MY littleboat

I'm thinking of changing our tender to a walker bay for that very reason. Excellent tender and a quick pop up asymetric sail means you can have alot of fun when the time arises!

Ian Having thought about this for some while, I can guarantee a number of things. Having two engines will have at least the following effect: It will double your oil expenditure, your spark plug and lead expenditure, it will increase the swearability modulus in that the reduced space in the engine compartment will invariably mean that you have less room for your elbows and more importanatly your head to fit into. You will then have two engines to listen to when you suddenly get an attack of 'Skippers Super-Hearing' whereby even the smallest whine will have to be verified. Invariably the time will come when one engine for whatever reason refuses to start and this will mean that you will call off your journey a few hundred metres up river whilst you completely ignore the fact that 90% of the other boats on the river only have one engine anyway. You will invariably put the wrong engine for'ad as the boat neetly pirouettes away from the mooring you were aiming for, and likewise whilst stern mooring, the same effect will inevitably turn your stern moor into a side-on! As well as your oil and possiblt fuel costs doubling, so will your alchol intake as I cannot explain, but in recent years the amount of Fosters/Carlsberg and wine we get through has increased umteenfold (We do however have a crate of Carling knocking around somewhere at a very reasonable cost - (which I keep next to the remnants of a very expensive set of champagne glasses... well expensive to me). With the added edition of engines, your cruising buddies will also change. Whereas guys who used to wave at you majestically as you sailed past in your half-decker thingy will still wave, only now use less fingers! Your new friends, having got to the 'pub' in the time that takes to get there instead of the previous few days 'hell and high seas' journey, will ensure that you have sufficient alcholic intake that will ensure you will be 'checking your fenders' far more frequently than before and you will no longer be able to decipher why the other people in the pub, when you were a saily and thought they were all drunkards, suddenly seem quite normal! And lastly, don't forget, your new Broads toll will include the unwritten rule that you can now run a several hundred metre extention cord to an electric point in order to keep the sound system pumping out the tunes to any hours of the morning! Welcome to the real world of boating Oh and I nearly forgot.... (for those that remember..) Bachman Turner Overdrive....Let's Rock!

Ah now that is a very relative nugget as the height guages on this bridge have so much limescale on them that they are unreadable. No maintenance has occured on them in a very long time. It should be part and parcel of regular maintenance that, in this case the BA who are best placed to look after this work, clean ALL height boards regularly. However I have a feeling that the words 'risk assesment' and Health and Safety' may pop up here... One thing I like is the idea of 'oak' runners - simple and effective, however with oak scrap prices approaching that of some metal, I have the feeling that they may not last long! For info; I am currently waiting for replies to questions from Norfolk County Council, May Gurney, a number of railway trusts who I shall not mention at this time and SUSTRANS who have categorically refused to make any statement regarding this topic. I am also in the process of serving two FOI requests and am about to write to BA directly for their stance and understanding. I have no beef about restoration, even though I do feel it is a rusting pile of crap, but I do feel very strongly that, as so often incases like these, the system has been manipulated by a public body or charity, and to some degree I feel sorry for BA that this has literally landed in their lap, but I also feel that the BA have been aware for many years what the situation is with the bridge/Kiki/SUSTRANS/Railway Walks etc and cannot exactly call this a 'fast ball'

