What Would You Pay Extra Tolls For?

[Polly]

Dredging the lower Bure would solve a lot of problems. Fishing platforms near busy moorings so that anglers and boaters don't fight over the same spaces. RUBBISH COLLECTION (oops )

[JennyMorgan]

I note that there are several call for less boats on the Broads. If that is a problem, which I don't think it is, then those making such calls might consider whether or not that they might be a part of the problem and who do we exclude? Agreed that there is congestion, but then that's another kettle of fish! Why people seem to crave congestion is a question that's way beyond my simple, country mind. I just slip under Potter, Wroxham or Beccles Bridges and relish the space and sheer beauty!

[Vaughan]

12 hours ago, JohnK said:

Is the depth only a problem to keeled boats or is there more to it than that?

I think this one has been well answered by JM and MM and it is indeed a serious priority.

As to moorings, well things have changed over the years! In the early 70's there were 3000 hire boats on the Broads but they were let out from over 100 boatyards, in all the main boating centres, which were all offering free moorings to each other, as well as all the services which went with them. This was a condition of membership for both of the main hiring agencies. You only have to look at old photos of the river in Wroxham, to see what I mean.

Now, the boatyards have almost all closed and had private houses built on their sites (encouraged by the BA in the 80s) and there are only about 700 hire boats left. In the meantime, there are now 3000 private boats!

So it ought to be bleedin' obvious that there is a serious need for more public moorings and services, to make up for what the boatyards used to provide for free. You can't even get a pumpout these days, in many places.

I was on holiday twice last year, on either side of the high season, and the north rivers were more crowded than I think I have ever seen them.

[JohnK]

Interesting stuff JM, MM & V.
Does the congestion on the rivers themselves with boats underway seem more of a problem now than it was in the past or is it just when they swarm to moor?

[Vaughan]

2 minutes ago, JohnK said:

Does the congestion on the rivers themselves with boats underway seem more of a problem now than it was in the past or is it just when they swarm to moor?

I would think, as you say, that it is when they swarm to moor.

[dnks34]

I dont want to pay any extra amount in toll.

I would like to see the BA learn how to manage their finances better and I would say the same for any other organisation or body funded in a similar way. 

If theres not enough funds to take care of the job in hand somebody needs to ask the obvious question...Why? 

[MauriceMynah]

As I have recently said, the answer isn't fewer (note not "less") boats, it is greater facilities and space for those here. Yes  I accept that there has been a tendency for boats to be bigger than their predecessors,  more importantly, longer, but back in the late 60s early 70s there were hugely more craft on the system, yet the infrastructure handled it well.

There were little riverside shops (or close to the river) in all sorts of places. Thurne Dyke had a general store, and one in Dillham, very similar to the one we recently lost at Acle bridge. all making a living from the many holidaymakers there at the time. In short, there were more boatyards hiring more boats to more people.

So why are we now saying that the broads are too crowded?  Perhaps it's just that people feel they have to gripe about something! Thank God for the BA I say, (and you can take that however you like. :-)   )

Are the problems caused by the massive increase in private boats as Vaughan suggests? Sorry matey, I don't think so. not so many of the private boats are out at the same time. No, it's fewer visitors at any one time. BUT, even with fewer visitors, there is more rubbish. We know supermarkets wrap things up three or four times... more rubbish...   Disposable nappies... more rubbish... etc. etc.

Rubbish is the major headache these days and if the BA can take that problem away from the councils and deal with it, I'd forgive the doctor everything.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, dnks34 said:

I dont want to pay any extra amount in toll.

I would like to see the BA learn how to manage their finances better and I would say the same for any other organisation or body funded in a similar way. 

If theres not enough funds to take care of the job in hand somebody needs to ask the obvious question...Why? 

Nailed it 

[Vaughan]

53 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Rubbish is the major headache these days and if the BA can take that problem away from the councils and deal with it, I'd forgive the doctor everything.

And that is all part of my point. It was all those boatyards, who provided a free refuse disposal in those days. What's more they had to pay "trade" rates to dispose of it themselves!

[JohnK]

And that is all part of my point. It was all those boatyards, who provided a free refuse disposal in those days. What's more they had to pay "trade" rates to dispose of it themselves!

I’m not sure I’ve got all the facts (actually what I have I got from Facebook so I probably have no facts at all) ...
I’ve seen it written that there used to be a lot of bins provided by the BA but they’ve been taken away to avoid paying for commercial waste.
Is that true?
I can understand boatyards having to pay for commercial waste (I’m not saying it’s right but can see how it would fit the rules) but it’s hard to believe the BA would have to for waste collected at free moorings.

[Vaughan]

As I understand it, it is the local councils, not the BA, who provide and empty the bins.

[JohnK]

As I understand it, it is the local councils, not the BA, who provide and empty the bins.

That makes a lot more sense.

[Wussername]

9 minutes ago, JohnK said:

 

That makes a lot more sense.

 

Not to me it doesn't when I have to pay for it through my rates.

Andrew.

[JohnK]

Not to me it doesn't when I have to pay for it through my rates.
Andrew.

Ah, but are your rates artificially low because of the tourism income in the area?

[Meantime]

8 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

As I understand it, it is the local councils, not the BA, who provide and empty the bins.

This is very worthy of its own subject and has been the subject of many a thread here and elsewhere in the past. Rubbish collection is down to the local authorities and not the BA. A few years back the local authorities decided that "all" boat waste was commercial waste and therefore they did not have to provide free collections. Now it can be argued that waste from hire boats is commercial, as a result of a commercial operation, however waste from private boats is not a commercial operation and as such waste provisions should still be provided.

