Chameleon, Upgraded

[JennyMorgan]

She's moored up in a really rough area of Oulton Broad at the moment,  nevertheless she's looking very smart, even if somewhat out of place!!

[unclemike]

unfortunately one has to "slum it " occasionally

[JennyMorgan]

36 minutes ago, chameleon said:

unfortunately one has to "slum it " occasionally

I do it daily!

[Polly]

Have a super holiday.

[NBYCo2124]

Dear Mike,

Viceroy

Interesting reading through the posts and they brought back many memories.  I used to have copies of all the Blakes and Hoseasons Brochures for every year throughout the 1970s, but after several moves they sadly have gone, so I can't reference them. However, I was looking through the excellent Broads boat database for some answers, not all found.

The Norfolk Broads Yachting Company built 4 Viceroys in the 1970's all with folding canopies over the centre wheelhouse. Faircraft had built similar vessels on the same hull, but all with sliding canopies. However, I can't find any reference to these Faircraft boats. Faircraft at this time was a small boatyard with only a handful of cruisers. It was sold mid to late 70s, and I remember going to collect one of their largest boats a 30ft on the same Ocean/Aquafibre 30 hull with varnished topsides, and a sliding wheelhouse roof. They were hired out under the Hoseasons banner. They also had at least one boat based on the Classic 27 hull. My father sold The Norfolk Broads Yachting Company to Robert Wilson at the end of the 1970s, and possibly Robert Wilson sold it to Len Funnell? He was planning to start a smaller operation (Sovereign Cruisers) with around 4 Aquafibre 42 mk1, kitted out to tap the top end of the Broads boat hire market. He bought a site on the West side of The Rhond in Wroxham next door to E R English's yard. The boats earmarked were the Marquis of Perth, Marquis of York, and the Marquis of Granby (a 39ft Windboat he bought from Woods). The latter named after a favourite pub! He planned another 2 Aquafibre 42s, but he then sold all and left the boatyard world, whilst still having the odd Broads boat, including a Moorhen and a Freeman 24, both he renamed "Scamp"

One contributor correctly identified that the Viceroys had a striking resemblance to the Ernest Collins Boats, which my father admired, but also one of his favourite Broads cruisers was Star Premiere (1960's version). So while all the Viceroys are on the same R M Martins designed Bourne 30 hull, one of the strongest influences was Collins' Coral Emblem. One difference is the aft well, which the Star Premiere's had.

Other Viceroy facts: One of them went to the London Boat Show at Earls Court exhibited on the Blakes Stand that year. This was the second time my father had one of his boats at the Boat Show, as President 1 was there in January 1974

Viceroy 1 and 2 had completely white hulls, whereas Viceroy's 3 and 4 had blue gelcoat to mimic the painted underhull antifouling and boot top. The Consuls also had the blue gelcoat under the water.

Viceroy 1 was the only one of the 4 to have an exhaust pipe exiting the hull at around midships on the port side.

I have been trying to find some original photos of the viceroys. Will post if I can find any. I do have the pictures of Congressman the day she was launched, and some others of the hire boats then, but maybe that is for another post topic!

 

[unclemike]

Hi robert, was under the impression that chameleon was viceroy 3 but exhaust exit is midships as you say 1  was, the story i have is that she was sold to compass craft and converted from folding to sliding, you can see where the original woodwork was, so has had a conversion, when we replaced curtains one old set had viceroy written on hem and when we reupholstered the wheelhouse one cushion had compass craft written on base

[NBYCo2124]

Dear Mike

Chameleon could very well be Viceroy 3. Check the under the drawers, as these all used to come out when the boats were winterised, so were marked accordingly. I think they were stored onboard, but would have been revarnished periodically. It was quite a sight to see the whole fleet inside the boatsheds, and they were crammed in. The soft furnishings and berths were marked too, but these are more than likely to have been changed over the years. Each boat had wooden crates with their names on, and the boats were emptied of soft furnishings, crockery, cutlery etc which was all put away in another shed for the winter. The engines and batteries were all removed too, and I remember the Engineers shop with all these engines lined up ready to be worked on over the winter. There was a battery shop too, where all the batteries were stored on wooden racks, and had some kind of trickle charging.

Also what is her registration number, as I seem to remember the numbers were sequential/Alphabetic 

The NBYC boats did become part of the Faircraft fleet, those that weren't sold, as I remember seeing the AF42's, Viceroys and the former Consuls with the faircraft red stripes on their hulls. I think most of the wooden boats were sold off pretty quickly, but the Viceroys were very popular hire boats when we had them, hence why we built 4 of them. I am not sure if Robert Wilson sold the business or just the boats. Faircraft would have done the canopy conversion, and as i mentioned in my last post, the original faircraft 30ft boats all had sliding roofs, as you could get another berth(s) in the wheelhouse, so they could be advertised as a 6 berth, rather than Viceroy's 4 berths. The Faircraft 30ft boats were 6 berths with a double in the wheelhouse, converting the table into the berth.

My mother still worked for the business after the sale, so she may know more. My late father had lots of photos, mostly stored as slides, but my mother can't find them. I have a few at home in a photo album, which if i can upload i am happy to do so.

Regards

Robert

[unclemike]

def not a faircraft one, only has a pull out 3/4 berth in wheelhouse,

reg no j625, j626 is called elizabeth gifford and is 3 boats down from us in the wetshed, and is still fold down canopy

[NBYCo2124]

Dear Mike,

You are correct, she is definately a Viceroy, but I am confused by Craig's excellent database. Except the sliding wheelhouse roof, she has all the design quirks I remember. The faircraft boats had a very different aft well, basically steps down to a door, and the cabin sides came much further back, more like Broom's bosun, but no where near as pretty. The faircraft 30ft boats seemed older too, or weren't in a good state. It is a shame I cant find a photo to illustrate.