My main gripe is that, as usual one or two people have managed to use this as an argument for 'buy a suitable boat for the Broads then'... my answer to that is to reiiterate exectly what type of boats have been jammed under there in recent years and to say to those people, if you want to keep the Broads special and not have GRP boats, sea going boats, then get together with your friends at the BA and ban them.. and then see how your tolls rack up. Maybe twenty years ago, peoples aspirations and needs were different boat-wise to what they are now, and I refuse to let this topic go down that route as this is an oft-discussed topic which normally adds up to people buying the boat which is right for them for whatever reason. As the OP on this topic I am well aware that some would rather then use it as a political stepping stone to air their own views, which I have learnt that they do at every given opportunity, accross many forum platforms. Sadly in this case it is black and white. The bridge has been in the ownership of Rail Paths Ltd - owned by SUSTRANS for a number of years and they have failed to maintain it. The left hand span had been used as an illegal walkway from ASDA, train station for a number of years. The planning permission that was given to the new development bridge located just a few metres North was given on the basis that the Vauxhall Bridge was unuseable and could never be used in ANY capoacity again. (Been doing my homework on this). So several years ago, this bridge was fenced off. The most northerly span, which had had its base removed as was deemed totally unsafe and the bridge then sat there - rotting. Around this time there had been inspections by various historic trusts / railway trusts, including representatives from two local rail charities and circa 2002 these charities deemed, as far as I can gather (awaiting a reply to a letter I have written them), that because of the heavy modification from the original design with 'bodged' boxing and it's overall poor condition, it served no historic value as far as moving it/restoring it but did agree that as the last remaining remnant of the 'type' of bridge the Grade II listing was probably correct, but however disagreed on record at the time with Peter Cross-Rudkins finding that this bridge was SO important. (Book: Civil Engineering Heritage In East Anglia) Now we are at 2002, in 2001 Sustrans were asked to produce structural survey when the Civic Trust, Great Yarmouth Town Centre Strategy Report “Station Gateway†, this was ignored in the development plan and the regeneration focussed on the more Northerly bridge. It is worth noting at this point, being Grade II listed, SUSTRANS, through their company Railway Walks Ltd had a DUTY to maintain this bridge in a reasonable state of preservation - this they failed to do. In fact the initial barrier and closure work was carried out by the local council's ground works department at their own cost. Step in the owner of a restaurant on the North Quay Mrs Kiki and her husband Chris, who once the short cut was closed, almost immediately launched a campaign to 'Save the Bridge'. Please note the position of the bridge in relation to her business. Initially, her cries fell on deaf ears but over time, and with the engagement of SUSTRANS - along with changed planning laws relating to sustainability, funding was secured - not all the funding mind as an email to Norfolk County Council regarding their contribution this week was met with the reply 'we cannot comment on this project at this time' (An ROI request duly being sent!) So things get a little odd at this point: a further part of protecting the underside of the bridge comes after an '8 berth cruisere being stuck under the structure on 13th May 2010' oddly this backfired initially as it was then seen as a hazard to navigation.. but eventually became used as a we must protect both the bridge and boats. Incidentally as far as I can tell no 'average air draught' calculations or accurate silting levels were measured in the recommendations from the structural survey, however it was highlighted that 'adequate air draught will not be affected' yet goes on to propose a drop of between 200 - 300mm in places (Not entirely sure how this will work as I have the text but no drawings). The whole of the work plan is based around returning a pathway over the most southerly span, it does nothing for any work on the northerly (Railway) span - so I ask - is this preservation or a 'band-wagon' work in order to open a new pathway (Which incidentally there are no plans to build as yet) instead open the bridge up so a 'short-cut exists? SO they are the facts. 1. There has been NO input from BA or GYPA throughout any of this recent phase. 2. It remains a rusting structure - the Northerly span WILL remain a rusting hulk after the work 3. The air draught will be reduced (in order to protect the bridge) 4. The redevelopment of the footpath was decided on the back of the 2007 report that says “Pedestrian and cycle linkages need to be upgraded, to provide new, enhanced links to the Conge and the Market Place, ideally through the restoration of the old railway bridge.†but the more northern bridge and footbridge were improved instead. 5. As yet the plans to construct this new footway do not coincide with this work 6. The main contractors for the underside of the bridge have a working model contract to start work on the dates discussed. So stop using this as an argument for what boat is right or wrong for the Broads, this is a decision that the main Navigating Authority has not been involved in regarding planning and it is up to US, the boat user, to do something about it and not use it as a 'well it wont effect me' stance. There is nothing wrong with restoring the bridge in my view, but to do so at the detriment of navigation - even by one or two inches, is wrong Added to this - if you ask the people of Gt Yarmouth if restoring the footbridge and making a path (saving them a walk) is a good idea, they will of course say yes. However, if you ask them a different question like... Would you prefer half of the old bridge to be painted and re-opened or a brand new footbridge, I wonder what the answer will be. Feasability studies are always geared to the preferred outcome of a project!

I'm not sure I see the benefit of buying a dayboat. For the expense of buying, tolling, launching or keeping, towing, maintenence etc, the one thing that I do feel is pretty good is the selection of dayboats for hire. Currently some pubs even have a 'day boat only' policy during the day (See swan in Horning?) The day boats on the Southern section are a little scattered but James at WRC has an excellent setup with some really good day boats there. At Potter HW have a good selection too. I would save your money and just have fun whilst you can because I think the dayboat novelty may wear off very quickly once you buy and commit. BUT - I DO THINK THE BOAT YOU ARE LOOKING AT IS AN ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL BUY FOR THE BROADS!!!

RYB - Apart from now being Scotlands biggest tourist attraction - yep more visitors than Edinburgh Castle last year, is currently in dry dock and will be leaving in 'as good as new' condition.. why it was scrapped in the first place is anyones idea.. however, that is worth saving.... what next... saving the 'ferodo' bridge in ipswich by moving it to the town centre... or, I know lets spend a whole heap of money on a 300w lampo installed in a ball, call it art and pop it outside the college...wait a minute, they have already done that...doh! Actually RYB is a great success story. See here; http://www.royalyachtbritannia.co.uk

On the other hand you could wind a long piece of rope onto a drum and tie knots in it every 12 feet and . . . .

