Some Urgent Questions

[Dreamer]

Hi,

I'm planning a stay on the Norfolk Broads (a long one), somewhere I can relax and work on my electronics without interruptions.  I've been planning it for a while now, and have almost everything prepared.  However, I was stopped in my tracks the other day when I read something in the insurance policy I was about to take out.  I'll explain the situation as clearly as possible, in the hope that someone here might be able to advise me.
 

The Situation:

- I have a Hardy Family Pilot SE.
- She is currently out of the water and located in Hornsea.
- She does not have a BSS.
- There is no one local able do a BSS on the boat (as far as I'm aware).
- The insurance policy requires a current BSS to be in effect.
- I need to move her from her current location no later than 14th October 2017.
- I plan to bring her to the Norfolk Broads on that day at the latest.
 

The Questions:

- Do I need to have insurance to get a one-month Broads Licence?
- Do I need to have a BSS to get a one-month Broads Licence?
- Is it correct that I can get the cost of a one-month Broads Licence deducted from the cost of a 12-month Broads Licence if I upgrade it before it expires?

I'm hoping I don't need insurance or a BSS to get a one-month Broads Licence, because it would allow me to bring her to the Broads and give me a whole month to find someone to carry out the BSS.  Unless I'm able to do that, then I fail to see how I'm supposed to go about this.  So that's the situation in a nutshell.  I would appreciate any advice as long as it's correct advice, cause time is running out and I need to move her no later than 14th October 2017, so I really can't afford to make any mistakes.

 

[grendel]

not sure on the legalities side, but are you having her carried overland, if so you could try for a hard standing area or docking in a boat yard while the work is done to prepare her for her BSS (if you can find a yard that will allow you to stay onboard while the work is being done?) I dont believe you would need the toll if you were off the main river on hard standing.

[ExUserGone]

I believe short tolls are bss exempt but you will need insurance, the insurance are unlikely to ask to see a bss.

I would insure it, take it to the broads (assuming you have a mooring sorted) and get a short term licence, then get a broads guy to bss it for you while there.

You would be breaking no laws but your insurance would be iffy till bss done, chances are it would pay out for third party liabilty only.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Jonzo said:

It looks like a short visit toll may be BSS exempt - The details are here

Whether it's a good idea would be a different matter, I think...

I'm sure BSS would not be required as how would visiting boats from areas where BSS isn't required get a short visit licence , insurance however is another matter all together , as for the short visit cost coming off the annual toll that as far as I know does  have a time limit and would be applied when the full toll was paid .

[grendel]

http://broads-authority.gov.uk/boating/owning-a-boat/tolls/insurance-and-adjacent-waters

this page states you must have BSS and insurance for a short visit toll as well.

[Polly]

My suggestion would be to contact LBBY, Ludham Bridge Boatyard. The overland transport can offload you there, and you can book a BSS exam there too.

You have to be insured, it would seem that your own insurance company requires BSSC ?

I don't think a one month toll can be deducted from the annual, and the bad news there is that it runs annually from April to April with no sliding scale.

Are you sure you cannot find a local inspector? The Boat Safety website lists qualified examiners. At least one covers East Yorkshire

The most likely issue for your Hardy will be self draining petrol locker required and your gas installation. 

[dnks34]

A short visit toll can be up to 28 days and can be deducted from the cost of the annual toll for the period. 

http://www.broads-authority.gov.uk/boating/owning-a-boat/tolls/short-visit-toll

[Dreamer]

Thanks all, and well, I haven't a clue what I'm going to do then.

Ideally I'd like to get the BSS done where she is, while she's out of the water, so I can get the insurance and an Annual Broads Toll paid ready to just bring her to the Broads (by road), and lower her into the water using a slipway.

I have no idea how I'm going to get a BSS done in the Hornsea area.  I checked on the official BSS site and nothing comes up in the search for that area.  And it's not like I can just take it somewhere either, cause I'm having to hire a 4x4 to get it there.  I have someone to drive the 4x4 and take the trailer back with them, but the 4x4 will be hired.

Regards the mooring, I don't need one.  The whole idea of me having a boat is to cruise and explore, and I'll be living aboard her anyway.  Whenever I'm not moving, I'll be moored-up somewhere quiet, likely often mudweighted away from the crowds.  I plan to avoid the moorings whenever possible cause I don't fancy being moored-up along-side holiday makers all the time.  Like I said, I'm coming for the peace and quiet.  I want to be able to concentrate on my electronics without distractions (or as little as possible), and when I'm not doing that, basically just take in the tranquility of the place.  I think the only time I'd ever use a mooring is when I need to do some shopping or whatever.  And the only time the boat won't be in use is if/when I decide to take her back home, so I don't need a mooring, my summer and winter berth address is to take her back home.

