Sunken Sail Boat On Barton Broad

[HemsbyPie]

4 minutes ago, marshman said:

Oh don't worry Hemsby Pie - they all think that SOB should respond to everything from picking up a dropped icecream to full salvage!!

If it is an open half decker, I dont think Maffetts will be needed - just a pump and a lunatic with a bucket!!! They probably just caught the mainsheet on a channel marker and that would normally be enough to slip her under 

 

I did sense that 

by all accounts the jib got caught on the starboard marker (which means nothing to me as I prefer petrol power to rag & stick)

[BroadScot]

4 minutes ago, Timbo said:

Excuse me for being a bit dense...but...What does Spirit of Breydon actually 'do'? I've seen the odd photo of some beardy bloke in a bush hat posing for photo's with her but other than that 'diddly squat'.

By all accounts Tim, it spends a lot of time being repaired !

Iain

[Gracie]

I don't think we all expect SOB to come out for an ice cream overboard, a bottle of wine however, is a totally different story

Grace

[JennyMorgan]

My understanding is that the whole SOB concept was sold by the Authority officers to the Authority committees on the understanding that her duties were to patrol and to provide safety and rescue services, part of which was very clearly in being able to respond to requests from Humber Coast Guard. I've retired as an Auxiliary Coastguard now but if I were on duty I would have called out either Gorleston RNLI or Hemsby ILB, both services having craft far more suited to rescue on Breydon than ever is the SOB.  The whole reason for the SOB's existence was to provide and improve safety facilities on Breydon, that mantra has been openly banged on about by the BA executive on more than one occasion. That outside agencies are relied upon to provide rescue facilities is excellent, and we must be grateful for them, but it then brings into question the very need for and the cost of the SOB. In my view her choice and subsequent purchase was a very poor judgement by those responsible.

[JennyMorgan]

14 minutes ago, Jonzo said:

Or just a waste of money?

If SOB were to actually save just one life then her purchase price would be justified. However I really do think that there are alternatives that offer far greater efficiency. I do question the need for SOB to be out cruising, surely just being on call, as is the Hemsby ILB, would make greater sense. An ILB would then be a sensible choice, in my opinion, but these already exist. Tow-boat services are also available on Breydon, do we really need the SOB? 

[BroadScot]

9 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

do we really need the SOB? 

A certain BA executive, appears to think so !

Iain

[ExUserGone]

I've seen sob upstream of the yarmouth fixed bridges, the mast folds down, seen it go under st.olaves too, it could probably get under ludham with a good enough run up.......

On the subject of ludham bridge, we tried last week but only 8'2" on the gauge(need 8'8"min.), went back later and down to 8', moored at st.bennets instead and walked to the dog but did the extra to the bridge and back armed with a tape measure and can report the following.

With the bottom edge of the 8' mark just showing on the immediately downstream gauge there was 8' 6" at the lowest point under the bridge(eastern bank downstream at the waters edge), the western bank had a full 6" more due to the slope of the bridge, we breezed under the next morning with 8'3" showing.

This seems a ridiculous amount of 'extra' to leave as people will just push their luck till it runs out, surely any gauge should be accurate and down to the skipper to make the call on their own vessel wether hire or private.

Now before you go steaming under and blame me for the damage I will state clearly I AM NOT A SURVEYOR AND MY TAPE MEASURE HAS NO CALIBRATION CERTIFICATE, YOU ARE THE SKIPPER AND IT'S YOUR CHOICE! The other gauge boards may read different I just went by the one.

[ranworthbreeze]

3 hours ago, Gracie said:

I don't think we all expect SOB to come out for an ice cream overboard, a bottle of wine however, is a totally different story

Grace

Grace if it was one of your bottles it would be either empty or full, a full bottle should float but a empty bottle would not be a total loss other than causing litter 

I thought your bottles came in braces

Regards

Alan

[JennyMorgan]

1 hour ago, BroadScot said:

A certain BA executive, appears to think so !

Iain

But then he doesn't have to pay for it!

[ChrisB]

There were some wicked gust about in the heat, I could imagine a gunwhale a bit too low for comfort when not, or lightly reefed due to the hot weather.

[Polly]

Yes the Met Office had 18mph gusting 36mph, we abandoned a plan to take a novice sailor out for a trip in Brilliant, given that the aim was not to scare her off! 

[Boaters]

Leo ,we had the same boat as you and found Ludham Bridge to show lower than the   Overal clearance we needed to sail through,often four inches at least. .Here in North Walsham new signs have appeared on the railway bridges ,having lost an amazing six inches. Has not stopped the lorries  getting stuck though !

 

 

 

 

[Poppy]

21 hours ago, TheQ said:

The Lifeboat crew need to keep an Eye out on NBN!! It was reported Here, 17 hours ago according to this site... i.e. before their call out!! ( no I am not critising them for responding!!)

I hope somebody doesn't call them out every time we have someone capsize during a sailing event!!

 

Indeed it was - here is  my picture  from Wednesday, posted just after 5.15 pm ! (Copy of my post as well)  Perhaps 'The Q's' thread on 'Horning Regatta' wasn't the best place for it - since many will think - bl***y sail boats - and ignore the entire thread!

Posted Wednesday at 05:18 PM · Report post

 

 

 

[JennyMorgan]

20 hours ago, HemsbyPie said:

The BA were aware of what had happened however Coastguard were not.

