Keebz Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 I’ve seen on another social that there will be a charge to drop your weight on malthouse broad and salhouse next season, they used to charge on salhouse and we used to pay it but I was told by to boat yard owners if your on your weight they haven’t really got rite to ask you to pay if this is the case it’s two more places I won’t moor, i stress I have no problem at all in being charged for mooring with facilities but for swinging on your mud weight I’m not sure it’s worth it think I’d rather wild moor I’ll probably get shouted down now but when you pay the river license to ba and there reducing there services/facilities it’s the usual private owner frustration!! 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughan Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 If this is true it is very bad news and also sad to see that cruising on the northern Broads is being continually affected by profiteering. Some might call it "killing the golden goose". Both Salhouse and Malthouse Broads are on private land but they are tidal; so the landowner owns the bottom of the broad but not the water in it. So you are allowed to cruise over the broad but if you drop a mud weight, you are on the landowner's land! In the old days the lease on Malthouse Broad and the staithe was held by Blakes, so no problem. The lease on the staithe is now with the BA but I don't know if they also lease the broad. Presumably not, by the sound of it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CambridgeCabby Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 I have emailed Salhouse Broad to confirm this , I will post their reply when I have received it . 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rightsaidfred Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 Don't know where this has come from, there was a time when chancers were trying it on on Salhouse, I think I would be inclined to tell them to join the foreign office not to sure what they could do if you refuse to pay. Fred 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wussername Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 My old grandfather, (all grandfather's are old.........I'm a grandfather) told me that there is an ancient statute bound in the history of time, in days of old when boatmen were bold, you were allowed to anchor in tidal water for one full turn of the tide. Anywhere. Free of charge. Makes sense dunt it if you were under sail and the wind dropped. This statute was created before people even knew about engines. It applied to all craft, why would anybody change it ? Even today some of the iconic Hunter craft do not have engines, just a quant. No wind, after sunset, a mist descending, a murky night ahead, no lights quanting to a refuge, a safe mooring for protection against marauding private night cruisers. I wud tell im to sling his ook i wunt sling mine, wus he a goin to do about it? Old Wussername 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoggy Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 15 minutes ago, Wussername said: I wud tell im to sling his ook i wunt sling mine, Surely if anchored you have "slung yer ook" even if yer ook don't have pointy bits. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wussername Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 The term sling your hook is polite way of telling someone to go away. This term has a nautical origin. Hook was a name given to the ship's anchor, and the sling was the cradle that housed the anchor. Therefore, to sling your hook meant to lift anchor, stow it and sail away. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelsea14Ian Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 So okay we're still in the middle of covid,and earning a few Bob,is hard.This is taking the mick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyg Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 My memory is probably playing tricks here. But I'm sure back in the 70s on salhouse you had a guy going round in a dinghy with an outboard on it,collecting mooring fees. I'm sure thats correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rightsaidfred Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, andyg said: My memory is probably playing tricks here. But I'm sure back in the 70s on salhouse you had a guy going round in a dinghy with an outboard on it,collecting mooring fees. I'm sure thats correct. Dont know about 70s but they tried it in the late 80s early 90s and when challenged said it was for the lifeboat fund also some youngsters about 10 or 12 years ago that didn't last long. Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CambridgeCabby Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 Currently , this is still mere speculation or hearsay , when I receive a reply from Salhouse Broads representatives themselves I will post it on here . Until then , IMHO, I feel it is prudent to refrain from “ mud slinging “ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rightsaidfred Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, CambridgeCabby said: Until then , IMHO, I feel it is prudent to refrain from “ mud slinging “ Thought we were talking mud weighting and hook slinging. Sorry couldn't resist Fred 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wussername Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 I suspect there is little mud in Salhouse broad, it is not an old peat dig. It is in fact an old gravel pit. Hence the sandy/gravel beach. Andrew. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keebz Posted September 18, 2021 Author Share Posted September 18, 2021 34 minutes ago, andyg said: My memory is probably playing tricks here. But I'm sure back in the 70s on salhouse you had a guy going round in a dinghy with an outboard on it,collecting mooring fees. I'm sure thats correct. I remember this in the eighties Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broads01 Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 3 hours ago, Vaughan said: Both Salhouse and Malthouse Broads are on private land but they are tidal; so the landowner owns the bottom of the broad but not the water in it. So you are allowed to cruise over the broad but if you drop a mud weight, you are on the landowner's land! Two questions: Does that mean that making a charge for mudweighting is legal and enforceable? Are Salhouse and Malthouse under the same ownership? