Sabre 28 - Cruiser - Project

[JawsOrca]

OK thats all nice and easy then! I've not seen the fan in the box before although I doubt we will replace the little alternator on the engine so we shouldn't get to 150 amps thanks everyone.. I guess theres plenty of places on the broads to get the little 3kg gas bottles?

[Guest]

My boat has been through two successful BSS tests with different examiners, and my batteries are as Diesel Falcon has said.

 

They're in non-airtight standard battery boxes, with no separate ventilation or fans.

 

The examiners were quite happy, as the engine bay is very well vented anyway, and being a petrol boat, it has bilge blowers that are used each time the engine is started.

[JawsOrca]

@Strowager.. You have one very tidy engine bay!! In that case I suspect ours will be ok as per yours considering the engine bay is almost the same size of cabin, Although we don't have blowers Im thinking of putting more air vents in anyway.

 

Day 22.

 

Nice early start (Like 8am - I was asleep in the car!).

 

We have certainly decided to swap the volvo leg for something a bit smaller. Our friend in the yard had a "spares/repair" sonic 100 leg which had come off a boat which only been used a few hours before being laid up (afloat) for some years. So we grabbed this for a bargain price.. Although its a bit pitted in places so we need to have a play... he brought two and had used the other for years with no problems.. but we may want to replace to steering yoke bit.. although on closer inspection it doesn't seem too bad.. worse case we will just use the transom plate and look for another leg and keep as spares. But I'm happy to go with a sonic drive as its still in production and parts seem ok... 

 

So, We started trying put the volvo leg on the boat for ebay pictures.. Nice and pretty looking we thought.. after an hour we gave up and I took pictures of it on the ground... (Now I know why they have a special part for installing the bloody thing).

 

As it was a lovely warm day! I then worked (hard) to get the leaky front cabin window out.. Someone had previously installed with sikaflex but hadn't got a perfect seal so although the frames where glued in most places there were areas where they wasn't but it took me a good two hours to remove the window.. I used a filler spatula which I rounded the corners off (I read this somewhere). After slipping a few times I worked out why you round the corners off (save stabbing yourself). So millimetre by millimetre I got it free.. Although it then took me another couple of hours to clean it up.. Thankfully silicon eater jel helped too.  Also thankfully the actual seal between the frame and the glass is fine so it was just a matter of removing and replace. Again using abroseal butyl based sealant the window went in nice and smoothly.

 

Dave worked hard to remove the newly installed transom (I couldn't hear him swearing though as I was up the front..) but the interzone epoxy is as hard as concrete so it was hard.. He has almost finished though so hopefully he will start to replace tomorrow.  

 

We was going to the essex boat jumble but we wont bother as dave wants to get further with the transom and I guess I'll do the other window.. We also have Kent boat jumble in a couple of weeks..

 

Sorry no pictures today... I know pictures make this a nicer read so I will get some tomorrow.. although theres not really any noticable changes at the moment.

 

(message me if you are interested in the volvo sterndrive)

[JawsOrca]

Day 23.

 

I'll be try and a bit shorter today.. I seemed to rabit on a bit yesterday.

 

So Today, dave started to glass up the hole in the transom.. it will take a couple of days though as the hull itself is quite thick so it needs to be built up. I went round the hull and had a bit of a poke.. Up close it doesn't seem too bad there a few (not a lot!) scratches, the of few broken blisters in the gel coat.. I also inspected a nasty repair on the port side it appears someone had managed to split the towrail away from the deck.. (god only knows how as it looks very strong if you ask me!).. We need a good weekend to tackle this (I was hoping it was a split on the deck as we can easily access this.. But not this bit (typical!)...

 

I started repairing the bow where a shackle was screwed through.. we don't want this so thats come off and I'll slowly build up and repair (again will take some time but it will look perfect when I'm finished with it (and ready for me to whack the hell out of it on my first few times out...!).