But back to the BSS situation, if anyone knows of anyone in the Hornsea area able to do a BSS, please let me know, cause I can't see any other way around it without going to considerable expense.  It looks like I'll have to get her BBS done where she is, which would be perfect, but I don't know how I'm going to make that happen!

I just saw Polly's post in time to post this, and yes, the insurance requires a BSS certificate.  I will look into LBBY as suggested but I can't imagine they'd let me stay on the boat in their boatyard until the BSS gets done.  That would be ideal though, would be even easier than me looking for a slipway.

Thanks again to all for your help with this.

 

[ExUserGone]

My last bss was done by a guy from st.ives (cambs.) with the boat on the broads, he charged me £10 each way for the travelling (180 mile round trip) so anything is possible if you find the right examiner.

I went this way as he'd done all my previous bss/surveys.

[Regulo]

Have you contacted your preferred insurers and explained the situation? Some arrangement might be possible for a short period?

[ranworthbreeze]

3 hours ago, Dreamer said:

Hi,

I'm planning a stay on the Norfolk Broads (a long one), somewhere I can relax and work on my electronics without interruptions.  I've been planning it for a while now, and have almost everything prepared.  However, I was stopped in my tracks the other day when I read something in the insurance policy I was about to take out.  I'll explain the situation as clearly as possible, in the hope that someone here might be able to advise me.
 

The Situation:

- I have a Hardy Family Pilot SE.
- She is currently out of the water and located in Hornsea.
- She does not have a BSS.
- There is no one local able do a BSS on the boat (as far as I'm aware).
- The insurance policy requires a current BSS to be in effect.
- I need to move her from her current location no later than 14th October 2017.
- I plan to bring her to the Norfolk Broads on that day at the latest.
 

The Questions:

- Do I need to have insurance to get a one-month Broads Licence?
- Do I need to have a BSS to get a one-month Broads Licence?
- Is it correct that I can get the cost of a one-month Broads Licence deducted from the cost of a 12-month Broads Licence if I upgrade it before it expires?

I'm hoping I don't need insurance or a BSS to get a one-month Broads Licence, because it would allow me to bring her to the Broads and give me a whole month to find someone to carry out the BSS.  Unless I'm able to do that, then I fail to see how I'm supposed to go about this.  So that's the situation in a nutshell.  I would appreciate any advice as long as it's correct advice, cause time is running out and I need to move her no later than 14th October 2017, so I really can't afford to make any mistakes.

 

Hello Dreamer,

Here is a link to BSS inspectors loosely around your area.

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/boat-examination/arranging-the-examination/find-an-examiner/?counties=Humberside

Regards

Alan

[Dreamer]

Thanks Alan!

I just noticed Polly added to her post too.  That's perfect, exactly what I wanted.  Looks like the browser I used the other day was stopping that stuff from coming up, cause it didn't even have a drop-down last time I visited.  Looks like Mike Boulton and Richard Fee are within acceptable distance, so I'll give them a call and go with the best price.

Thanks again!
 

 

[Dreamer]

By the way, what sort of price is considered reasonable for a BSS?
I've never had one done before.

And what if it fails, does it include a retest like an MOT or do you have to pay again?

Just trying to get an idea of what sort of prices to expect so that I'll know whether I'm getting ripped-off or not.

 

[Polly]

The BSSC website publishes the criteria for passing the test, so you can check stuff out yourself before the test. 

 

[teadaemon]

1 hour ago, Dreamer said:

By the way, what sort of price is considered reasonable for a BSS?
I've never had one done before.

And what if it fails, does it include a retest like an MOT or do you have to pay again?

Just trying to get an idea of what sort of prices to expect so that I'll know whether I'm getting ripped-off or not.

 

Prices vary a lot from area to area, and each BSS examiner sets their own policy on whether they charge for a retest and what they charge. I could tell you what I'd charge to do a BSS on the Broads, but it could be very different to what you'll be charged in your area.

[JennyMorgan]

4 hours ago, Dreamer said:

Thanks all, and well, I haven't a clue what I'm going to do then.

Ideally I'd like to get the BSS done where she is, while she's out of the water, so I can get the insurance and an Annual Broads Toll paid ready to just bring her to the Broads (by road), and lower her into the water using a slipway.

I have no idea how I'm going to get a BSS done in the Hornsea area.  I checked on the official BSS site and nothing comes up in the search for that area.  And it's not like I can just take it somewhere either, cause I'm having to hire a 4x4 to get it there.  I have someone to drive the 4x4 and take the trailer back with them, but the 4x4 will be hired.