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughan Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 I think Marshman could answer the second question better than I. When Black Horse Broad was re-opened (forcibly) by Herbert Woods and Co, because it is tidal, the rule was that you could cruise around it but not moor anywhere or drop a mud weight. Even though there is an old staithe, which leads up to where the Black Horse pub was. Wroxham Broad is private because in those days it was not tidal. It is leased from the Trafford estate by the NBYC, who allow access and mooring by mud weight but used to charge for it. I have heard they normally don't bother any more. Cockshoot dyke and broad were leased by Blakes, until it was closed for a very successful mud pumping experiment but unfortunately never re-opened. Malthouse Broad also was leased by Blakes. Ranworth Inner Broad should technically be open as it is tidal, but who is going to enforce it? Herbert Woods and Co are no longer with us. I think what it boils down to is that all these ancient rights have had to be fought for, at some time in the past. Maybe this means we should continue to fight for them now? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughan Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 By the way, this is one of the reasons why I keep banging on about the right of navigation to a staithe. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rightsaidfred Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 8 hours ago, Broads01 said: Two questions: Does that mean that making a charge for mudweighting is legal and enforceable? Are Salhouse and Malthouse under the same ownership? Yes by members of the Cator family with pretty much everything inbetween, this includes Horning village marina, Woodbastwick to Cockshoot, Southgates and now Ferry Marina. I had a lot of respect for Charles, sadly since his passing there is a totally different emphasis on their holdings including what happened with the moorings at Percys Island and Woodbastwick, Fred Horning 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddybear Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 10 hours ago, CambridgeCabby said: Until then , IMHO, I feel it is prudent to refrain from “ mud slinging “ A lot less painful than hook slinging LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQ Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 The thing about tidal rights, is it only applies to natural waters, before the rediscovery that the broads were not natural , that thought was used to keep various waters open. But we now know the broads are not natural. So legally the land owner of a broad has total rights to close it off.... UNLESS Some rights are otherwise granted. Such as access to a staithe, or say Barton broad where the river was diverted through the broad. Access to a staithe, does not give the rights to mudweight. Sutton ( originally called Stalham broad), apart from the fact it could do with being reopened into its original broad size, it's now just really a wider bit of river. Yes rights of access. Bridge broad, not sure who actually owns it but access is allowed. Wroxham broad, no rights, never been a staithe, no reason for any one to use it. NBYC hire it from Trafford estates and have total rights. Salhouse broad, ex gravel pit. As far as I know no staithe and no rights to use it but no objection from the owners. In the distant past there was a charge to mudweight, various chancers have extracted money since . What the current position for mudweight charging is I don't know. Hoveton Great Broad and associated minor connections , closed off by the Blofield family, no staithe, but reports are it was a wherry short cut, I believe there's a photo of a wherry on the broad, so closure of the broad is doubted legally. Hoveton little Broad / Black Horse Broad the wherry men used to moor in the north east corner to walk up to the black horse pub without objection. So some rights have been earned Cockshoot broad, no staithe no reason to use it so doubtful we'll ever get access again. Ranworth Broad, no staithe but is it really part of malthouse broad? Should there be rights to navigate? Malthouse broad has a staithe therefore rights to navigate. South Walsham broad, the Weirs, well there is a staithe in the Weirs area so a right to navigate, but does that apply to the main part of South Walsham broad? Hickling broad, and associated open waters to get there, there are staithes and there must have been a waterway through it so yes rights to navigate. Horsey Broad, access to Horsey staithe and Waxham cut which once led to a brickworks, so yes rights to navigate whatever the national trust say. Trinity broads, I believe there was once wherry access to the broads, and that it's still possible by canoe, but I can't see the right of access ever being restored. Southern broads I don't know, and I've missed out some bits of the northern broads. I'm sure others can add to this. 2 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helian Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 On 18/09/2021 at 21:28, andyg said: My memory is probably playing tricks here. But I'm sure back in the 70s on salhouse you had a guy going round in a dinghy with an outboard on it,collecting mooring fees. I'm sure thats correct. Yes I clearly remember that too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trambo Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 3 hours ago, Helian said: Yes I clearly remember that too You were issued with a "Ultimate" type bus ticket which had a Blakes flag advert on the reverse. I put one in a book for safe keeping years ago. Never seen it since! Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CambridgeCabby Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 I have received a reply from the Ranger at Salhouse 2 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebell Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Simon, thanks for finding out about this for us 😎 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughan Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 9 hours ago, TheQ said: I'm sure others can add to this. Thank you very much for that Q. I can add one simple example on the north rivers : Thurne dyke is open, as it leads to a staithe. Oby dyke is private, as it doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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