MEMORY LANE

[Joshly]

Would anybody be interested in creating and maintaining a log of Broads Boats?

I am aware of such a registry, boat reg number and location, but I feel it could be improved if the list was by name and people could send in holiday photos of great times they had, or boats people own and dates.

That way we could track from the date of build to the present day.

I remember my first hire boat 'Brink of Peace', with my future Mother-in Law, good name. Night fishing on Barton Broad back in 1963.

Then sticking with the same boatyard, 'Brink of Eden' right up to 'Brinks Empress in the 70's!

I was due to have my honeymoon on a motor sailer, one of the few in the late 60's with a grp hull, but the boatyard caught fire a week before and had to take out a Freeman27.

Then the beautiful Moores boats, before getting my own vessel, a very neglected Snapdragon. Many tales there!

Many of the people I come across now weren't even alive in those days so don't understand how it was!

These boats are like classic cars and should not be forgotten.

Anybody up for it?

[JennyMorgan]

Josh, if you haven't done so already have a peep at Craig's database:

http://www.broads.org.uk/wiki/index.php5?title=Main_Page

We are now in an age of 'blogs', an excellent innovation!

Really a case of linking the two, perhaps having a chat with Craig & suggesting the addition of links from database to the relevant blogs is the way forward.

 

By the way, good to see you becoming involved in the wider forum.

Snapdragons, I know them well, I used to skipper one as a charter boat, a l o n g time ago now!

[MauriceMynah]

Joshly, If you have photo's of those older craft, I'm sure Craig would welcome them with open arms in his database.

[Joshly]

My Snapdragon was a real pain.

I bought it from a yard on the Northern Broads and had many mechanical failures,

I recall one trip down to Cantley and on the way back, under power, having to row a dingy towing it back through Reedham bridge, against the tide, because the carb had dropped off the back of the engine.

That was in the days of Jimmy Pearson running his boatyard at Reedham, before the hurricane blew his boat shed in!

I did spot it many years later having its hull rebuilt due to osmosis!

Can't remember its name at present, will try to find some old photos, it had a dark green hull and was 23ft long I believe and bilge keel.

We all have to start somewhere, it was hard work to sail but good experience.

My time also included a spell racing on the Bure with the Northern Rivers Sailing Club,NRSC, anybody any experience of that club?

[Joshly]

Oh, by the way, nice to be chatting on a sensible subject!!!

[MauriceMynah]

These are the Snapdragons (23 ft) I found on Craigs list. Any of them your one?

 

552S  photo available                             El Shaddi           Private Yachts      Snapdragon 23

618D  similar photo available                  It's Magic II         Private Yachts     Snapdragon 23

F143  similar photo available                  Magic Dragon    Private Yachts      Snapdragon 23

123A  (191) similar photo available        Spindle               Private Yachts     Snapdragon 23

A991  (180) similar photo available        Sunray               Private Cruisers   Snapdragon 23

S615  (SD99) photo available                 Water Bunting    Private Yachts      Snapdragon 23

[Joshly]

I don't recognise the Snapdragon names, It has probably been renamed since. Need to find some old photos!

My honeymoon boat was Fair Knight, a Freeman 22 I now realise, out of Norfolk Knights boatyard in Horning, following their fire. Was supposed to hire a new fibreglass sailing cruiser but it was not ready till mid week so got to use two boats.

Good old days!

[ranworthbreeze]

Hello Joshly,

 

In our useful links section of the forum we have three boat searching sites, for more information please see the following link:-

http://www.thenorfolkbroads.net/forum/forum/250-boat-listings/

Regards

Alan

[Joshly]

Hi Alan & Co, thanks for the link.

Can you advise, if I wanted to live on a boat, in a marina basin or similar designed for living on board, where would I go on the Broads?

Thanks.

[JawsOrca]

Joshly, I know a few people living on the broads, although as far as I know there are no residential berths on the broads.. If you are discrete some yards will allow you although may still not allow you to collect post.. Manko is a residential boater (I think JillR is too) so hopefully they will notice this and can advise further. I'm residential but on the medway and it's a bit more permitted down here.

