Hickling Broad

[Guest]

As the matter being discussed is the change in the headroom that now exists at the bridge is it not reasonable to consider it possible that the amount of rise and fall has also changed. Whilst those of us who have known and loved the broads for many years, also hold the Hamiltons in high regard, we have to accept that the information is now somewhat out of date. This gives some weight to the arguments in favour of a thorough dredging regime. (in my far from humble opinion)

 

Poor old Claude....

 

Ok, how about the actual measured rise and fall today then ?

 

The nearest EA level gauge at Repps (about half a mile from the bridge), showed a rise and fall of 10" this morning......

[MauriceMynah]

I honestly can never understand why it is that what I read from official documents differs so greatly from what I actually witness!

Generally speaking the bridge gauge shows the level to be between 6' and 6'6". Rarely is it 5'9" and equally rarely is it 7' This doesn't seem to align with any of the official figures

 

"The pilots will indeed confirm that there's often a very insignificant rise and fall for days or weeks on end, depending on variable conditions."

 

Yes, That's what I find too. Dare I say that the actual rise and fall is very rarely "average"

Which of the averages do they use? mean mode or arithmetic?

[Guest]

I noticed on the Bridge Heights thread that Alan has updated his table.

 

In case anyone might find it difficult to open that word document I tried to upload a PDF version of it, but the system won't allow it on that thread, so here it is via this thread.

Bridge heights.pdf

[Guest]

I honestly can never understand why it is that what I read from official documents differs so greatly from what I actually witness!

Generally speaking the bridge gauge shows the level to be between 6' and 6'6". Rarely is it 5'9" and equally rarely is it 7' This doesn't seem to align with any of the official figures

 

"The pilots will indeed confirm that there's often a very insignificant rise and fall for days or weeks on end, depending on variable conditions."

 

Yes, That's what I find too. Dare I say that the actual rise and fall is very rarely "average"

Which of the averages do they use? mean mode or arithmetic?

 

How many times a year do you look at the gauge MM ? (out of the 700 or so "ranges")

 

The EA gauge at Repps is an electronic sensor that is accurate to the mm of the actual river level, so a far better "witness" than any of us.

 

...and last night's actual tide range was just over 12", as the graph shows.

[MauriceMynah]

 I look at the gauge most occasions I'm out on the boat, pretty much a monthly occurrence. This has been the case for quite a while. Only once have I seen it approaching 7' (which was last Friday 20th in the evening at 18:00) and only on a couple of occasions do I recollect it being under 6'.

So, No! I cannot, hand on heart, say I monitor the height closely enough to claim to be an expert,

What I can claim however is that ...

A. I agree with your quote from the pilots, and  that

B. my personal experience seems to be at odds with the EA's hyper accurate records.

[Matt]

Having seen MM shoot the bridge in his boat I reckon he does more than look at the gauge!

[ranworthbreeze]

 

I noticed on the Bridge Heights thread that Alan has updated his table.

 

In case anyone might find it difficult to open that word document I tried to upload a PDF version of it, but the system won't allow it on that thread, so here it is via this thread.

 

Hi Strowager,

I have updated the topic with your PDF,

Regards

Alan

[LondonRascal]

Hickling is a very special part of the Broads to me.  It is where I first came to the Broads as a baby staying in a caravan near the Broad and my parents taking his day boat to Potter Heigham for provisions - as the years past so we returned.  Some of my first memories are of summer days on Hickling Broad, day boats, water gurgling from prop wash, gas lamps and the spiders in the shed which had the toilet one had to use outside the caravan!  It would take until I was almost 13 for us to return as a family on a boat - a Bermuda, then a chilly windswept grey autumn going over the Broad with spray being kicked up from the waves hitting the bow.

 

There is always much debate about this area and that of course will never rest because there are many interested parties all trying to use it and take from it what they wish and then there is 'that bridge' and the less likely it is to get boats that would pass often, now having to plan more carefully their passage.

 

It is often the case when one looks back in old photographs there appears to be more clearance under Potter Heigham Bridge (just as Wroxham too often seemed to). 

 

I only trust an 'expert' so much - look at the Somerset Levels with the Environment Agency previously taking a view that such did not need to be dredged all the time and using great swaths of data to back up their view along with the fact not dredging saved a lot of money.  Since the massive flooding and you might say political changes because of the suffering to people down there, they are now dredging the rivers.  Does it mean that the previous data was wrong, or is it that it probably was right  but we will dredge and just see what happens now?  The same could be said about the Broads. 

 

To my untrained mind it is pretty simple, it has nothing really to do with environmental constraints it is cost.  Imagine if it was found that the silt in the Broads contained a rare mineral worth more than crude oil per barrel ha! It would be fun to see the changes then.  How protected areas would be 'looked at with sympathy' as a great silt carrying pipeline was built to supply ships docking off the coast to fill up with this new found gold. 

 

Boaters would love the fact rivers were being dredged on a commercial scale, no shelving banks and shallows to worry about - private owners of Broads would welcome the dredgers in 'take my mud' they would ask and the fish and birdlife?  Well that would be 'monitored' and of course great care taken as long as things did not interfere with production.

 

But mud alas is mud not gold, so until it absolutely critically must be done and after great debate and thought a figure in square metres of silt removal is come up with and the slowly this amount can be taken which of course in the general scheme of things is always very small and probably would do very little.  Get under the bridge while you can, because I think in the next 20 years people would be saying not so much can I but "do you remember when boats could pass under".

[Soundings]

Not wishing to go off topic, but regards the Somerset Levels, is not the consensus that dredging would not necessarily have stopped the flooding but it would have helped the speed in which those waters subsided.

[Guest]

It's a shame we haven't got one of the older bridge pilots as a resident member on here.

 

I would imagine that they have irrefutable knowledge of what we're all guessing at.

[BroadScot]

It's a shame we haven't got one of the older bridge pilots as a resident member on here.

 

I would imagine that they have irrefutable knowledge of what we're all guessing at.

Strowy,

 

I may be wrong, but I thought we do have an ex pilot as a member.  

 

 

Iain

[Guest]

Strowy,

 

I may be wrong, but I thought we do have an ex pilot as a member.  

 

 

Iain

 

 

I wasn't sure if it was on here or the other place....

[BroadScot]

I wasn't sure if it was on here or the other place....

Yes his screen name is a little feathered friend

 

 

Iain

[MauriceMynah]

Should somebody tweet him?

[BroadScot]

Should somebody tweet him?

I bet you would get a "Swift" answer!

 

 

Iain

[Guest]

David (Expilot),  once commented one year on Potter tides being as high as he'd ever seen them in the last 25 years, and he didn't think that the average low water had been less than 6'6".

 

However, I don't remember him ever saying that he thought the cause might be due to the bridge subsiding on it's foundations.

 

The "high tides" phrase would seem to imply increased water levels, and he's chairman of the Thurne residents association as well, so he probably knows a lot more about that situation than any of us.

 

It would be great to get his professional input on the so often proposed "subsidence" theory....

[BroadScot]

Hi Strowy,

 

His screen name is Swift on here. Hopefuly he will read and reply soon.

 

 

 Iain