Hybrid Boats

[Andrewcook]

Hi to you all Forum Members here's  this question?

As we are now moving into Hybrid Cars  that 's Part Engine and Batteries  can they do the same with Diesel Cruisers as they can still use the Engine's  when going over Breydon water's but can use the Batteries on Calmer waters such as on the River Ant or River Bure or any other place's. Mind you could any one convert Griff's Motor Bike Tiger to run on Part Batteries and Engine when he visits the Norfolk Broads to help the environment  

Andrew Cook

 

[ChrisB]

I think NBD run some. Greenline have been around for a while.

And some of the prices make some of The Broads boats look very pricey.

[annv]

Hi Yes but not cheap but minimal running costs and less maintenance. John

[oldgregg]

There are some about, but they're not very good yet as they're using more conventional battery technology.

While the technology is there, it is very expensive and much like a car the boat needs to be designed around the batteries to make the most of the package.

With motor manufacturers ditching combustion engines over the next 20 years, we will see a major change in boating as diesel-engined craft will seem horrendously old tech at some point. But don't expect it just yet.

[ranworthbreeze]

3 minutes ago, annv said:

Hi Yes but not cheap but minimal running costs and less maintenance. John

Hello John,

The running costs spiral when you need new batteries, A friend of mine changed his Lexus before the 3 year warranty ran out because he did not want to get saddled with the £10,000 plus for a set of replacement batteries.

Regards

Alan

[ChrisB]

10 minutes ago, ranworthbreeze said:

Hello John,

The running costs spiral when you need new batteries, A friend of mine changed his Lexus before the 3 year warranty ran out because he did not want to get saddled with the £10,000 plus for a set of replacement batteries.

Regards

Alan

I was under the impression that Toyota Group Hybrids had a Battery Warranty of something like 8 years.

[oldgregg]

They do, and a life span of well over 200,000 miles.

[annv]

Hi Alan Boats use different batteries to cars whare weight and size is important, boats have space and need ballast so use NiFe batteries with 11,000 min cycles 30 year cycle with a  cost of £0.22 pence as against £1.44pence for LFP with 2,500 cycles there are other issues such as maintenance. Your friend possibly used the fast charge as against the overnight charge which allows the batteries to last longer, there is a lot the car manufacturers don't disclose to car users. John

[PaulM]

15 minutes ago, oldgregg said:

They do, and a life span of well over 200,000 miles.

A whole life span? But what is the performance rating at 100,000? I think this is the issue. 

[expilot]

I now own an all electric Freeman Mk 1.  Her gel deep cycle traction batteries were installed in 2005 and one bank of them has just been replaced for £1,500.  At just over £100 per year, I am more than pleased.  

I believe I may have posted the idea before - batteries do not die.  They are murdered.  I know this only too well.  I've done it with my other all-electric boat - a Jack Powles launch, built in 1948 and electrified more than thirty years ago.  I considered going hybrid with my Ripplecraft "Broadland Swift" but have decided to go all-electric with her, too.

[PaulM]

I would love to convert our Princess 30 to full electric! I’m just not sure on the practicality’s just yet. It’s a fair old lump and would need it to be capable of up to six hours cruising on twin motors before a charge.

[expilot]

Broadland Swift is thirty-two feet long and weighs eight tonnes.  I am hoping to get at least ten hours runtime on a single charge.  I am working with specialists EVS from North Shields in an attempt to get it right first time.  EVS already maintain my launch and my Freeman.

[PaulM]

15 minutes ago, expilot said:

Broadland Swift is thirty-two feet long and weighs eight tonnes.  I am hoping to get at least ten hours runtime on a single charge.  I am working with specialists EVS from North Shields in an attempt to get it right first time.  EVS already maintain my launch and my Freeman.

That’s very interesting! Our boat is currently twin (small) petrols on outdrives. Since I bought it I could see how simple the mechanical installation could be to convert to electric. Due to the petrol motors our boat was A LOT cheaper than diesel. (Around half the common asking price)

My thoughts were if the conversion could be done for the additional purchase price  of the Diesel equivalent I would have my perfect boat.

Silent running, the dream!

[NeilB]

Various projects are being worked on now, the cost will be very high for a few years though and charging infrastructure will be an issue.

[oldgregg]

3 hours ago, PaulM said:

A whole life span? But what is the performance rating at 100,000? I think this is the issue. 

What I mean is that they're considered to be perfectly fine for 200,000 miles plus, and there are some Priuses around with absolutely ludicrous mileages. People would consider 100,000 on one not to be a big deal.