 

We also discussed (this means argue by the way) where the tanks will go.. all are going under the wheelhouse floor in the engine bay.. Dave will make up the supports in the next few weekends. I also cut a couple more battens for the cabin ceiling and decided we aren't going too high up but some of the glass on these battens will need cleaning up as its too unsmooth really (dave struggled with the laws of gravity glassing these in - and me ordering 300g fibreglass!).

 

Finally with the help of our mate Ricky, we tried to unseize the new sonic sterndrive.. (Its been left in soak for a week..) it moved a little...

 

Pictures attached

[diesel falcon]

Hi, Alan,

i am afraid i don,t like the look of that drive , i think you,ll have to strip the bearing s out of it and replace them,if it,s got that much corrosion the races will be pitted?, and that blow lamp?  ok if your dismantling it but burning causes carbon deposits, not what you need in a gearbox.

[JawsOrca]

It does need stripping down.. i'm not sure if its going to be used just yet.. It was pretty much a freebie so we are just playing with it at the moment. It such a shame though as its only had 10 hours use and its like new inside.. shame the gear there is a bit stuck though...

[quo vadis]

Had a spot of bother with my gearbox 2 weeks ago all mended now

[JawsOrca]

Had a spot of bother with my gearbox 2 weeks ago all mended now

Is that a steam engine what boat have you got? looks like a tug boat lol

[JawsOrca]

Day 24.

 

A nice early start. We had the van today as we needed a sheet of ply to rebuild the transom (after deciding not to go with the volvo leg).  So £60 from travis perkins for crappy far eastern ply (although its only being used on the transom). Whilst we had the van we also grab some insulation and cable trunking.

 

So dave managed to replace the transom so its all complete once again (he still needs to do some grp repairs outside so he will do that tomorrow if its not raining).  We also finished off glassing the roof beams in and coated the other bulkhead beams in resin. Finally we took the port side window out as I guessed that it wasn't bedded in properly.. which it wasn't it came straight out and took 30 mins to clean up and went back in a matter of seconds. 

 

Couple of pics attached (including a rare picture of me.. albeit my back).

 

[JawsOrca]

Day 25.

 

Today was a short day but it felt like we got a ton of work done!

 

We got there really early for once (dave lost his key and couldnt separated my key from my car key so he had to wait for me, although I was ready for 8.30 - Doesn't happen that often). We started taking the other front window out.. I started with the gentle approach but wasn't getting anywhere.. Dave came along with the claw happen and managed to do really well.. Once again it was stuck in with silkaflex.. but although it was hard to remove it was barely making a seal.  

 

I cleaned up whilst dave took the bulkheads down and installed the insulation. (It is just polystyrene and we know all about how flammable it is.. however in all reality if theres a fire afloat flammable insulation is the least of the worries). The boat looks huge without the bulkheads though and they will probably stay down for a bit as the next step (after the hose pipe test) is side lining.

 

So after putting the window back in. We took a hammer to the sonic outdrive and thankfully managed to un-seized the gear selector for the dog clutch. Leaving in oil for a week clearly worked!.. after now turning by hand the bearings seemed a bit stiff.. So we took the bottom bit off and it seems like the watertight seal just needs replacing...! We will sandblast the casing over the coming weeks though (as the case isn't brilliant.. its slightly pitted) and repaint..

 

Early finish though as we keep getting calls from people wanting to look at Jessica (The other boat) but same day so Dave went over to her to just make sure shes tidy.. Refit the batteries and try the engine so next time I can show people round and run everything up.. Hopefully we will have viewings from next week.. (Although sunday is Kent boat jumble!).

[JawsOrca]

HI All,

 

I've got a couple of questions which ars running round in my head at the moment and I wonder if anyone can answer for me

 

1. I'm looking at doing 6mm foam backed sidelined, Does anyone anyone recommend a good glue to glue the material onto the fiberglass (Obviously this will be heavy stuff and the last thing I want is it to peel off).