Hi and welcome to the forum, was really interesting looking through your photo albums! You will enjoy the Broads thats for sure Gav and Annie

Having looked into this issue a little more today, for once I have to say that I agree with Marshman as it appears that BA have only just been informed of this work schedule however GYPA had not been informed! The point is May Gurney and other contractors are expecting to work on these dates apparently and I would be very surprised if there weren't penalties if work coiled not proceed on these dates As has been said, at low water there is clearance but with heavy silting just up river, not really an option for larger craft at the moment I believe these works epitomise the society we live in today. A trendy cause (cycleways and pedestrian walkways) has been hijacked in order to further interests of a few., as if this has got genuine historic value I am sure there are more than one rail museum that would gladly accept it and turn it back into what it should be. But, whilst I am a big fan of texhnology conservation, I fail to see how NCC have been so short sighted as to not even consult with BA or reputable user groups - unless by doing so would have bought unsuccumable objections!

Yes David , sorry about my earlier iPhone edited post, agree that both the HomePort and the Raymarine software work well although I favour HomePort as once on the Garmin the route copies to the Raymarine too! Either way, as David and Perry point out, working offline on a laptop is far easier than punching it into the plotter!

James-not really impressed with seaclear it is very expensive for what it is. If it isnonly a backup you can buy the admiralty chart pack for around £70 and a GPS dongle for as little as £10 but why not then buy a good hand held GPS with marine charting as this would be handy for a grab bag? Perry. I have a Garmin plotter which is excellent as the software to do all your planning on a PC costs £29! This is supplied on an SD card which then copies the mapping from your plotter and it is as sime as just moving the Sd card back to the plotter on e you have entered the route and it automatically loads! Another benefit is that you can park routes on it that, although you may use again one day, may not for the foreseeable future! All good!

Yhis one by any chance?

Holy cow!

Interesting radio discussion recorded in in March 2010 - whilst most people were aiming to have this 'blot' removed from the landscape, Norfolk CC were already listening most heartily to the wishes of the few! http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/norfolk/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_8549000/8549471.stm

I'm not sure if that was a freudian slip or a fat finger... anyway gotta shoot, dying for a crab!

SO what was the proposed date for the Salhouse meet???

Yep, I found out about this this morning from another forum, since then been trying to get my head around what is going on. It seems the letter above was forwarded from the BA so they are definitely in the loop now but, as Stowager rightly points out, seem not to have had any input at all in the planning of these works. The schedule is only proposed however at this time but it is almost certain the works are set to go ahead. It seems as if the campaign has been very much one of providing a footway and cycleway from ASDA and the railway station to town. Odd that for another 150m approx walk there is another perfectly good bridge! More odd is the fact that the campaign leader owns the resturant right next door apparently! (see here for lots of info on the campaign http://eastcoastnet.org/transitions/vauxhall-bridge-great-yarmouth/) Alot of money has been obtained from the National Lottery fund, but it must be pointed out that SUSTRANS (Not shouting - thats an abbreviation) bave indirectly owner this for a number of years and have done nothing but let it rot! More importantly for alol hirers and owners is that, at the beginning of the season North/South transits will be impossible as there will be no transit window etc. More worrying in what happens if a hirer for instance gets as far as Yarmouth running with the current, realises there is a problem and cant stop and carreers through the scaffold? This closure seems to have a far greater impact than that of the Rail bridges as it effects all traffic.

Have just had some excerpts of the feasability study emailed... some interesting reading... 8.4 In order to further protect the existing cold riveting and the stringer platform underside the structure, an initial stripping of existing covering and re-application to BS EN ISO 12944 Parts 1-8: 1998 be considered, however, immediate protection with an interim coating would be advisable. 8.5 The outlined strike damage in 4.3 – 4.9 requires immediate rectification and further prevention ensured. The work schedule proposes the fitting of 25mm treated plywood hangers underside with joist hangers and further protecting with runners.(see 11.5) 12.2 The additional work must add a net increase to the underside of the structure of no more than 200mm with no addition of more than 300mm due to the nature of allowing navigation.

