Playing Norfolk Trains

[DAVIDH]

I love the detail of the field, how traffic has worn the grass away to and beyond the gate, and the odd lengths of timber used at the line crossing. It's something I wouldn't have even thought of. I can see this project is a pastime in itself, and not just a means to get to a point where you can "play Norfolk trains".

[Vaughan]

1 hour ago, DAVIDH said:

how traffic has worn the grass away to and beyond the gate,

That was one of the fun bits, as it happens!  I had bought a scale model, by Oxford Finecast, of a Fordson E27N "High Major" tractor, the same as the one I used to have on my boatyard, for hauling boats out.  One day it will be suitably displayed in a ploughed field somewhere on the layout.  So all I had to do was drive the tractor through the Polyfilla, just before it went hard!  It took longer to clean the wheels of the little tractor afterwards, than it it did to do the modelling!

1 hour ago, DAVIDH said:

I can see this project is a pastime in itself, and not just a means to get to a point where you can "play Norfolk trains".

I think you have hit the spot, there.

My sort of modelling doesn't actually depend on the railway itself. I am trying to represent a piece of central Norfolk countryside as it would have looked in 1952, with a railway running through it.  It is a snapshot in time and it takes a lot of research to try and get it right.

For instance, I was talking about a couple of elm trees in the hedgerow.  I am modelling the days before Dutch Elm Disease ravaged and radically altered the Norfolk countryside, so I want to try and show what it was like, in those days.

[TheQ]

Like Vaughan my model railways have to be in their home area, not a board full of track.

Being 1950s the two tracks into the field made by the wheels of the fergie and trailers are correct.. 

What many forget is before ww2 there should be 3 tracks, one each side for the wheels, and one down the middle for the cart horse...

Wonderful modeling again Vaughan..

We Broadland Model Railway Club, have somewhat hopefully booked Hoveton village hall for our club open day in May 2021.. as well as the more likely jubilee hall, Aylsham for our full Exhibition in October 2021, 

 

Over the years a small model railway club in the Birmingham area called Warley, https://www.thewarleyshow.co.uk/index.html

Gradually they developed their club show, it's now regarded as the national show, taking the biggest hall at the NEC with 20,000 visitors over the two days in November. This year of course it can't happen, so they are having a virtual show 28/29th November 2020. 

It will be streamed on http://youtube.com/c/WarleyModelRailwayClub with further content on www.facebook.com/WarleyMRC.Exhibition

 

[Vaughan]

 

I thought you might like to see my first version of some trees.  These are made from plastic armatures by Model Scenics, which can be bent into all the shapes you want.  I also make them using bits cut out from the centre of a privet hedge.  I then use moss glued onto the branches and then covered with a light dusting of scenic flock.  I have found that diluted PVA glue can be sprayed with a Humbrol air brush, so that helps a lot!

 

 

Notice that the one on the right has been attacked by ivy climbing up the trunk from where it has taken over the hedge.  The farmer will have to sort that out before long, or it will stifle the tree!  The hedge is also a bit higher, and thicker.  Can't have the horses jumping over it!

Do they look like yew trees?  More or less, I hope, but these were made quickly, just to see how they look.  They look a lot better from a distance than they do in these close-ups!  When the layout is complete, the scenic area will be over 7 metres long, so I will get plenty of practice making trees!

 

The scene is now crying out to have the level crossing gates and the fencing around them, so that is the next job, including the mechanism underneath, to open and close them.  So I may not be posting updates for a while!

[grendel]

I know how you feel Vaughan, sometimes its the simplest of details gets you stuck for a solution the longest

[DAVIDH]

3 hours ago, Vaughan said:

Do they look like yew trees?  More or less, I hope, but these were made quickly, just to see how they look.  They look a lot better from a distance than they do in these close-ups!  When the layout is complete, the scenic area will be over 7 metres long, so I will get plenty of practice making trees!

Indeed Vaughan. You will become the branch manager. 

[FairTmiddlin]

3 hours ago, DAVIDH said:

Indeed Vaughan. You will become the branch manager. 

Hopefully he comes out of Lockdown, not looking like the Fat Controller.

[JennyMorgan]

3 minutes ago, FairTmiddlin said:

Hopefully he comes out of Lockdown, not looking like the Fat Controller.

It may already to late to caution Vaughan of that possibility!

[Turnoar]

Fortunately it looks like the trees haven’t over sailed the track beds, I’d hate to see the railco appear at 2.00am on a Monday morning dressed in orange boiler suits armed with chainsaws, the rail mounted grab and chipper snorting like an iron dinosaur, lights blazing and locals peering out of their  sash windows in their night shirts! (Moi) To be fair I was expecting it but it did get me thinking outside of the signal box, just how would you model all that detail right down to the chip dust spilling through the fence off of the embankment let alone the matchsticks holding up my eyelids! Model railways of the present and future may be challenging but therein lies the fun.