2. For the bulkhead walls I understand that if they are single layer they should be at least 12mm (we are going for oak faced.. should be lovely!). Does this sound correct and thick enough?  Annoyingly though I don't like seeing cables running (and as we don't have height in the ceiling we need to mount lighting on the walls) therefore I'm going to need to have double walls with a battern gap in middle where the cables can be hidden. Do you think I therefore get away with 6mm walls (although the last thing I want to do is have wobberly walls!).. I'm thinking maybe come up to 10mm for these double walls?

3. Does anyone know what material I use in the shower-room/Loo (Sorry I don't like using the nautical words), Robbins timber do a laminate but I'm not sure if that's the best thing to use?

 

Thanks in advance,

[ranworthbreeze]

Hello Alan,

 

Have a look at this supplier to see if anything is suitable.

 

http://www.penn-elcom.com/default.asp?PN=Fibreglass%20Laminated%20Panels

 

Regards

Alan

[JawsOrca]

Thanks Alan, Theres some good looking bits on there.

 

Day 26.

 

Not much happened today, we worked out the though that the wheelhouse will get very hot in the 18dc march heat so the aim is to fit some skylights at some point. In the cabin though with the little bits of insulation though it was cooler, which is already a good start.

 

Dave worked on repairing the port aft gunwall/toerail/deck which has some serious damage, the crack is about 6feet long and I can't quite understand how the damaged happened.. I can only guess that at some point something hit it and rode over the toerail.. but its a straight cut.. Dave got a bit of glass on the outside and it will need glassing on the inside altohugh access is tight and it will take a bit of work to make strong and tidy.  We also did some other hull repairs; more glass on the d shackle which was on the bow and dave added more glass on the hole on the transom.  I tied up a bit in the cabin and did some minor prep work for the side lining.

 

Kent boat jumble tomorrow.

[muzbaz]

 

 

To be honest, they always had me really worried, and I changed them out as quickly as I could.  They seem as though they could easily be snapped off if banged from above by accident, possibly sinking the boat.

 

They potentially could crack and fracture if frozen water set in them. Lastly, they are more difficult to check or clear, often being below the water level and with minimal gauze area.

 

By contrast, the Vetus ones are very robustly made, (even though plastic), and the lid is very thick, closing on a very meaty O ring with a sturdy thread.  They can be fitted easily above the water line so that they can be opened and cleaned without panic (     ).  It's worth mentioning that they are available in a number of sizes, and the bigger ones are more robust than the smallest.

 

They also have a much larger gauze filter surface area so are less likely to block, and the transparent lid enables visual checking while running.

 

 

I have been reading this thread with great interest, well done so far to Alan (and your engine room buddy) and all that want to assist with their in depth knowledge.

 

Strowager, the raw water filter you pictured is what we have on our boat, on our previous boat too, but the were different as the stop cock on the current boat is after the filter as your pic show's, so when we winterized we had to pour quite a bit of antifreeze through until we could be sure of a good mix, so we then closed the valve we poured some in the filter tubed and closed the top, but it worried me that the mix in the filter tube could weaken and get a freeze there. The weather was kind this year so no worries, but do you know why they were designed this way, did we do all we could to avoid freezing, I'm now thinking of swapping it out to a different design when she comes out next. Your thoughtsplease?

[Guest]

I have been reading this thread with great interest, well done so far to Alan (and your engine room buddy) and all that want to assist with their in depth knowledge.

 

Strowager, the raw water filter you pictured is what we have on our boat, on our previous boat too, but the were different as the stop cock on the current boat is after the filter as your pic show's, so when we winterized we had to pour quite a bit of antifreeze through until we could be sure of a good mix, so we then closed the valve we poured some in the filter tubed and closed the top, but it worried me that the mix in the filter tube could weaken and get a freeze there. The weather was kind this year so no worries, but do you know why they were designed this way, did we do all we could to avoid freezing, I'm now thinking of swapping it out to a different design when she comes out next. Your thoughtsplease?

 

 

I may have misunderstood your question Muzbaz, but here's a more detailed explanation of how I adapted the intake system with that filter on my boat.

