Is It Just Me? Broom Boats Videos

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, smellyloo said:

Re: Sponsers.

I would find it very distaseful if open debate was muzzled to please sponsers or potential sponsers.

This thread has been nothing but friendly with clear reasons in support and with contra auguments.

 

Agree completely.

[Guest]

12 hours ago, diesel falcon said:

To the left of the right hand fender rack (as viewed) I can see what looks like a white  plate with again what looks like a an "old" BA licence sticker all held on with cable ties without the ends trimmed, suggesting it a temporary installation. Could this the Trade Plate/On Test plate. 

[Vaughan]

1 minute ago, Philosophical said:

To the left of the right hand fender rack (as viewed) I can see what looks like a white  plate with again what looks like a an "old" BA licence sticker all held on with cable ties without the ends trimmed, suggesting it a temporary installation. Could this the Trade Plate/On Test plate. 

Well spotted!

[LondonRascal]

The above video is to my mind a great example of what the test area is for - testing a boat, you can see this clearly was an engine test and the helm dials are not in situ suggesting some substantial works are undergoing on the boat.

 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, LondonRascal said:

The above video is to my mind a great example of what the test area is for - testing a boat, you can see this clearly was an engine test and the helm dials are not in situ suggesting some substantial works are undergoing on the boat.

 

To shoot myself in the foot somewhat, that is not the same boat as featured in the OP's opening post.

 

[LondonRascal]

24 minutes ago, Philosophical said:

To shoot myself in the foot somewhat, that is not the same boat as featured in the OP's opening post.

No it is not and in a way sadly, the topic has diverged into two points:

• A promotional video showing excessive wash/speed for the camera
• Boat testing in allowed sections of river

The first I don't agree with,  the second is allowed and be it filmed or otherwise is necessary - and the video posted of such test shows a good example of why these testing areas exist.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, LondonRascal said:

No it is not and in a way sadly, the topic has diverged into two points:

• A promotional video showing excessive wash/speed for the camera
• Boat testing in allowed sections of river

The first I don't agree with,  the second is allowed and be it filmed or otherwise is necessary - and the video posted of such test shows a good example of why these testing areas exist.

If I understand correctly the second video is OK as it was "legitimate testing"; then there is a bit of an assumption, in that the boat could have been taken out with the dash in disarray purely for filming purposes to show the mechanical engineers being every bit as craftsmanship and caring as the carpenters and upholsterers.

To continue with assumptions, the original video could have been a "legitimate instrumented engine test", that they chose to film.

[LondonRascal]

... Unless you've been in touch with Broom directly about this before it came to light here, which I had been when it first popped up on Facebook.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, deebee29 said:

Broom Boats will always be a bit special to me.

The very first boat we hired was Broom Navigator 2 way back in the mists of time which started my love for The Broads which is as strong today as it ever was.

I know management has changed over the years etc. But it’s still Broom to me.

The video is very well and professionally produced promo with a lot of post production, it’s not just a guy with a camera on a boat filming for YouTube (no disrespect to YouTubers, there’s some stuff out there)

 

We also had Navigator 2 in May 1966. The hire charge was £44 per week plus extras:

28 gal Diesel £ 3-17-10

TV set £2-10-00

Sailing Dinghy £ 3-10-00

[deebee29]

Just now, Philosophical said:

We also had Navigator 2 in May 1966. The hire charge was £44 per week plus extras:

28 gal Diesel £ 3-17-10

TV set £2-10-00

Sailing Dinghy £ 3-10-

It must have been pretty new back then.

I don’t remember what we paid but I do remember paying extra for a tiny b & w TV set.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, deebee29 said:

It must have been pretty new back then.

I don’t remember what we paid but I do remember paying extra for a tiny b & w TV set.

Think it was quite new, from memory it still had a varnished hull

[Guest]

7 hours ago, LondonRascal said:

The above video is to my mind a great example of what the test area is for - testing a boat, you can see this clearly was an engine test and the helm dials are not in situ suggesting some substantial works are undergoing on the boat.

 

"Suggesting substantial works" Why not say that you had already spoken to Broom's on this specific video who confirmed it was a legitimate sea trial? 

[Guest]

Have I missed something here ??? 

