ. I think the agent still has some benefits. There have been threads on here recently about businesses closing or withdrawing a service & people worrying about their holiday and/or their cash. This worry would be a lot less and options a lot greater with a (half reputable) agent involved. Indeed when an operator refused my booking several years ago for rather baffling/shameful (even to the agent!) reasons they worked hard for me to find me an alternative holiday. Also although some have moaned about Hoseasons TV advert & the time of coverage the boats got who else is doing TV advertising? Or has an advertising budget/spend close to their scale? Whilst the world has changed there is still a place for agents, perhaps the fees they can fairly command is less, and perhaps their stronghold and place has changed somewhat because yes, the difference they can make to your reservation charts from going alone or with internet only agents (such as Waterways) is certainly different or less powerful to how the world was in say 1989, or the pre internet era. Dan P.S Hoo-ray hoo-ray it's your Hoseasons Hol-i-day

I think it was one of their best booked sites Julz and also amongst the highest repeat booking ratio too. You're right though - at this sort of time the most basic accommodation was a perhaps a previously unexperienced version or the definition of 'basic' There was a good website on the place but I cannot find it now Dan

You may be pleased to hear that Pontins Dolphin burnt down Julz Some bits survived but the camp lay derelict until very recent times but is now housing. Butlins have spent fortunes over the years and I would expect are now an OK standard, and their skyline hotels and the like look quite good, BUT, this comes at a price. They are not cheap holidays now, in the main or for the reasonable accommodation & not on a random deal anyway. Pontins seem to be sticking at doing budget holidays for very low rates but seem to be getting a lot of stick for it! Good that someone is though as going upmarket whilst perhaps successful (maybe even almost crucial) commercially & financially does not keep it within everyones price bracket and I think everyone should be able to have a holiday. Dan

I remember the place being on the news in the early 90s (I think) as there was a bit of an uproar at the suggestion it be turned into some form of prison, if I remember correctly. I guess they did not get their way as it is a retirement village, unless it has just been rebranded I think it is quite sad that this massive site was once busy and packed with holidaymakers but I guess the way people holiday & the market, like most, has changed and to be fair it is not how I holiday (very often!) Plemont Bay is my favourite Dan

I thought the forum had been sold to Haven Holidays! Dan

Looks like an honest description and strong value for money http://www.maffett-cruisers.com/ Dan

Good to see them back and they are quite a tempting offering, I may have to give them a try one time. I am not too sure I like the look of the larger, sedan model with its rear overhang so look forward to seeing it in the flesh as this probably the one I would naturally be drawn to. It is good that they are building new 2-4 berths including at the smaller size of the market as most of the new hireboats are quite large and therefore expensive to be a serious contender for just two people, or to me anyway Dan

Hi Jonny Not really enough snow here for a Safari let alone a Bahama! Dan

I am not too sure on Le Boat really... the standards of care & presentation dont seem to be quite what they were say seven or eight years ago & more when the fleet was always pretty smartly turned out under their then Connoisseur branding. Depending on which boats you are thinking of they do run some fundamentally good boats in their Admiral & Emperor classes. It has to be remembered though they are now twenty years old, so combined with what I have said above I wonder if first class luxury is the brief then perhaps you need to look to one of the most expensive boats in the brochures that has been built in the last few years. If the budget is just a bit more restricted than that and you are realistic in expectation to pounds spent you may be quite OK with a Le Boat, especially if you can get an OK deal. They seem to work to the polar opposite to what Clive has described... price quite high, always be doing a 'deal' to make you feel you have got a bargain but a constant special offer just becomes the price to my mind and de-values integrity of the brand, especially if it is distress special offers. I would rather Richardsons fairer pricing outlook to be honest, and to reward early bookers and build/reward repeat custom but given you have already once discovered their offering does not match what you are looking for your perfect boat and fleet does perhaps lie elsewhere. Personally I find their entire fleet is strong value pound for pound. I would also be a little wary of going off tales at the riverside. People do not always remember quite the right figures, or may forget/include waivers/deposits etc that you may have done the reverse to what they have (these can give you in the region of £200 straightaway!) not to mention you may just have encountered someone who either is bolstered with certain motivational bravados and the like.... though to be honest I only truly believe something I have seen, experienced or looked into myself so perhaps that is just to do with how I am! Dan

No critiscm of yourself or Mary-Jane John.... but it was the one that was my interpretation of the opposition to one from some at the time. As I say though, good that a u-turn or one would be considered since things have changed Dan

That would be a rather massive u-turn after all the hoo-hah and obstruction over a northern meet last time? Dan

Now all that needs to happen is for people to hire them so that the prescence remains... I wonder if they will? Historically selling holidays/demand on the Southern Broads has always been much harder so I wish them well Dan