Off course waste collection by local authorities ultimately ends up being charged to the residents of the local areas, which could be deemed as being unfair since a lot of the private boat owners come from outside the area, BUT they do spend money in the local facilities and businesses who in turn do pay business rates. Furthermore most tourist areas DO provide general litter bins and waste disposal in recognition of the extra money bought into the area.

I live not too far from a tourist area and the local authority do daily litter bin emptying as well as daily street litter picks. The locals pick up the tab but that's part of the equation for living where I do.

The long and short of it is that more and more bins are disappearing and some people are helping to pick up the short fall as a gesture of goodwill, when it should be the local authority. There is a bin provided at Sutton staithe, but it is paid for by the hotel as a gesture of goodwill. The BA provide rubbish points at the yacht stations and tourist information centre at Hoveton. Whilst it is not directly the responsibility of the BA to provide rubbish disposal, as the authority responsible for The Broads I do believe they should be putting a lot more pressure on the local authorities to step up and take responsibility.

I recently cruised from Woods End to Surlingham Ferry and the Starboard bank going downstream is a National disgrace. How the BA can spend time, money and effort masquerading this as a National Park is a public disgrace. They should spend equal time and effort putting pressure on the local authorities.

I was with some people who live in a genuine National Park, The North Yorkshire Moors and they were absolutely appalled as the mess on the banks and in the reeds. They could not believe anywhere wishing to be a National Park could be left to get into such a mess.

I repeat The Broads is not a National Park, but parts of it are becoming a National Disgrace.

[Meantime]

6 minutes ago, Wussername said:

Not to me it doesn't when I have to pay for it through my rates.

Andrew.

People who chose to live in tourist areas become the custodians of those areas. They enjoy the beauty all year round and sometimes there is a price to pay in providing extra facilities and putting up with extra traffic and people in the season. You could always move out of a tourist area?

I speak from experience and live near a tourist area. What I really don't understand is that in my local area the local people have formed two action groups to improve, care for and generally tidy up the area for locals and visitors alike. I don't see that on The Broads. Through their action over 100 benches and picnic facilities have been sponsored and put in place for all to use.

[Wussername]

15 minutes ago, JohnK said:

 

Ah, but are your rates artificially low because of the tourism income in the area?

 

No they are not artificially low.

[JohnK]

What I really don't understand is that in my local area the local people have formed two action groups to improve, care for and generally tidy up the area for locals and visitors alike. I don't see that on The Broads.

We (River Thurne Tenants Association) recently had a litter pick around Potter.
It’s not the solution but it’s a start.
I was thinking of doing similar informally when I take the dog out (simply take a bag and pick up bits along the way) but am I ok simply leaving the bag in or near a council bin?

[Meantime]

I think the council has a responsibility to litter pick, so if you are helping them by collecting some as you walk the dog, then yes, leave it in a council bin.

[dnks34]

1 hour ago, JohnK said:

 

Ah, but are your rates artificially low because of the tourism income in the area?

 

Again.....No.......

If you can tell me where rates are artificially low I may be inclined to move there but I dont think such a place exists!

Im not sure how you look at things JohnK but tourist income certainly wont mean cheap rates for residents, The system is much to greedy for anything like that!

[CambridgeCabby]

In today’s cash strapped times for local councils (won’t go into details as is too political and controversial) they are cutting back on more and more services for locals and visitors alike amongst these a casualty has been the waste collection on The Broads which has led to more riverside waste dumping by inconsiderate boaters, which eventually will have to be cleared at considerable cost not just financially but environmentally too .

I would happily pay £1 to dispose of my boat waste at authorised convenient points such as pubs whom already have commercial waste collection contracts in place ( and yes I know private boat rubbish is not considered commercial waste), as would many holiday makers who respect The Broads.

 

[dnks34]

I dont believe these times are as cash strapped as government and local councils would have us believe.  If money was used wisely and for the things it was actually meant for we may be in a very different position.

[Wussername]

3 hours ago, JohnK said:

 

We (River Thurne Tenants Association) recently had a litter pick around Potter.
It’s not the solution but it’s a start.
I was thinking of doing similar informally when I take the dog out (simply take a bag and pick up bits along the way) but am I ok simply leaving the bag in or near a council bin?

 

The solution is to stop people littering the Broads in the first place.

[Wussername]

3 hours ago, EastCoastIPA said:

 

I recently cruised from Woods End to Surlingham Ferry and the Starboard bank going downstream is a National disgrace. How the BA can spend time, money and effort masquerading this as a National Park is a public disgrace. They should spend equal time and effort putting pressure on the local authorities.

I was with some people who live in a genuine National Park, The North Yorkshire Moors and they were absolutely appalled as the mess on the banks and in the reeds. They could not believe anywhere wishing to be a National Park could be left to get into such a mess.

I repeat The Broads is not a National Park, but parts of it are becoming a National Disgrace.

Who is responsible for this disgusting mess. The 3000 private owners. The 800 hire cruisers, perhaps fisherman, or how about the general public.

I think that a good start would be to find out and then to pursue those responsible with a view to prosecution.

Andrew

 

[JohnK]

The solution is to stop people littering the Broads in the first place.

Of course. But I don’t like to see the litter. I’m not going to sit back and whine about it, I’m going to do something about it. I’m not saying anyone here is whining, simply that I’m not going to.