[Guest]

Actually reading between the lines if recent posts on this thread I haven't missed anything apart from some not stating what they know via phone  calls , thing is of you know something that clear io a level of confusion within a thread then why not say so , this whole incident hit FB first and a lot of confusion could have been iminated on the  thread had those facts been known , all of this video in my eyes is legitimate and quite why some think its promotional video that shows excessive wash seemingly purely because wash equals speed is just daft , its as nuts as the kids who take the exhaust off their moped cos if its louder then its faster , wash is a byproduct of speed and a properly trimmed boat traveling at a design speed causes little wash , iv stated this before and hopefully one day people will get it n that's any boat outside of its design speed will create excess wash from a small sailing dinghy to the largest ocean liner and everything in between , dozens of boats are over driven on the broads and not be speeding and yet the wash is horrendous  and judging by the wash on the videos iv seen a lot worse of much smaller and more regularly used boats on the yare and that's not by watching videos that's by sheer experience .

[LondonRascal]

So..I will explain it all.

I am on Broad Ambition over the Christmas period and in bed, looking on Facebook on my phone and up pops this promoted advert for Broom - interested in it, I tap to open the video and watch it. Now I can't say I much like the way it was made since it followed much the same style as the likes of Fairline and Princess and lacked originality but hey ho that is my opinion . I was going to watch it to end but I did and then the camera pans up and you see this incredible wash as the boat is headed  along the river as the Broom logo appears and voice over and the video fades to black.

I was frankly shocked that a company like Broom would have paid a lot of money for a advert like this to have been made and then glorified speeding on a river in such a way.

I got to the comments section on the post and found many others had already voiced their upset to the speeding element in the advert and I joined in with those voices and that would have been that, as time passed and further comments were exchanged it was all taking place on Facebook within the comment section of the sponsored post Broom had paid for to appear in peoples timelines so this was not in a Facebook Group or indeed even on Brooms own Facebook page.

Well a good time passed and Brooms lack of empathy to this perhaps caused the OP to ask peoples opinions here on the Forum about it - and I then joined in with my own opinions and also found the video in question this time that had also been uploaded to Brooms You Tube Channel.

There was little confusion sine the OP stated " My blood is boiling over videos Broom have recently started showing on facebook " which set the tone as to where it had originated from. The OP also posed the question " these videos are just insensitive and showing the special section is being used (or publicised) for the wrong reasons?! "

What then began was a typical wide ranging debate. Some have gone along with the view this was ok since it was within a area of the river where such speed trials are allowed, but had perhaps had not realised this was not a trial that was being filmed but an advertisement and one that was showing up on peoples timelines over on Facebook. It had been filmed for the single and only purpose of the promotional advert. It was not  spare footage taken from a engine trial for example, and that footage used from and included  into the end of the promotional video with the voice over.

It was this that caused me to share my opinions both to Broom and later here. I also have tried to show the difference between a permitted use of the special section (for trials) and the incorrect use of the section of for the promotion of a product/company. Two very different things, both which cause issues to the river banks but one which is needed perhaps for safety to ensure engines are operating correctly and the other to put on a good show for a video.

While it may be the case at certain high speeds and with certain hulls, that those high speeds cause a great deal less wash, in the case of the video in question it is clear this is not one of those cases.

All that has happened is pretty straight forward: Broom commissioned a company to make a video made for them and during the filming of this they took a boat out for the creators to film at speed. When the video came back finished and polished to perfection, you can well imagine Broom were most pleased with it and eager to share it over their social media outlets. What they did not expect perhaps what that people who saw it might not see it quite as harmless as Broom expected, for it is more about the promotion of speeding than what was actually done at the time.

 

[Guest]

Robin seriously you really think that's a lot of wash ? I've seen more of rowing clubs to be honest , now please do explain to me how wash from a boat on trial and one being filmed is any different from each other ? Its all wash and taking place in a designated area and by personal that will if required to do so cut their speed for the benefit of others as they are required to do so .

The wash is exactly the same what isn't the same is the purpose that is causing the wash in the first place , one being filming the other engine trials etc , that my friend is one for BA to deliberate over as to if any rules have been broken , rightly or wrongly there is no difference in that wash and a boat on a trial run .

