Photo of a heron

[Meantime]

11 minutes ago, ExSurveyor said:

Perhaps people were destracted by a photo of a heron.

The dilemma is, leave the photo intact and that breaks ToS,

Edit the photo and that is wrong,

Remove the photo and that is over moderation.

We can't win.

Personally and it is only my opinion I would have removed the thread as the picture was in the first post and it was being mischievious. Now the thread has been left to stand, it becomes more difficult because to remove the thread removes the contributions of a lot more people and risks upsetting more members.

For comparison I offer you a picture I took of a heron standing on the pulpit rail of a boat in 2004. I haven't removed any numbers because it is 18 years old, but even if I had taken it yesterday, should I have done so? You need to look closely because the heron disappears because of the boat in the background. I didn't realise when I took the picture that the heron was going to get lost because of the background. However I still quite like the picture because you can still see the reflection of the heron on the water and it still captures a good boating scene.

[FlyingFortress]

That actually is a cracking picture Meantime.

Very different as you say because it's hard to see the original subject but the reflection is clear 

[ExSurveyor]

Clever photo.

Taken before smartphones with a real camera I guess.

The problem with a smart phone is a lot of shots are grabbed, having turned it on, selected camera and then quickly shot.

I always find I take more considered shots with a camera.

The boat numbers are fine, even if it was taken yesterday because of the context and intention of the photo.

[FlyingFortress]

2 minutes ago, ExSurveyor said:

Clever photo.

Taken before smartphones with a real camera I guess.

The problem with a smart phone is a lot of shots are grabbed, having turned it on, selected camera and then quickly shot.

I always find I take more considered shots with a camera.

The boat numbers are fine, even if it was taken yesterday because of the context and intention of the photo.

Yeah but I think it is kind of spoiled because I don't like the type of boat in the background 🤣😂🤣

[grendel]

On 21/09/2022 at 16:04, Meantime said:

Think you should have paint shopped the boat reg number out. Name and shame and all that. Double check the Heron hasn't a ring on its leg as well in case it can be Identified. 

actually, when you read back the thread, the original poster edited the picture because of this comment, all the moderators did was replace the picture in the original post with the edited one, I dont believe we actually needed to ask the OP to do the edit, sometimes it seems the forum is self moderating. (for which the moderator team are quite grateful- we actually dont like having to step in)

[Mouldy]

Okay, I admit it, the heron was a distraction in the photo.  However, is it not a concern to boaters and boat owners on a Norfolk Broads Forum that craft are being used on the river, that potentially may not be tolled, insured or even have a valid BSS?

I realise that this is a contentious subject, but is most definitely related to The Broads and surely worthy of debate?

[grendel]

1 minute ago, FlyingFortress said:

Yeah but I think it is kind of spoiled because I don't like the type of boat in the background 🤣😂🤣

thats easy, dont look at the boat in the background 

[FlyingFortress]

1 minute ago, grendel said:

thats easy, dont look at the boat in the background 

[ExSurveyor]

1 minute ago, Mouldy said:

Okay, I admit it, the heron was a distraction in the photo.  However, is it not a concern to boaters and boat owners on a Norfolk Broads Forum that craft are being used on the river, that may not be tolled, insured or even have a valid BSS?

I realise that this is a contentious subject, but is most definitely related to The Broads and surely worthy of debate?

Yes it is a concern to many members but we can have no influence on the problem by having a trial by forum. If in doubt report these things to the BA, they have the powers to enforce the bylaws, we dont.

[grendel]

1 minute ago, Mouldy said:

Okay, I admit it, the heron was a distraction in the photo.  However, is it not a concern to boaters and boat owners on a Norfolk Broads Forum that craft are being used on the river, that may not be tolled, insured or even have a valid BSS?

I realise that this is a contentious subject, but is most definitely related to The Broads and surely worthy of debate?

you could always raise it (in a generalised way, without discussion of specific boats or identifiable pictures), in the speakers corner section- which was set up with tighter restrictions for this very purpose, where rules of debate stand and personal comments can be removed. but remember untolled boats are the Broads Authorities remit, so they should really be reported to them.

[ExSurveyor]

To bring the thread back to herons, I offer my photo of a heron.

He has guarded the pond for nearly 20 years, until this year when a brave heron landed next to him and pecked him, he fell over and the real one took 10 fish.

[Meantime]

26 minutes ago, Mouldy said:

Okay, I admit it, the heron was a distraction in the photo.  However, is it not a concern to boaters and boat owners on a Norfolk Broads Forum that craft are being used on the river, that potentially may not be tolled, insured or even have a valid BSS?

I realise that this is a contentious subject, but is most definitely related to The Broads and surely worthy of debate?

Thank you for being honest. I truly share your concerns, But there is a right and wrong way to go about such things. If you suspect a boat is not tolled, then why not report it?

During my recent 7 days afloat I witnessed boats overstaying at Sutton Staithe, Horning BA mooring and the stern on moorings at Hoveton. It is annoying particularly if you are looking to moor at one of the honeypot moorings, such as Horning. Each of the cases I witnessed not one of them was a hire boat. Some may live onboard more frequently than others and at least two were forum members. For all we know the subject of your picture may even be a forum member.