Done right, a hybrid is just fine. Done badly, they will of course be a nightmare.

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

1 hour ago, NeilB said:

 and charging infrastructure will be an issue.

Absolutely spot on. The energy companies are already buying in energy from european suppliers, because this country with its rapidly increasing population and demand for rapidly expanding electricity requirements, cannot, and will not be able to ever meet demand unless they have a major (and a very BIG major) change in the way electricity is produced, and the only serious way to produce the demand for the next god knows how many years is nuclear, like it or not. With that in mind, it`s very unlikely we will see any end to internal combustion engines, the governments will do what they always do, and that`s making every internal combustion engine perfectly safe for the environment overnight by putting massive tax rises on them. 

Anybody remember only a few years ago when a lot of people started buying 4x4s, how dangerous for the environment were they, yet put a massive tax increase on them, and they became perfectly safe overnight?.

It`s all a con. 

As for electric powered boats, all very well, but imagine pulling up to a staithe and all the pylons are in use, then what will you do?. A few solar panels on the cabin top will very unlikely be able to produce enough charge to charge up the number of batteries required to cruise for a day. 

As for these electric cars, claims of over 200 mile range etc, but those tests are done in ideal conditions to substantiate those unrealistic figures. When driven in mid winter, with lights on, heater and fan on, screen demister and rear window demister, and windscreen wipers on, and that`s before you even think about using the radio or hands free?. See what that lot does to the battery range.

All of this nonsense started up when diesel engines started to regularly acheive well in excess of 75mpg, meaning car owners were paying only half the road duty they used to on the average petrol engine consumption at the pump.

As i said, it`s all a political con.

If people want all electric boats, fine, just don`t ask me to give up a socket on a pylon when your batteries are knackered.

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

19 minutes ago, oldgregg said:

Done right, a hybrid is just fine. Done badly, they will of course be a nightmare.

Exactly so, even though my post above will be seen as very negative, i do believe a diesel powered hybrid would be a great idea, but as you say, it would have to be done right, or it`s a waste of time and money.

[Andrewcook]

Hi all there ls one interesting note I would like to add at this time their are some newish  Boats that have got Hook ups with  Hook up points along the Broads as  they are their to help cut down on the drain of the  Batteries  while moored up  over night . I'm very grateful for this NBN Forum comments on this Hybrid Boat subject.

Andrew Cook

[Smoggy]

I'm sure it was a greenline I saw a video of on fire on the ybw forums a while back, the superstructure went about 30metres upwards when the battery bank popped if I recall correctly, scary to watch to say the least.

[RS2021]

Surely the natural hybrid for the peace and quiet of the Broads is sail/electric.

[NeilB]

17 minutes ago, Smoggy said:

I'm sure it was a greenline I saw a video of on fire on the ybw forums a while back, the superstructure went about 30metres upwards when the battery bank popped if I recall correctly, scary to watch to say the least.

This one, several fireman injured but surprisingly no fatalities.

 

 

[Smoggy]

Looks to be the same one from a different angle, if only it could happen under PH bridge (unmanned of course).

[ChrisB]

Last year I looked at electric before I changed my car. Nissan promo said the Leaf would do so many miles and it seemed OK.

But when I got to the dealers that was only with the big battery and that was only fitted to the top of the range. I won't boreyou but when we had specified the car with mud flaps and rubber mats etc it was £37.5K. I bought a ford with their 999cc 3 cylinder. Much too much money.

[Meantime]

10 hours ago, SPEEDTRIPLE said:

If people want all electric boats, fine, just don`t ask me to give up a socket on a pylon when your batteries are knackered.

Off course it should be remembered that the electric posts were originally installed as electric boat charging points. The original use has now well and truly been hijacked by anybody with a shore power connection, myself included. If the BA want to get serious about green boating then they would need to readdress the designation of the electric posts, including reserving, or giving priority to electric boaters needing the posts to recharge.

The new emission testing standards seem to have done for a lot of the older style hybrid cars with many manufacturers now opting for electric only cars.

[Regulo]

If the posts are supposed to be for electric boat recharging then they're seriously under specified. A true electric powered Broads river cruiser would need a large capacity battery installation. You won't charge that up for a day's cruising on a 16 amp socket overnight. Even the larger batteried (is that a word?) electric cars need more than an overnight charge to bring them to full capacity. I suppose you'd be able to top them off, if you didn't use the full range, but let's face it, electric boating for the general holidaymaker isn't going to happen. Just as electric vehicles aren't going to be mainstream for several decades, if ever. Not because it couldn't be done, but because there's no great push for the infra-structure.