Berney Arms For Sale !!!

[imtamping2]

Isn't a skip a large bin....... what, on the broads ?????? I can not believe that .

[Polly]

With that much land, maybe glamping would be a thought, pub as restaurant and reception, old caravans etc cleared off site. Day boat type ferry as water taxi and a high end finish and costing for guests?

[Chelsea14Ian]

I agree it is I feel possible if someone  has the belief  to make it work,but it can't just be a pub.I hope to see it up and running  one day 

[NorfolkNog]

 

[Samuel]

If 250 people got together and each pledged say £1,000 (they could be members of a forum perhaps) then they could set up a Trust to buy and manage this property. I have noticed that there are many people here with expertise and strong opinions who would like to see this property continue as a pub. Who knows there might even be the possibility of match funding from somewhere!

Far fetched perhaps but community pubs do exist elsewhere.

[NorfolkNog]

16 minutes ago, Samuel said:

Far fetched perhaps but community pubs do exist elsewhere.

No, not far fetched at all Samuel. Probably the shining example is the White Horse at Upton, shares owned by the community and doing very well too. Even had a visit from Charlie boy recently.

Free a pub from a Pubco or avaricious landowner and anything is possible

[Polly]

The difference is that The White Horse has a resident client base to sustain trade.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Polly said:

The difference is that The White Horse has a resident client base to sustain trade.

Absolutely right.

Neatishead is in the centre of a fair sized village, with potential year-round custom for it's only "local".

It may seem strange to Summer visitors when so  many Broads businesses regularly fail, but you have to see the area during the lengthy off season to appreciate just how dead so many Summer hotspots become.

The Berney Arms is in a hopeless situation for Winter trade, being so isolated from any villages, and not even having road access. It may as well be on an island.

The Stracey Arms/Pontiac  has similar problems, and that's right next to the main Yarmouth A47.......

[JawsOrca]

It's worthless without public road access..(Although a ferry service would be good)

I'll give a quid for it. 

[NorfolkNog]

Some interesting points raised over this.

The White Horse (the Upton one) was bought out by the community and has been very successful. They were given the opportunity to raise the money over (I think) 2 or three years). Ray Norman had run the pub for most of his life from starting work as a barman to actually buying it from the Pubco. It is supported by the village although there are those who have bought shares but don’t use the pub. The reasoning for this is that it increases property values, which is fair enough if it helps the pub. The community have wisely kept it pretty much as it was apart from knocking through the small room on the left. They now do live music, bingo etc and sell quality local ales such as Humpty Dumpty etc. A fine example of how a village pub can work.

Similar story at the Neatishead White Horse. I regularly visited when it was a Pubco pub. I thought it was one of the most unspoilt pubs on the Broads but it did very little trade. You could go in and there would be half a dozen people in. The landlord told me he got very little trade from the village. Along came Rick, invested and really turned the pub around. I’ve said before I miss the cosy parlour feel but really it’s good to see it doing so well today. Trade comes from various sources, local, holiday makers and people travel from further afield. I have friends in Norwich who go their regularly. Key to success – no Pubco, a dedicated, knowledgeable owner, quality food and quality beers both real ale and craft. A very popular pub and deservedly so.

And so to the poor old Berney. It’s been running as a pub since the mid fifties, largely with great success. There has never been any land access for the public that I’m aware of. However latterly it fell into the hands of the current (presumably bankrupt owner) and this is where the problems started. Note the parallel with the Golden Galleon. Unrealistic expectations.

John and Tracy knew Chris Shepherd and took the pub over from him after he died. John and Tracy did an excellent job in my humble opinion. They loved and had a good knowledge of the Broads. They were excellent licensees. John is a qualified electrician and could turn his hand to practically everything that needed doing at the Berney. They understood that summer is busy and basically you use this to work through the leaner months. Many pubs on the Broads understand this, it’s the seasonal nature of the trade.

However the thing that did for John and Tracy was the rent. The freeholder had expectations which were completely out of step with what the business could reasonably support. I firmly believe that the Berney could be viable as a pub. OK, there is no community as such. But there are people who travel on foot, either walkers or visitors via the train. There is the trade from boats, even without those who sat on board and drink Stella. The problem is compounded by all the uncertainty since John and Tracy left and the fact that the pub has been closed more often than it was open. This would need to be built up again.

Anyone thinking of buying the pub would need capital and be prepared to wait for a return on it. In addition they would need a thorough understanding of the Broads and the people who use the area. In addition the operator would ideally have practical skills as getting contactors in for every little job would be difficult and expensive. We need another John and Tracy IMHO who could have a chance of running the pub on a level playing field. It does sadden me to see the pub being declared as unviable. It will need a special person or persons to do it but I for one am not writing the pub off and look forward to visiting it again in happier times.