I am pretty sure Viceroy 1 was built by herself and probably H913, but 2 of them were built side by side. I thought it was 3 and 4, and I remember the numbers J625 and J626, but Craig has other registration numbers listed M140, M141 and M142, which seem familiar. So I think H914 must have been Viceroy 2.

The sequence of boats NBYC built our wooden superstructure cruisers was: Congressman, President 1, Senator, Viceroy 1, Viceroy 2, Viceroy 3, and Viceroy 4 (together).  President 2 was after the last Viceroy, and I thought it was built as one of my father's private boat clients wanted his own President! 

I will try and find some photos, with clear registration numbers! I have a few out of focus photos, which i must have taken with my "Kodak instamatic" a simply awful piece of kit, as you had to push the shutter button so hard you moved the camera whilst taking the shot, or i was a terrible photographer (more likely)!!! The best I have is attached.

Regards

Robert

[Vaughan]

 

I remember them well!

These were the days when yards were experimenting with Fibreglass hulls but still built the boat itself like a "real" boat!

Yards such as Ernest Collins and NBYCo did the best versions, in my memory. They were beautifully built boats.

Scan from Blakes catalogue of 1978.

[NBYCo2124]

Thank you Vaughan, you have also answered one of my questions, as I can see clearly that is Viceroy 2 is in fact H914. Interestingly the chap driving was our foreman and fabulous master boatbuilder Russell Smith. Sadly I can't remember the other fellow, but he was another very good boatbuilder. 

Did you see  my request about a boatyard in France to work on President?

Regards

Robert

[Vaughan]

1 hour ago, NBYCo2124 said:

Did you see  my request about a boatyard in France to work on President?

Yes, but that reply needs a bit more thought.

Coming shortly!

[unclemike]

h914 seems to have disappeared completely, h913  is now bollysnigh of oakwood with sliding canopy and resides in wetshed also, there are 3 similar boats with folding canopy on lake lothing, may be m140/141/142

one is a liveaboard, this i know the guy came and introduuced himself at oulton yacht station and remarked on the differing wheelhouse setup

these may be the faircraft ones

[WherryNice]

I hope Robert and Mike won't mind but I enjoy a bit of boat detective work so I had a little poke around Craigs database and Broadland memories and I think I may have found the Fair Craft boats, reg numbers R635 and R636, both wooden top Bourne/AF/Ocean 30's with aft wells and sliding roofs. These were originally Ernest Collins Shining Emblems but later went to Fair Craft as Fair Hilton so not sure if they are the ones Robert remembers or not.

Number 2 got smashed to pieces under Wroxham bridge in 1982 and appears to have been rebuilt with new superstructure but number 1 appears original.

https://www.broadlandmemories.co.uk/1980sgallery2.html

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki2018/index.php?title=Boat_Details&BoatHistory=10581&BoatId=6458

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki2018/index.php?title=Boat_Details&BoatId=6457&BoatHistory=10578

 

FairCraft also seem to have had some all GRP 30 foot sliding canopy boats called Fair Ambassador.

The database is a little odd in that it lists two sets of Viceroy with different reg numbers but all from NBYCo albeit some years apart. All the boats in the database end up as private boats with different names so they must all exist.

Could the original Viceroys have been sold off to Compass Craft only to be replaced with 3 new ones at NYBCo?

The later ones seem to go straight into private hands after NBYCo.

Anyhoo, that passed a pleasurable hour or so, it may be of no use at all but I enjoyed digging about.

[NBYCo2124]

Wow, good detective work. I remember the Faircraft 30ft boats as pretty scruffy, but that would have been when they were being sold. There are lots of Broom design details, like the central helm position and the windows. I was probably comparing them to a Viceroy at the time, which were really well looked after.

The extra Viceroys, I don't know, but agree it is very strange. Will see whether my mother can remember.

Robert

 

[LizG]

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki2018/index.php?title=Boatyard_Details&YardId=42

Pages 2 & 3 have the majority of the late 1970s ex NBYCo fleet listed among some later arrivals that I don't remember.

I remember the Naiads, Ambassadors, Envoys and some other ones.  I stopped cleaning in I think 1980 and moved away from Horning /stopped working for Beardshaws in 1981

[NBYCo2124]

On 28/11/2020 at 17:15, LizG said:

Pages 2 & 3 have the majority of the late 1970s ex NBYCo fleet listed among some later arrivals that I don't remember.

I remember the Naiads, Ambassadors, Envoys and some other ones.  I stopped cleaning in I think 1980 and moved away from Horning /stopped working for Beardshaws in 1981

Dear Liz, 

Thanks for your post. I didn't realise the NBYC fleet moved from Wroxham to Horning. I do remember the interesting red lines painted on the hulls  which we thought made them look like they were sponsored by cigarette companies. I wasn't a fan of this branding.

We had a holiday on Ambassador (around 1971) just before we completed on the purchase of the yard, which I can still remember especially the flexible door between forward cabin and main cabin.  On Envoy, my funniest memory was getting my lifejacket twine caught in the steering wheel while I was balancing on a stool helming. My father was doing something else on the boat, and I went straight into the muddy bank on a bend. The funny thing was my father pushing the boat off the bank, as she was quite wedged; the bank was quite low;  a bourne 35 hull is pretty high at the bow; him giving instructions to put the boat into reverse, and finally he just made it hauling himself onboard. I think he helmed the rest of the trip!

Happy memories. 

Regards

Robert