 

The cooling water intake was via the Volvo 290 outdrive leg, rather than a conventional through hull fitting.

 

This was piped directly to the Jabsco cooling pump intake, with no shut off valves at all, which is the standard way those engine drives are installed. 

 

That gave a number of disadvantages, namely:

• No filtration of the water drawn in, and made even worse by the fact that it's a raw cooled engine, so all the muck and weed was actually circulating through the engine block etc..
• No visible signs of water flow
• no means of introducing anti freeze 
• the closed intake piping made it difficult to break the syphon effect when draining the engine blocks whilst afloat.

I therefore installed the Vetus remote filter/weed trap about 6" above water level, and ran a new outlet hose to the intake nozzle of the jabsco pump.  I then connected the filter intake to the outdrive leg with a clear reinforced hose.

 

The Volvo outdrive leg cooling intake pipe is a heavy gauge stainless steel pipe that rises vertically to just above water level.

 

So now, when I Winterise, I unscrew the lid of the filter to break the syphon, and loosen the four brass draintaps on the engtine to drain the coolant into the bilge, (it's just plain river water). I then loosen the cover of the Jabsco pump to drain the water from that.

 

So I don't use any antifreeze at all, because there's no water left in it. (the drain plugs are designed to be at the lowest points).. The only water left in is in the heavy gauge stainless steel pipe upstand from the leg. I can't empty it or get any antifreeze in it because it's open at the leg end with no way to seal it off.

[JawsOrca]

I just want to update this as its been some time since I did.

 

Basically we have been away from the boat for a bit as this boat (Orca) is a distance from the other boat (Jessica), and we started getting lots of interest in the other boat. So we thought its best to make ourselves available on the Jessica and just do some tidying up.  So thankfully as you may have seen, this finally paid off and last weekend and we sold Jessica!!! Unfortunately though she is still sitting here and the buyers want us to deliver her to her new home in queenbourgh (1 1/2 hours sail away) which we will probably do a week on saturday (if its sunny... dead calm seas... no rain... perfect tides between 11-12pm lol!.. no we want Jessica to go to her new home asap really as they want to use her).

 

In the meantime though we haven't abandoned poor Orca (well maybe a little!), we have done a few bits; We stripped the sterndrive down and all bearings and parts were unseized and it looks unused inside, which is good! We need some parts and we picked up a spares/repair unit on ebay to scavenge steering bits which where missing or damaged on our main unit. Plus we've brought a sand blaster (and given a air pressure machne to go with it) to use and clean up the unit which we will do in the coming weeks. We also brought some bits at the local boat jumble and went over to Essex looking for headlining but didn't find any (internet order!).

 

We have also had a good chat with the yacht club mooring chaps and now have a bright shiny green light to bring Orca over (The yacht club is about 2 steps from our houseboat! so we will be able to work 24/7 (heaven forbid!)) We want Jessica's hard standing spot though as she's visible from the kitchen window (and I can hurl abuse at anyone who goes near!) Unfortunately though the clubs travel hoist will be maxed out by Orca though so it will take some careful planning! (The hoist is only 10.6 wide and so is Orca! so we need a big tide and a bit of luck!)

 

We also sold the volvo sterndrive and spare tanks on ebay so now the boat (Orca's) fund is loaded up and ready for me to spend! 

 

Anyway back to Orca this weekend, I need to prepare the walls for side lining and get it ordered, Dave needs to finish the repaired transom and get the engine installed (I need to order remaining spares from Sillette, ASAP supplies, vetus, ebay, etc etc!)

[Gracie]

Hi Alan

 

Congratulations on selling Jessica, been following this thread with interest not that I understand the Technical bits though lol.