To be honest I'm surprised you actually got the video on the northern rivers let alone played it I know administration on the FB site were trying to get hold of you on Christmas eve I think but we both know horning is a nightmare for signal , anyway that aside this is a BA issue to take up with brooms if they see a problem and trust me that's not huge wash on the river regularly I see many more people make much more that that , moor at whitlingham one night during the week when the UEA are out training at 6.30am n then you'll know what wash is and from a single rowing 8 and a chase boat , yep small craft like that can and do wake you .

[quo vadis]

I'm confused sorry

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, quo vadis said:

I'm confused sorry

That's cos you still have your Christmas hat on 

[marshman]

I think the crux of it surrounds the fact that it is arguable whether a promotional video is necessary - clearly engine trials are and that is acceptable for most people. Whether a promo video is, is perhaps another matter. As I have said before, if you are trying to promote such a boat, is it not best to do the promo out at sea to illustrate the boats sea keeping capabilites? What exactly does the video show - that it will go pretty fast up a river, which incidentally no new owner would be allowed to do ? So why bother at all?

Whilst I am sure R is right, I find it a little difficult to believe a semi displacement hull will ever produce very little wake, trimmed or not!

[Vaughan]

I speak from experience on this as I used to work for Percival Boats in Horning, as I said earlier.

When we used the measured quarter mile for testing, in the 60s, there was no speed limit there. The limit in Horning started at the Black Horse Broad entrance. So we were not breaking the law by speeding, anyway! The use of trade plates allowed us to test and demonstrate for sale, craft which were not yet Broads registered, or whose river toll was not in date.

The area downstream of Brundall is not just de-restricted for water skiers; it is also for vessels permitted to speed and that means boats from boatyards on trade plates. I don't see any distinction in that use, between testing the engine, and demonstrating the boat to a potential buyer.

If the internet, and videos, were available in Tom Percival's day I am certain he would have made them, for sales demonstration, and why not?

[JawsOrca]

Just a concluding comment here.

I must admit I'm a little disappointed by some comments on here although I have been away from the forum for some time and clearly the dynamics have changed. Mod's I will drop you a PM regarding the comments about Brooms sponsorship.

I do know Brooms very well, I work with many companies whom retail the boats. Broom are very close to my heart as is norfolk, I do have a broom and it's, in my view, one of the best boats ever made and it holds that reputation with many, it's perhaps one reason why I'm so annoyed with Brooms marketing idea here, I offered constructive criticism back to broom via facebook as soon as I saw the movie, personally I think they understood these views and I hope that we won't see our rivers used in this manner.  Brooms boats now are very different than they was and personally I believe they should appreciate constructive criticism when it's given, there is nothing helpful looking through rose tinted glasses just because they are who they are! Indeed constructive criticism should help the brand continue and grow. 

I will repeat myself, there is nothing cool about speeding around rivers and certainly not for marketing purposes a view some members have agreed with in relation to the other two posts. Whilst I personally do not agree that waterskiiing should be permitted on the broads system and high speed engine tests, that's a separate issue and something which I didn't expect to raise so if the BA believe that's acceptable then I support the BA's view as thankfully the BA do clearly have the best stance on speeding. 

[SwanR]

I was amazed when I came home from work one day and saw how much this thread had grown - clearly an issue that has sparked much debate. Robin's post is very useful in putting some context on this. And if it all started with a promotional video that sneaked into our timelines on Facebook, as these sponsored adverts often do, then that is part of a growing trend that doesn't always work how the company intended.

I am a little surprised that people can comment on such posts on Facebook, which are adverts. But that's how it is. Greater Anglia are forever shooting themselves in the foot by posting about offers and value for trains into London ... when the truth is that we have so much engineering work and rail replacement at weekends that it's a joke ... and that's what the comments mostly say!

[Bound2Please]

27 minutes ago, SwanR said:

Greater Anglia are forever shooting themselves in the foot by posting about offers and value for trains into London

25 minutes ago, SwanR said:

when the truth is that we have so much engineering work and rail replacement at weekends that it's a joke

There has always been rail replacement buses at weekends for engineering working, going back to the days of steam. So its far from a new thing.

[SwanR]

That is true but all they do is attract a lot of negative comments when they advertise a service as a great product but customers are facing a lot of service disruption. A little counter productive I would have thought. 

[Bound2Please]

How can they advertise any service then as at some point engineering work has to be done on ALL tracks, not just rails signals points drainage overheads etc etc ....... So then if they dont advertise people wouldnt know of the services offered.