Regards the mooring, I don't need one.  The whole idea of me having a boat is to cruise and explore, and I'll be living aboard her anyway.  Whenever I'm not moving, I'll be moored-up somewhere quiet, likely often mudweighted away from the crowds.  I plan to avoid the moorings whenever possible cause I don't fancy being moored-up along-side holiday makers all the time.  Like I said, I'm coming for the peace and quiet.  I want to be able to concentrate on my electronics without distractions (or as little as possible), and when I'm not doing that, basically just take in the tranquility of the place.  I think the only time I'd ever use a mooring is when I need to do some shopping or whatever.  And the only time the boat won't be in use is if/when I decide to take her back home, so I don't need a mooring, my summer and winter berth address is to take her back home.

But back to the BSS situation, if anyone knows of anyone in the Hornsea area able to do a BSS, please let me know, cause I can't see any other way around it without going to considerable expense.  It looks like I'll have to get her BBS done where she is, which would be perfect, but I don't know how I'm going to make that happen!

I just saw Polly's post in time to post this, and yes, the insurance requires a BSS certificate.  I will look into LBBY as suggested but I can't imagine they'd let me stay on the boat in their boatyard until the BSS gets done.  That would be ideal though, would be even easier than me looking for a slipway.

Thanks again to all for your help with this.

 

In the past Martham Boats has allowed folk to stay on their boats whilst in the shed. Re BSS & Insurance, not sure whether you need to be covered whilst towing her across country but effectively, as far as the Broads is concerned, you won't need either, nor a toll, until you launch. Personally I'd phone Broads boatyards such as Martham Boats or LBBY and explain your dilemma.

[ranworthbreeze]

17 hours ago, Dreamer said:

By the way, what sort of price is considered reasonable for a BSS?
I've never had one done before.

And what if it fails, does it include a retest like an MOT or do you have to pay again?

Just trying to get an idea of what sort of prices to expect so that I'll know whether I'm getting ripped-off or not.

 

Hello Dreamer,

Our last three BSS inspections have all been £100 including the one we had done 2 weeks ago.

Regards

Alan

 

 

[Bound2Please]

Just now, ranworthbreeze said:

Hello Dreamer,

Our last three BSS inspections have all been £100 including the one we had done 2 weeks ago.

Regards

Alan

 

 

Snap and done in the yard afloat

Charlie

[WherryNice]

My Bss came in at around 80quid with a bit of hose included but I had no gas or internal electrics or much else at all really installed at the time so it only took minutes to do in all honesty.
Boat is a Colin Facey 21....

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app

[Dreamer]

On 9/27/2017 at 16:20, Polly said:

The most likely issue for your Hardy will be self draining petrol locker required and your gas installation. 

Looks like I found someone to do the BSS, but can you clarify exactly what you mean by self draining?
In the locker where the the gas bottle is kept, right at the bottom, there is a hole in the hull leading to the outside.

Is that what you mean by self draining?
I assume so, but just checking.

I've been going through the BSS checklist, and one thing that has me puzzled is the situation for "portable fuel tanks".  The boat has an outboard fitted, and the petrol tank is removable with a carry handle built in.  The fuel tank does have it's own locker, but there is no drainage hole in that locker, nor do I read any requirement for one.  Is there anything I need to be aware of regards portable fuel tanks?  The only thing I can find is that the tank must be located in a locker that does not allow leaked fuel to enter the rest of the boat.

So is that it for portable fuel tanks?
No need to fix them down etc?

 

[ExUserGone]

As I understand it as long as the fuel tank is connected to the engine (and 'in use)it can be anywhere you like and as dangerous as you like, as soon as you disconnect it becomes stored and should be in a locker with a drain to overboard the same as gas bottles, if it has it's own locker and it has a drain hole you will be fine.

Your gas locker sounds spot on.

[Polly]

Yes I agree with Dilligaf

[Dreamer]

Thank you both, and since I've settled on someone to do the BSS now, I've been asking questions.

It sounds as if my gas locker is ok, and thankfully, even my petrol locker.  I was told there's no need for a drainage hole in the petrol locker, and that the portable petrol tank does not have to be fixed down as long as the locker is not massive enough to allow excessive movement of the petrol tank.

So it looks as if she's all ready for the BSS, I just hope she passes!

 

[ExUserGone]

If it's practical I would have a drain in the petrol locker anyway.

Most examiners are more into getting you passed than failing you, they will often sort something minor on the spot.

[Dreamer]

Thing is, once I move aboard I'm going to be doing some upgrading and changing things and I'm not sure yet whether the petrol tank will be staying where it is.  So for now at least, I've decided against putting another hole in the hull in case I move the tank.  There's a smaller locker than where the tank currently is, so I'm hoping it will fit that one and free-up the larger locker!