 

Enjoy your sail, stay safe

 

Grace

[JawsOrca]

Thanks Grace  

 

I hope you are using and enjoying your new purchase too.  Parts of the upper medway are very pretty (although as I said its worth coming down to Rochester at least once (the landing there is very secure

 

Best wishes,

[Gracie]

Very much enjoying it thank you Alan, hopefully come down to Rochester one day (when a bit more confident) and I'll let you buy me a pint 

 

It is very pretty where we are but not keen on the locks, used them before on a holiday to the Yorkshire Ouse, although exciting at first got fed up with them after two weeks, bloody hard work lol.

 

Grace

[JawsOrca]

Pint certainly on us .. we can extend the visit to the yacht club (Hoo Ness) although your boat needs to take to the mud which isn't fun with a cruiser.  It is well worth a visit pass allington though even if you come as far as Rochester.  

 

We had a couple of weekends up there in family boat and I found the locks to be something different and unusual (after being on the broads all the time)..it also braked up the day.. but yes I can't say I'd rather be there instead of the broads though.. the lack of public moorings are a big pain (unless you ignore the rule about mooring by the locks)..but its better than nothing

 

Are you aiming on relocating the boat up to Norfolk?

[Gracie]

Have'nt really thought about it to be honest, its very handy on the Medway as we are only just over an hour away on a good run so great for weekends and I think I can just about put up with the locks if it means being afloat.

 

Can you wild moor on the Medway, like you can on the Broads?

 

Grace

[JawsOrca]

Our plan for Orca is to do  a week around Easter next year on the Medway (Non tidal) then do two weeks on the Thames (You can motor around which is apparently an amazing trip and well worth doing if you are on the medway - If you are interested I may try and arrange a convoy with a couple of boat you are welcome to join in (we should oxford and back in 2 weeks.. it will feel a bit safer then) then we will take the boat to norfolk for the following year and keep her there. As you say the Medway is brill for weekends but too small for 2 weeks but certainly don't move if you are happy... just move about when you get bored of it.   

 

You can't really moor wildly, the only reason you can semi-safely do on the broads is because alot of boats do it and as such they have identified the safe spots/worn away underwater obstructions over use! You may notice too the bank sides on the medway haven't been worn out because no one does it.. Again no one does it because the medway is poorly maintained (the BA do, do a good job at marking underwater hazards). We hit a submerged tree at wateringbury and only we was only 2 feet water draft - (If you want to do this maybe install a fish finder as this gives you a idea of what the bottom is like) . The banks of the medway are also privately owned so you will see "No mooring" signs everywhere deterring you from doing it. Although there maybe the odd spot so maybe talk to other boaters based up there as they may know.. I think alot of them moor either at their home bases or on the lock landing platforms etc.  As I say mooring on the Medway is a big negative. (when we was up there we just went back to the marina each day - We were based at Bow bridge or Yalding). 

[Gracie]

Thank you for that Alan, very informative, sorry to have hijacked your thread

 

Grace

[JawsOrca]

Back to work today! 

 

I'm going to give up with the day count..! Keep reading why.

 

So back to the boat after 3 weeks and we didn't do a whole lot this weekend. Although dave finished filling the hole in the transom for the volvo leg! (big hole though). He also glued up a bit of timber which I'll use to mount the curtain rails. Also we worked on the leg housing, removing the oil seals and an anode.  We also tried to work out where the sillette/sonic transom mount should go, although no one is 100% certain so I've sent an email off to sillette asking them.

 

However we also tidied up as I've booked a lorry to come and take move the boat over to the yacht club now Jessica has sold. This is pencilled in for easter. It's a hiab lorry so its a nice quick easy job (expensive but its worth while). I've had to carefully work out how to prop it this side as we have to do ourselves and we need to be positioned so we can move the boat on the clubs travel hoist.. This is still in progress and will take some thought but Orcas only a light thing.. We both can't wait to get the boat over here as its about 50 meters from home! and we can work 24/7 and the rest of the work will be done before we know it! (hence a day count on the blog would now be impossible - I'll try and do a weekly update though).

 

Next weekend we are aiming on delivering Jessica so probably no Orca next week...

[Gracie]

Good luck with delivering Jessica next week, hope the weather stays good for you, let us know how it goes

 

Grace