Beat ya beat ya

Morning all Three of the boats that DRL/Anglia Boats ran last year have gone to City Boats of Thorpe. They are: Camero 2 (was one of the Fun Time's) - 29ft Alpha Sportsbridge Bel Air ( was Free Time) - Bermuda 34 Caprice (was Fine Time) - Alpha 32 fwd drive This brings the City Boats holiday fleet up to six I think as they are also running two 31ft fwd drive boats ("Duet 1 & 2") and a 24ft Freeman ("Hopes") which they ran in 2012, all of which did a spell with DRL but were formally from Highcraft. I think City Boats have a new website due, and they are not represented on the current one so must have solely used Waterways Holidays for their bookings in 2012. Freedom (recently moved to the old Kingfisher Cruisers site in Thorpe) have, I think, the other Alpha Sportsbridge (was one of the Fun Time's) and the two Alpha 32 cc (ex Super Time) that DRL/Anglia Boats ran for a few seasons. I am not sure if Anglia Boats are running with just a couple of holiday boats in 2013 (Dream Time & Magical Time?) or if they are focussing on other things. I guess their website will update at some point, but does indicate you can book these boats for 2013 from them at the moment so it is, as John says a little confusing until then. Dan

Hi Robin If I've understood you correctly then you'll find the 2 night price is shown by the boat in question UNLESS that boat is not available for two nights when you would then just see the lengths available - 3/4 & 7 in the majority as you say. I am suprised a bigger introduction to the 2 & 5 night breaks wasn't featured, as it's new for 2013. I only picked up on that off here, and then had to go hunting for it as my first read was quite a quick flick through so I reckon it wont quite reach as many peoples attentions as would be good. From what I can see Broadland Wave, Symphony, Majorca, San Carlos, Silver Gem, Concerto, Amber Gem, Gold, Magic, Sapphire, Madeira, Astral, Tideway & Fairway are the options for two night breaks. The bridges is a funny one - for example brochures never used to list ones such as Thorpe & Wayford even when they were definate restrictions, and Wayford seems to creep in occasionally more recently, but the restrictions everyone lists does seem a bit inconsistent and therefore not always that accurate Dan

Good heavens above... but whatever are you doing going boating there, perhaps it is the price you must pay for such crazyness?! It is rather high, but then if it is a deposit I'm sure it will do the job of making you look after the boat & return it in pristine condition and with a bit less gay abandon than you might show if you'd hired one of Mr Richardsons and paid £46 to do whatever you wanted with! Still, we must be careful not to wander off onto the old waiver v deposit debate as the inevitable debarkle and full on slanging match that would inevitably follow wouldn't do on New Years Eve Dan

Mine arrived today too. Just had a flick throigh, nice brochure with lots of new piccies and a few changes from next year with Moonfleet & the 2 night breaks etc Got quite excited by the two night break idea (Tuesday to Thursday) as I thought I could have even more breaks! On looking a bit further though I reckon the fuel deposit being £120 for a 4 berth (as with 3/4 night breaks) is a bit on the high side. If you pick up around 14.00 on Tuesday afternoon and have to have it back first thing Thursday morning however are you ever going to get through something close to that?! I know it is a deposit so you would get it back & therefore the cost of the holiday comes down to real terms in the end, but it pushes the intial/percieved cost up dramatically because as it has not been lowered for the shorter period/cheaper hire fee then the final cost of the holiday over the starting price is proportionally even higher than normal, and suddenly looks less appealing (even though as I say it would reduce as you would get a lot back). Also, disappointingly the damage waiver is still £46 on a 4 berth, which is the same as weekly holidays and 3/4 night breaks. This being the same for 2 nights (or one and a half days of useale holiday time - however you look at it) as it is for a week is not right to my mind. If the fuel deposit was say, £75 and the waiver reduced a tad, maybe £30? then these would be good value breaks and a much fairer/balanced level of cost for the fact it is just two nights. I was a little disapppointed to see so many sliding canopy boats with their canopies shut in the photo's too.... Dan

Exciting times. I noticed all their boats are listed in your Platinum Range, so I look forward to the internal piccies going on so I can have a good nosey Dan

Which boat/price band were you considering? It looked to me like prices had either stayed the same or gone down a bit, certainly on the boats I've considered. I could only see the Platinum fleet & 1 other 2/4 berth where it was more expensive than in 2012, so on this basis maybe they were quoting you the cheapest price and in all probability you would either be the same or better off being quoted next years price anyway Dan

Congratulations Mark I think many people think or dream about working for themselves but very few are brave enough to take the plunge, make it happen & make it work/last at any point is never easy I reckon, especially these last five years. Here's to the next five Dan

I dont think Le Boat have spent high amounts of money on the site at Horning themselves. It isn't owned by them, and the big improvements were done before they took the place on, by the owners/landlord. If they did ever move back then as they still operate some craft from there that cannot get under Wroxham Bridge a further cutdown or change of lineup would be needed, Dan P,S it's a shame Somerleyton was so short lived, but given the marketing effort and lack of brochure presence or even appearance in 2012 it is not that suprising. The Southern Broads is harder to sell holidays on and I do not think they tried very hard to sell it.

Haven't called in for a while, but sounds likely to be the same ones Dan