[Vaughan]

Has it been that long? perhaps it has.

We have now moved house and I have found myself with a ground floor which is entirely garage and workshop.  It was originally a stables.  So I have the ultimate "man cave"!  I spent about 18 months decorating the new house and then decorating the old one for sale, so then it was time to build a railway!

Here is the station area, as built in our old house, and now installed in the workshop :

 

 

And here is the rest of it :

 

 

 

 

I spent ages doing line drawings of the space, to try and fit something in until it dawned on me that a lot of modellers fit in the storage sidings on a lower level, under the scenic area.  after that "penny" had dropped, it became a lot larger than I had imaged.

 

The scenic part of the layout will be just over a half mile in scale, so there will be room for genuine signalling, of both home and distant signals.  Just at the rear of the train above, the scenery will rise gently to form a cutting, with a road over bridge to allow the train to disappear round the corner.

 

 

This what is called a transition curve, which starts at 15ft radius through the station and then reduces through 11ft, 8ft, 6ft and 5ft, where it joins the wall and runs down the gradient. This gives the illusion of a train disappearing off into the distance.

 

 The scenery will fall away slightly on either side of the curve, before rising gradually into a shallow cutting with a road bridge at the far end. I am hoping this will look rather effective.

 

Another thing I have always sort of promised myself, was to run a 10 coach express train of Gresley main line coaches, hauled by a "Britannia".

 

You wouldn't normally have seen a train like this on the line between Dereham and Wymondham but so what? As they say, it's my train set, after all!

Last year, none of this was started when my family visited us on holiday but I sort of promised myself that I would get something running all the way round before my grandchildren came this year.  It actually ran, about a week before they arrived!  Happily, my nephew and his young family have also been to stay, and also enjoyed it.

It has been a bit of a challenge, as all of my locomotives and rolling stock are hand built from parts of kits and have never run on a layout before.  So I have had to work out, when a coach comes off the track, whether the problem is the track or the coach!

There is now going to be a lot of adjustment, as well as installing the pointwork to complete the station goods yard, so from here on it will probably be another few months before I can say I have it running reliably.  Only then, can I start on the scenery!

[Happy]

20 minutes ago, Vaughan said:

Has it been that long? perhaps it has.

We have now moved house and I have found myself with a ground floor which is entirely garage and workshop.  It was originally a stables.  So I have the ultimate "man cave"!  I spent about 18 months decorating the new house and then decorating the old one for sale, so then it was time to build a railway!

Here is the station area, as built in our old house, and now installed in the workshop :

 

 

And here is the rest of it :

 

 

 

 

I spent ages doing line drawings of the space, to try and fit something in until it dawned on me that a lot of modellers fit in the storage sidings on a lower level, under the scenic area.  after that "penny" had dropped, it became a lot larger than I had imaged.

 

The scenic part of the layout will be just over a half mile in scale, so there will be room for genuine signalling, of both home and distant signals.  Just at the rear of the train above, the scenery will rise gently to form a cutting, with a road over bridge to allow the train to disappear round the corner.

 

 

This what is called a transition curve, which starts at 15ft radius through the station and then reduces through 11ft, 8ft, 6ft and 5ft, where it joins the wall and runs down the gradient. This gives the illusion of a train disappearing off into the distance.

 

 The scenery will fall away slightly on either side of the curve, before rising gradually into a shallow cutting with a road bridge at the far end. I am hoping this will look rather effective.

 

Another thing I have always sort of promised myself, was to run a 10 coach express train of Gresley main line coaches, hauled by a "Britannia".

 

You wouldn't normally have seen a train like this on the line between Dereham and Wymondham but so what? As they say, it's my train set, after all!

Last year, none of this was started when my family visited us on holiday but I sort of promised myself that I would get something running all the way round before my grandchildren came this year.  It actually ran, about a week before they arrived!  Happily, my nephew and his young family have also been to stay, and also enjoyed it.

It has been a bit of a challenge, as all of my locomotives and rolling stock are hand built from parts of kits and have never run on a layout before.  So I have had to work out, when a coach comes off the track, whether the problem is the track or the coach!

There is now going to be a lot of adjustment, as well as installing the pointwork to complete the station goods yard, so from here on it will probably be another few months before I can say I have it running reliably.  Only then, can I start on the scenery!