Following discussions elsewhere, and the failure of the BA to inform anyone, the River Bure will be closed to navigation from at least Wednesday 9th to Sunday 13th as work to preserve the rusting heap - Vauxhall Bridge - takes place. This follows a successful campaign led by a local resturant owner (next to the bridge). The Bridge owners Rail Walks Ltd (Part of the SUSTRANS sustainable transport charity) have secured £295,000 from the lottery FairShare Trust in order to provide a cycleway and footway. This work will also include Lowering the available air draught permanently as wooden hangers will be fitted in order to preserve the existing bolts from further damage by boats. A letter (found elsewhere) from the relevant council outlines the schedule below. Dear Sir/Madam Great Yarmouth – Vauxhall Bridge Restoration Phase 1 Advance Notice of Bridge Closure I am writing to notify you of essential repair works to the Vauxhall (old rail) Bridge over the River Bure in Great Yarmouth. These are planned for spring 2012, subject to available funds and completion of statutory processes. The location of the bridge is shown on the attached plan, drawing No. PF2002-MP-004. Vauxhall Bridge is a Victorian Grade 2 listed building of national importance, and a rare surviving example of a Fairburn type box girder construction. Originally constructed in 1850-51, it was strengthened by the addition of arched bows in 1886. Today the bridge is in poor repair, and in need of major refurbishment. The first phase of restoration will be to the eastern span (closest to Acle New Road). Along with refurbishment of the deck support beams and box girders, essential safety work will be carried out to the underside of the bridge including new wooden protective strips over the projecting bolts from the bridge hangers. In order to carry out the renovation and safety works to the underside of the bridge, scaffolding will be required in the navigable channel and the bridge closed to river traffic for a five day period in May 2012. The closure is planned to come into force during a neap tide period and run from 8am on Wednesday 9 May through to 12pm on Sunday 13 May. To keep the closure period to a minimum, 24 hour working will be adopted. During the closure, advance warning signing will be installed and a safety boat deployed on both sides of the bridge between dawn and dusk. Traffic at the Berney Arms end of Breydon Water will also be warned of the closure, so as to advice vessels that the Bure River is closed to navigation. Temporary alternative moorings on South Quay may be made available by the Great Yarmouth Port to commercial vessels from the Bure that require being on the seaward side of the Vauxhall Bridge during this period. Continuation sheet to: HI/MP/PF2002/DW Dated : 9 January 2012 -2- The closure is essential to allow the work to the underside of the bridge to be carried out safely for both the boating community and workforce. Every effort is being made to keep the closure period to the absolute minimum but please do not hesitate to contact me by any of the above means if you would like to discuss this further. Yours faithfully Project Engineer (Major Projects

Dont forget what a trim tab does as opposed to a rudder (or outdrive) Rudder (or outdrive) primary effect is to yaw the boat, the secondary effect will be roll trim tab - Primary effect roll, secondary effect is yaw Although running a single tab down it is more likely to make the boat list but secondary effect will be to to correct the yaw so you will just crap along. However, physics aside, at river speed all this is fairly negligable and you probably wont have to use a tab.. just accespt that the boat will travel at a slight angle through the water!

You could ask Reedham bridge to open, then tie it fast against the piling underneath, thereby ensuring it stays open.... I wonder if you'll get away with that for a whole summer??? Apart from that, availability will be an issue so realistically St Olaves, Brundall Bay or WRC

Actually, whether the original post was accurate or not BA have recognised that last year a higher than average number of boats required ranger assistance / rescue assistance after becoming stuck on Breydon. I recently read that there will, apparently, following a minuted point at a recent meeting (I will read through tomorrow and find it), be a revised and more comprehensive article in Broadcaster ready for the new season. As for the rest of the argument I am just watching on the sidelines, certainly James has a good day boat business at WRC but judging by the reducing number of hire craft on the Southern Broads I would think that WRC is suited more as a destination than a starting and finishing yard. They are geared up for this kind of hiring at Horning, economically changing the existing business plan involves investment at some level and now may not be the best time for that investment. What James has identified is a growing camping market and has chosen to invest in that - that is their business choice. Sadly no business is a service, they can offer a good service as a part of a business, but not hope to run a business on the back of offering a service. On the other hand, as neil rightfully points out, alot of boats are making the journey South and losing that time travelling, Reedham Quay has been much busier this last year (perceivably) and Le Boat may have assessed that there is now a need on the Southern Broads for more boats - but unless they publish their business rationale too, no one will know. maybe in these changing times legislation will come into force which will mean all business owners have to publish their wages, their dividends and the difference in pay between themselves and the lowest paid, who knows, they may have to make all their business plans public, but for now, all of that is between them, their advisors and accountants, and whilst it is prudent for business owners to listen carefully to criticism, and blatent rants (as some of these often hold common opinions), they are under no obligation to act on them in any way. If they did McDonalds would bring back the mini ribs, KFC would bring back ribs, spangles would still be in the shops, a marathon wouldn't be a snickers and I would be on a million quid a year!!

GY Virgin = Contradiction in terms!! (I'll put that in my collection with dead good and socialist worker!)

Ricco Would this boat currently for sale, have been moulded from the original mould? http://www.nya.co.uk/used-boat_1180_sealord.html

Think Jackalls is a good description - They will probably try and charge you for a phone call ! Johnny I've always founf that a fairly weak solution of G101 cleans just about everything. If all else fails! It is designed for commercially cleaning upholstery and if you buy it unbranded you can get 5 ltrs for around £10 - this dilutes enormously and will clean the outside of the boat too!