A call was then made by the public to CG and they acted; if CG get a call for a sunken vessel they don't have time to call other agencies, they have to press the button (especially out of hours as this was)

It strikes me that the CG should liaise more with the Authority's 'Bridge Control'. Calling out the rescue services for a capsized or swamped sailing boat, especially when the crew are all accounted for and safe, is a waste of resources,  Perhaps the BA should plaster 'Broads Authority Aware' stickers over all such sunken boats.

[JennyMorgan]

18 hours ago, TheQ said:

River cruiser class 20 Is Nyanza  and looking at her picture here.

http://rivercruiser.org/index.php/yachts-for-sale?sail_no=20

Her gaff is much more inclined than the boat in the sinking  so I think that confirms its Orange Tip.

 its quite easy to sink a white boat, Hold the main too long, or it jam it. while close hauled and you'd definately get water over the side.

Also I was told, that,  Famously the Late George Southgate managed to sink his White boat sailing down wind by just having such a huge amount of wind from behind he sailed the bows under water.

its quite easy to sink a white boat, Hold the main too long, or it jam it. while close hauled and you'd definately get water over the side.

Having managed to sail a Waveney under whilst on the run, despite having a crew member sat on the transom, I have to agree that it can be done. However hanging onto the main too long when close hauled is an idiotic thing to do at the best of times, pi*s poor seamanship, just free off, simple! Oh, it was in a jambing cleat, well, whose fault is that then? Can't get over the boat being on the bottom for fifteen hours before the lifeboat was called! Seems to me that Humber Coastguard needs to understand how things are on the Broads, like wot Gorleston Coastguard used to do.

[Polly]

Be fair JM, the likelihood is that those on the spot at the time knew full well that there wasn't a life and death situation, so CG were not informed. Let them all go home for their tea, muttering about getting her afloat tomorrow etc. and then let some unsuspecting skipper come by. Sail stuck up out of water, nobody about, would you ignore that? Call to CG, voila!

 

Wasn't the jib tangled round a stb. marker?

[JennyMorgan]

Personally, Polly, if there was no one frantically waving for help or laying face down in the water then I'd simply sail on. This is the Broads, not the open sea. Different matter down at Reedham, for example, where the tides race along but not on Barton. Lesson for both the BA & CG, let each other know when boats have sunk, shouldn't be that hard to do. I would have expected someone to have got their hair wet and to have let the sail down though. 

[Poppy]

31 minutes ago, Polly said:

Be fair JM, the likelihood is that those on the spot at the time knew full well that there wasn't a life and death situation, so CG were not informed. Let them all go home for their tea, muttering about getting her afloat tomorrow etc. and then let some unsuspecting skipper come by. Sail stuck up out of water, nobody about, would you ignore that? Call to CG, voila!

 

Wasn't the jib tangled round a stb. marker?

It was the mainsheet. Either there was a jamming cleat on the main (MADNESS IMHO! ) or a stopper knot in the end . Again on a 'gaffer' stupid and p**s poor seamanship! 

I understand another White Boat went down on Barton last week end - in precisely the same circumstances!

[JennyMorgan]

As Poppy has said, having a stopper knot on the end of a mainsheet is madness. Same reason that it's non too wise having back splices, even tiddly tapered ones, or loops in the end of mooring ropes, sooner or later they will snarl or snag when it is vital that they can run as freely as possible. 

[Polly]

Couldn't agree more, no stopper knot on mainsheet is basic.

Dunno about dropping the sail, at least the rig was highly visible so that passing skippers weren't crunching into the mast, with 'Oops I didn't notice that stick a'sticking up there!' 

[ChrisB]

Hang on folks let us qualify that. Totally agree a "figure of eight" on a main sheet is not clever inland where it can foul trees, marker posts etc.

But out in the real world to have total loss of your boom and a coil of rope on the cockpit soul is one step from channel 16 or disaster. Could you imagine trying to get control again on a dark and windy night?

[JennyMorgan]

Chris, just curious, why would you loose the main sheet at sea if there is nothing to snarl it on?

[JennyMorgan]

10 hours ago, Polly said:

Couldn't agree more, no stopper knot on mainsheet is basic.

Dunno about dropping the sail, at least the rig was highly visible so that passing skippers weren't crunching into the mast, with 'Oops I didn't notice that stick a'sticking up there!' 

My comment really concerned the well being of the sail, especially if the wind got up from an unfavorable quarter.

[ChrisB]

27 minutes ago, JennyMorgan said:

Chris, just curious, why would you loose the main sheet at sea if there is nothing to snarl it on?

I have done it Peter. We came to a very abrupt stop on Chichester Bar. The boom swung so hard, hit the starboard shrouds and the main sheet screeeemed out passing though most of the blocks.  The flood tide then rounded the stern so we were abeam to the weather. We let loose the halyard and got it under control. It was however a very benign day, we were all in our late 20s, so forty years ago, fit and very strong. I know that I could not handle that situation now even given pretty calm conditions at my age now. Maybe the helms regard for the well being of his hands was to blame.

[JennyMorgan]

What a coincidence, I was based at Bosham in Chichester Harbour over forty years ago. Used to teach sailing and skipper charter boats including a gorgeous Sparkman & Stevens 44' yawl for a living.