One of my gripes is over staying on moorings, but I won't post pictures here of any, or every boat I see doing it.

[Meantime]

47 minutes ago, ExSurveyor said:

Taken before smartphones with a real camera I guess.

Sort off, it was taken with a Fuli MX2700 compact. I also have a couple of Canon EOS cameras that take good pictures but I can spend days with them sitting on the seat just behind the helm and not see a Kingfisher. The trip I leave the camera behind I'll see literally dozens. 

[TFrench89]

Isn't it pure speculation to suggest the boat isn't tolled based only on your perception of the way it looks. Can we not just let people get on with their lives without the constant naming and shaming. This forum is public, some of the recent threads aren't a great advertisement for the beautiful broads. 

[Meantime]

5 minutes ago, TFrench89 said:

Isn't it pure speculation to suggest the boat isn't tolled

Not completely. The BA have a website you can go to where you can check whether a boat is tolled or not. However if it concerns someone enough, then there are more effective ways to use that information, such as contacting the BA.

[TFrench89]

1 minute ago, Meantime said:

Not completely. The BA have a website you can go to where you can check whether a boat is tolled or not. However if it concerns someone enough, then there are more effective ways to use that information, such as contacting the BA.

I only hire so wasn't aware of that website, so apologies for that. However in this specific case it's does seem like speculation. 

[Meantime]

1 minute ago, TFrench89 said:

I only hire so wasn't aware of that website, so apologies for that. However in this specific case it's does seem like speculation. 

No need for apologies. I don't think the website is that widely published, so many won't know of it, or where to find it, or feel the inclination to use it.

[TFrench89]

2 minutes ago, Meantime said:

No need for apologies. I don't think the website is that widely published, so many won't know of it, or where to find it, or feel the inclination to use it.

I certainly won't be searching for it, I'm not particularly concerned if boats owners can't afford their tolls. There's millions of people struggling at the minute. 

[ScrumpyCheddar]

Here’s mine from 2 and half weeks ago ..  Please excuse the cannabis plants in the background 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[Mouldy]

23 minutes ago, TFrench89 said:

I certainly won't be searching for it, I'm not particularly concerned if boats owners can't afford their tolls. There's millions of people struggling at the minute. 

It concerns me in the same way that, as a motorist, there are cars on the road that are uninsured, have no MOT and haven’t paid their road find licence.

Agreed, many people are struggling, but if I couldn’t afford to run my car, I wouldn’t use it illegally.  The same should apply to river users.  My opinion obviously, to which I am entitled.  You may think differently.

[TFrench89]

1 minute ago, Mouldy said:

It concerns me in the same way that, as a motorist, there are cars on the road that are uninsured, have no MOT and haven’t paid their road find licence.

Agreed, many people are struggling, but if I couldn’t afford to run my car, I wouldn’t use it illegally.  The same should apply to river users.  My opinion obviously, to which I am entitled.  You may think differently.

These boats may be their only home, so what do you suggest they do? They've most likely had the boat for years, do you know for certain that this boat isn't tolled?

[Mouldy]

7 minutes ago, TFrench89 said:

These boats may be their only home, so what do you suggest they do? They've most likely had the boat for years, do you know for certain that this boat isn't tolled?

I have checked the relevant website.  As far as only home is concerned, if you live in a house, you pay council tax, if you live in a caravan on a site, you have to pay for the privilege.  Live on a boat, pay what’s required to be legal.

I wonder what would happen to The Broads if we all went ‘off grid?’

[TFrench89]

3 minutes ago, Mouldy said:

I have checked the relevant website.  As far as only home is concerned, if you live in a house, you pay council tax, if you live in a caravan on a site, you have to pay for the privilege.  Live on a boat, pay what’s required to be legal.

I wonder what would happen to The Broads if we all went ‘off grid?’

Some people literally have no means to pay the toll. So I'm assuming your suggestion is to make themselves homeless. I think it's probably best if we agree to disagree on this one. 

[ExSurveyor]

I never understood why the toll checker website and the car tax site was made public. In this day and age they must realise it would cause problems. The rangers  know by now who hasn't paid, I have seen enough ranger boats in marinas and checking boats on the river, also the flurry of notices fixed on craft. 

It is the BA who enforce action not a forum.

Would anyone highlight an untaxed car on their local area forum or group, doubt it, if they were that concerned they would contact the appropriate authority. Why is the Broads different.

[Smoggy]

Toll issues are for the BA, insurance and bss is purely speculation and I doubt the BA would tell you, and would I be right in thinking the spot in question is not an official mooring in which case there is no case of overstaying as no time limit, in fact anyone using it is potentially trespassing on private land even if the land owner doesn't mind.

It's only an issue for the BA and landowner, the rest of us are just sticking our noses into someone elses life just because we may not like the look of the boat or would like to use the spot they are on.

Live and let live, move on, nothing to see, well except a heron that doesn't seem to care (or is it a BA spy heron?).