I can see now why that boat in Stalham don't get used!  Well done  

[ExSurveyor]

I have man cave envy 😁

[Bikertov]

Looks an amazing man cave, and a brilliant layout there - very jealous !

Do I spot some old H&M controllers there in the third and forth pictures ?

[Bikertov]

So having quickly posted a comment earlier, I have now looked back through the whole thread, as I hadn't seen it before ...

WOW, WOW, WOW - not sure what else I can say !

You have clearly put in many many hours of amazing work, more than I could ever have done even in my youth. Your dedication and attention to detail is incredible.

I recognise quite a few of the brand names you mention, of rolling stock, components, wheels, scenery etc.

It really took me back to my childhood, when I was an active junior member of The Model Railway Club (in Kings Cross) as well as being the first ever junior member of the S Scale Model Railway Society (1:64, where pretty much everything had to be scratch built))

I was a big fan of the LNER, and because of our Broads visits became fascinated with the M&GNJR around North Norfolk, terminating at one of the Cromer stations. When I was in my early teens, so in the late 70's or so, I remember one summer getting on a train with my bicycle from Liverpool street for the day, and cycling around maybe North Walsham or Aylsham ? There was still a station and tracks, but it was disused for passenger services by then, with only a few goods trains. I took loads of black and white pictures of the station that I then developed myself, but I have no idea where those picture are now.

[Roy]

4 minutes ago, Bikertov said:

So having quickly posted a comment earlier, I have now looked back through the whole thread, as I hadn't seen it before ...

WOW, WOW, WOW - not sure what else I can say !

You have clearly put in many many hours of amazing work, more than I could ever have done even in my youth. Your dedication and attention to detail is incredible.

I recognise quite a few of the brand names you mention, of rolling stock, components, wheels, scenery etc.

It really took me back to my childhood, when I was an active junior member of The Model Railway Club (in Kings Cross) as well as being the first ever junior member of the S Scale Model Railway Society (1:64, where pretty much everything had to be scratch built))

I was a big fan of the LNER, and because of our Broads visits became fascinated with the M&GNJR around North Norfolk, terminating at one of the Cromer stations. When I was in my early teens, so in the late 70's or so, I remember one summer getting on a train with my bicycle from Liverpool street for the day, and cycling around maybe North Walsham or Aylsham ? There was still a station and tracks, but it was disused for passenger services by then, with only a few goods trains. I took loads of black and white pictures of the station that I then developed myself, but I have no idea where those picture are now.

That was probably Aylsham you biked around. 

Aylsham station was knocked down in 1989 For building of the Bure valley railway wroxham to Aylsham. 

Have you travelled on the bure valley it’s a good day out for train lovers. 

Roy 

[Turnoar]

Great to see this thread back on track! When I saw Vaughan’s curve I immediately thought of Themelthorpe, and with Bikertov mentioning Aylsham I remember both biking up to Reepham on the old track bed in the late 90s and also the fact that the freight line ran from Lenwade via Whitwelll to that vicinity up to the 1980’s. I hope they extend the Whitwell run round the curve one day to Reepham and beyond.

Dereham may extend to North Elmham at some point, I can imagine more joined up thinking in future but hope such dreams become railety.

[Bikertov]

4 hours ago, Roy said:

That was probably Aylsham you biked around. 

Aylsham station was knocked down in 1989 For building of the Bure valley railway wroxham to Aylsham. 

Have you travelled on the bure valley it’s a good day out for train lovers. 

Roy 

Looking on the Interweb, at Wikipedia and various pictures, I think it must have been Aylsham South I visited, which was a Great Eastern station.

I seem to vaguely recall I travelled there on the back old OS maps I borrowed from the library, looking for the M&GNJR Station, only to be told by locals when I was cycling round looking for it that it had been demolished only a few years before.

When was up a year or so ago, I did stop at the Bure Valley railway, but didnt get the chance to travel it. Will make sure I correct that on my next visit !

[Vaughan]

19 hours ago, Bikertov said:

Do I spot some old H&M controllers there in the third and forth pictures ?

Indeed, and they still work well after 45 years, although I have been inside them to clean the rheostat sliders and solder a few weak connections.

When we lived in Norfolk I had a fairly large layout in the loft of a bungalow, but I built it too quickly, without thought of moving house.  So when we moved I just had to demolish it, although I kept all the track, electrics, a lot of small fittings and the rolling stock that I had built at the time.  All this has followed me around in boxes to wherever we have moved since then and now finally, I can use it again.  So all of the track in the storage sidings and round the "off scene" areas, comes from my original layout.  The scenic part is in C&L Finescale track which, although OO gauge, looks very realistic.