[Baitrunner]

Hi Joshly,

A bit before my time on the old boats, but very interesting. Love that boat name though - hope it wasn't an omen

[JennyMorgan]

The Waveney River Centre at Burgh St Peter has a few long term residential boaters moored in its marina. 

[ranworthbreeze]

Hi Joshly,

I know there are some on the Tingdene Marina and there are the house boats going into Bells Marina, as Mark says you may have to have a look around the many small boat yards on the road past The Yare.

Regards

Alan

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

Hi Joshy,

 

Back in 72, my dad hired a Snapdragon 24 mk1 on Lake Windemere (from Bowness, Windemere Lake Holidays Afloat) Lovely boat with loads of space for 3 adults to sleep on, though there was my dad, me, and my 2 brothers. That was the single keel version, which actually sailed quite well for what was really a motorsailer. She had more room onboard than many up to date boats of the same size, and was more spacious than many larger boats of her day. Large heads comp that you actually stand and sit in, AND still close the door. A great boat, which we all enjoyed, and one i would still have today. I also thought they would be good boats to sail the broads, with the shallower twin keel variation.

[Baitrunner]

I know we have a member on the forum who is a live aboard. Maybe if they read this they will make a post.

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

I forgot to add, they were also rigged with a tabernacle mounted mast, which i believe were standard. Absoluely ideal for the broads really.

[MauriceMynah]

Joshly, do you have any photos of Brink of Eden?

[Hylander]

Joshly I know it would probably go against the grain but St Olaves Marina has several liveaboards.     I know that because that is where we are. They are an asset in my opinion as they are always an addition to the extremely good security there.   Having the eyes and ears of a liveaboard who are there on the spot is useful to anyone chancing their arm.    You never know these days.

[JennyMorgan]

I had refrained from mentioning St Olave's Marina but it is a fact that there are several liveaboards there, not least the narrow boats in the Cut. I agree entirely with Hylander about the security that these folk offer plus, I must add, is the general helpfulness and friendliness that I've received from the liveaboards at Oulton Broad for example.

[Joshly]

Wow, what a great response, thanks!

I mention this because I have always wanted to retire to a boat on the Broads where I can relax and fish and do boat things.

My brother had a MTB on Beeston Canal off the Trent, it was a big beast but being made of ply, I believe, it needed constant attention

Living in this area I am disappointed to see that there is such poor support for living aboard, it is almost seen as a crime, driving people off the water, trying to remove their community.

I don't want the waterways to look like Riverside Road in Norwich but if marinas were set up with full facilities and a code of conduct it would be no different to the Travelling Community facilities that Councils have to provide!

This thought came about with the research we had to do to identify who owns the river bed, being the Crown Estates for tidal watercourses, as identified in the recent Case Law.

The boat owner was threatened by the BWB, in my view because he was living aboard his boat. If it had been a non residential boat I expect they would not have contested the situation.

So why is it that the BA have such restrictions for living aboard?

Those with private moorings have to apply for planning permission to live aboard, why is that so different to using your boat every week end to take a break?

Must be something to do with providing a greater revenue stream!

I don't think it to try to keep the waterway tidier!!!

[JawsOrca]

I have a feeling this may get heated...! I understand that some houseboats look a mess (trust me ours does at the moment lol but that's because we are far too busy with the other boat and life!) I know people that live on very nice expensive cruisers and these don't look a mess (it's next on the list!!). So it isn't fair to say that all houseboats look untidy (Joshy.. I'm preempting the replies! I note you haven't mentioned this ).

 

You also get the good and the bad in every walk of live.. I'm a computer programmer, in our residential marina (where we pay council tax and are reconised as residents) we have lawyers, policemen, millionaire business owners etc we also have the odd problem person but our marina quickly puts them in their place! Our marina is a very safe and friendly place to be.. people will do all they can to help each other so I for one will never return to land .

 

I think the broads are special, I think any reluctance for liveaboards on the broads is only because people want to keep the broads special and natural.. Although with house prices so high I do believe we will see more liveaboards here in the UK.. probably not to the extent in holland.  