Of course not every pub can work. But I still maintain that when they are out of the hands of pubcos or greedy individuals they can be a great success. I could quote many examples of ex-pubco pubs which have gone from strength to strength. Look at the Fat Cat in Norwich. A once failing back street Courage pub, now one of the most successful pubs in the country. If a pub is run well, on a level playing field, it can do well wherever it’s located. Fingers crossed.

[ExUserGone]

Is neatishead realy a similar story? It had a massive cash injection for the work and although without a doubt doing well as a pub will it ever make back the amount spent on it to make it a successful investment?

Not many people can lay out that much cash without the view to getting a good return from it.

[imtamping2]

Leo if the right person takes it over and looks at it as a long term investment or perhaps something to be handed down or a tax right off it then becomes viable.

Where there is a will there is a way............If you build it they will come.

And its about time we had some half full glasses around here instead of the half empty ones that keep getting knocked over 

 

[ExUserGone]

14 minutes ago, imtamping2 said:

And its about time we had some half full glasses around here instead of the half empty ones that keep getting knocked over 

Can I have a fully full glass please and don't even think of knocking it over.

Unfortunately it's all too often the case now that if you build it they WILL come, but they will moor outside and eat their own food and drink their own beer on the boat, but they WILL expect to use your loo.(and probably nick the bog roll)

Cynical git aint I.

[imtamping2]

Aye

[ChrisB]

The figures just don't stack up. For over half the year you will not be getting any revenue. If you are on borrowed money you are dead. If you have the capital, why bother, running a good pub is bloody hard work. If you want to go ahead then find one with half a chance of making a decent return. I am with LeoMagill on this one.

[imtamping2]

This place needs some imagination.....people are bumping there gums about "it wont survive as a pub" and maybe as a pub only it may not.

We need some imagination.

Ok here is a starter for ten a lot of the bungalows in Potter for example are hired almost throughout the year , a lot of these lets are to fisherman....we don't mind the cold

 There are a number of outbuildings available, why not convert these to fishing lodges you will have rental income for a damn side more than 16 weeks and I'm sure a couple of pints and maybe a meal after a hard days fishing would be very welcome.

"Stop with the negative waves man"  

[ChrisB]

How do they get there? How do they haul their clobber. ( as an ex fly fisherman I cannot understand the gear. I had rod, reel, fly box, folding net and could carry it easily on my bike) There is no legal access except by water. You could do endless things with it if the punters could just drive up to the front door.

A helipad and microlight landing strip might work but it would be a lesser minority than boaters.

 

[AEJB]

oops 

Edited May 20, 2016 by A.J.B.
sorry, wrong thread

[Guest]

1 hour ago, imtamping2 said:

........................We need some imagination.

Ok here is a starter for ten a lot of the bungalows in Potter for example are hired almost throughout the year , a lot of these lets are to fisherman....we don't mind the cold

 There are a number of outbuildings available, why not convert these to fishing lodges you will have rental income for a damn side more than 16 weeks and I'm sure a couple of pints and maybe a meal after a hard days fishing would be very welcome.............................

What is the fishing like there, compared to Potter ?

Potter is 19 miles upstream from Yarmouth, but the Berney Arms is only 5 miles, just above Breydon.

I've never fished there myself, but isn't it too brackish ?

[JennyMorgan]

The fishing at Berney can be quite good, smelt, flounders, bass, mullet, crabs etc..

[Baitrunner]

Might have to give that a try. 

I can't see it luring droves of specimen hunters in though! It's not quite the Ebro

i will put money on it all I get is bootlace eels

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

The fishing at Berney can be quite good, smelt, flounders, bass, mullet, crabs etc..

No problem with salt water surges there then......... 

It'd be quite a different angling clientele to the Potter lodge hirers.

Much warmer than sitting on the end of a pier I guess.

[JennyMorgan]

Forgot to add that there are sea-carp to over sixty pounds, indeed one mug-fish has been on the bank at over seventy!!

[JennyMorgan]

I've had pike and bream as near to the sea as at Haddiscoe and the New Cut, whether others have caught freshwater fish nearer to the sea I don't know.

[Baitrunner]

Seen some nice roach and bream at somerleyton. 

Pike are a bit more sensitive to brackish water so would not expect to see them that far down. 

Might have to get to the flats to get the best flounder and dabs though. 

Im just happy to catch a fish though.