For those interested in the electrics, I can show you what "goes on" under the storage sidings :

 

These sidings are known to modellers as the Fiddle Yard, as this is where you fiddle about changing the make-up of trains, changing engines, connecting fiddly little couplings and making sure all the wheels are on the track. I have arranged this in three lifting sections, which can be unbolted and stood on their side, to work on the wiring underneath.

 

It looks complicated but in DC analogue it is just positive and negative, at the end of the day.

At top right are the switches for the point solenoids, which are pushbuttons, to throw the solenoid one way or the other. At centre are switches which change the polarity of the point crossings, known as "frogs".

 

At the other end (which is out of reach) I am using Tortoise point motors, which are more of a servo motor, so that when you make the switch, the motor travels until it reaches a limit switch, and stops.  At the same time, a microswitch inside the box will change the polarity of the crossings.  This is easier at this end, but the wiring is a lot more complicated when it comes to the switches on the centre board :

 

Here at right, are the "double pole double throw" switches for the 6 point motors.  These have to be wired so as to reverse the polarity of the current to the motor, to make it go backwards and forwards.

To left of these are the switches to insulate the sections in the fiddle yard, in order to select a train to run.  The yard will take 14 trains, which sounds like a lot, but it may not be enough!

Over to the left, the thick white wires are standard household 3 strand lighting cable, which provide a positive feed to each of the "up" and "down" tracks, with a common negative return.  These wires go all the way under the layout and the feed is taken from them to each length of track along the line.  Known as a wiring "bus", this assures that good power is available at the far corners, where the trains have to struggle up a long gradient.

This bus is arranged to give power to three separate sections of the layout - known as power districts - and where they disappear into holes in the board they are connected to the controller, which has 6 switches, so as isolate each of the 3 districts, on the up and down lines.  At the moment, the two tracks, up and down, are electrically separate, which means in future, with two controllers, I can run two trains at a time.  If I want to have a crossover anywhere on the layout in future, that will need what they call "cab control" and I am not going to get into all that at this stage!

I prefer traditional DC analogue control as it is more like running a real railway.  All the same the way it is wired, with a central bus, means that anyone with their own DCC locomotives and their own controller, could easily run trains on the layout.  You could even have one track on DC analogue, and the other on DCC!

So that's how it works.

Happy modelling!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bikertov]

Very ingenious use of spare track as a power bus !

[Vaughan]

 

There was a daily train of goods vans from Lowestoft, via Norwich, Dereham and Kings Lynn, to the marshalling yards at Whitemoor, usually containing fresh fish.  It is seen here going through Kimberly Park station, hauled by the class B12 locomotive that is now preserved and running on the North Norfolk Railway.

 

And here is the same train, hauled by my model of the same engine.  I have photo evidence for almost all the trains that I will be running.  It looks like a mirror image, as the station building at Kimberly is on the up platform but at Thuxton it is on the down side.

I have just had a visit from a neighbour with a holiday home nearby, who is an accomplished railway modeller as well as a recently retired train driver, so I wanted him to see the layout running, before I now put everything away in boxes again and start doing a lot of modifications to the track work.

 

 

So this was the last train to run on the layout yesterday and there won't be any more "playing trains" for maybe two months or more.

Roll on Christmas. Oops, sorry, I shouldn't have said that . . . . .

[Happy]

2 hours ago, Vaughan said:

 

There was a daily train of goods vans from Lowestoft, via Norwich, Dereham and Kings Lynn, to the marshalling yards at Whitemoor, usually containing fresh fish.  It is seen here going through Kimberly Park station, hauled by the class B12 locomotive that is now preserved and running on the North Norfolk Railway.

 

And here is the same train, hauled by my model of the same engine.  I have photo evidence for almost all the trains that I will be running.  It looks like a mirror image, as the station building at Kimberly is on the up platform but at Thuxton it is on the down side.

I have just had a visit from a neighbour with a holiday home nearby, who is an accomplished railway modeller as well as a recently retired train driver, so I wanted him to see the layout running, before I now put everything away in boxes again and start doing a lot of modifications to the track work.

 

 

So this was the last train to run on the layout yesterday and there won't be any more "playing trains" for maybe two months or more.

Roll on Christmas. Oops, sorry, I shouldn't have said that . . . . .

Oh why not.  At least Gracie won't mind  

[Chelsea14Ian]

Anyone  for a mince 🥧 pie?

[WherryNice]

16 minutes ago, Chelsea14Ian said:

Anyone  for a mince 🥧 pie?

Yes please:)

[Chelsea14Ian]

Sausage rolls, Christmas  pudding,Brandy butter,custard. 

Merry Christmas.