 

I don't know anything about the BA's policy so can't comment... 

 

(Please people keep it friendly).  

[ranworthbreeze]

Wow, what a great response, thanks!

I mention this because I have always wanted to retire to a boat on the Broads where I can relax and fish and do boat things.

My brother had a MTB on Beeston Canal off the Trent, it was a big beast but being made of ply, I believe, it needed constant attention

Living in this area I am disappointed to see that there is such poor support for living aboard, it is almost seen as a crime, driving people off the water, trying to remove their community.

I don't want the waterways to look like Riverside Road in Norwich but if marinas were set up with full facilities and a code of conduct it would be no different to the Travelling Community facilities that Councils have to provide!

This thought came about with the research we had to do to identify who owns the river bed, being the Crown Estates for tidal watercourses, as identified in the recent Case Law.

The boat owner was threatened by the BWB, in my view because he was living aboard his boat. If it had been a non residential boat I expect they would not have contested the situation.

So why is it that the BA have such restrictions for living aboard?

Those with private moorings have to apply for planning permission to live aboard, why is that so different to using your boat every week end to take a break?

Must be something to do with providing a greater revenue stream!

I don't think it to try to keep the waterway tidier!!!

Hello Joshly,

 

The Broads Authority must monitor the 24 hour mooring spots especially in the season, I am not too sure they are as strict over the winter, out of season we see a few very old boats (that have seen better days) on the public moorings.

You also see a few boats that are obviously live aboards that are moored on private land.

 

On the canal system there are long term moorings on the tow path that are rented out by Canal & River Trust (BWB) at most village locations as well as private moorings on the none tow path side and of course there are the many new marina's that have been built in the last decade.

 

You are correct there is no reference at all regarding the residential mooring on the Broads Authority website.

 

I wish you well if you go down this route.

 

Regards

Alan

[JennyMorgan]

The recent boat fire aboard a well past its end of life due date up on the Ant is probably as good an example as any as to why the Authority is so against live-aboards. 

[Joshly]

As you say, its no different to all walks in society, some are bothered, others less so!

I had a holiday on the Trent and the narrow boats were a picture. They tend to be owned by people who are concerned about producing the right image even so there is an unpleasant difference of opinion between the 'Plastic Buckets' and the 'Skips' as I am informed they get called.

Quite a lot of narrowboat owners seem to live aboard and cruise the waterways throughout the year.

I would prefer this lifestyle, having a base but cruising around the waterway, meeting friends, eating well, a drink or two, some fishing and photography.

I wonder how difficult it would be to get planning permission to change the use of a bought mooring to residential?

Certainly sounds better than ending up on a residential caravan park waiting for you know what!

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

Last year and the year before, we hired and stayed on the southern rivers. Both times we went up the Yare to Norwich, and past some really scruffy looking boat with tarpd over it, and the stack smoking away, and moored next to an old shack. Rightly or wrongly, it gave me a bad impression, purely because of the appearance, which some people might find a bit intimidating.

 

That`s one big issue that Liveaboards could consider to make themselves more acceptable to a wider audience, simply by smartening up their boats. 

 

When Jill had her boat in Norwich, she and her other half had put in a lot of time to restore the exterior to its former glory, and she did a good job too. But when you cruised past her mooring, there were several other really scruffy boats there, and one which would be sunk and raised almost weekly.

 

With things like that going on, it reasonable for someone to assume that if they can`t be bothered to look after their own property, then they`re hardly like to look after someone elses.

 

That said, there are lots of liveaboards on the Thorpe River Green stretch who have some extremely smart and well looked after boats, which gives the total opposite impression, being a good one, resulting in public tolerence.

 

There are many undesireable looking residential housebouts around, and many stunning examples, but it`s always the (the few?) undesireable ones that give the bad impression which is what people seem to remember the most.

 

Having grown up in North Kent, and reularly being around the beach area near Alan (Jaws Orca) , i`ve seen many of the houseboats in the marinas etc, and its always the scruffy ones i remember.

 

Abit of a sad thing really, but that`s human nature.