Ranworth Update

[rightsaidfred]

Having looked back through various correspondance and recalling conversations with  various other individuals it seems to come down to one issue, the BA stance based on their advisors is that it is not a Public Staithe while most of us are convinced through historical use it is.

One suggestion is that anyone given a copy of the second notice retains it as evidance to show the lengths the BA need to go to try and elict payment.

Fred

[floydraser]

10 hours ago, grendel said:

If you let the rangers tie the ropes, are they then the ones that moored it? Would that make them responsible for the charge?

Yes, but maybe they get 10% employee discount?

Or, if they refused to pay, the lady from the shop would issue them with a little bit of paper and the BA would have to fine itself through a court case. The case for the defence would be interesting... 

[MauriceMynah]

I was nor going to contribute further to this thread having made my views on the matter some time ago, however,,,

There were four boats having difficulty mooring at the staithe yesterday in the slightly tricky crosswind. Two were dayboats, each finally taking two spaces. I asked one of them to move up a bit, which he did, enabling me to moor. I went into the space, and hadn't even finished tying my ropes when I was approached by the lady to take payment.

I told her that it was my belief that the justification for introducing this charge was that there were rangers there to assist people mooring.

She apologised and explained that she was in the information centre with customers and was the only ranger there. The other ranger was taking trippers out on Liana.

I was able go express my displeasure without showing how angry I really was, as I had no wish to upset the ground troops on a matter over which they have little control, though I did make a formal complaint 

I think what upset me was the speed she was with me given there was no sign of her when actually needed. 

A short time later, the Liana returned and the skipper/ranger complained to me about my having tied to one of the posts by the emergency ladder. (I was in no way impeding access to that ladder) .

I have no idea how I stopped myself from giving him both barrels!!!

 

[grendel]

so, in your opinion, were you harassed for payment before you had a chance to go pay at the information centre, as the notice suggests you do? as that is one of the precepts that you could overthrow a car parking charge, as they are not allowed to harass the person parking, i believe this is the sort of behaviour about which BRAG is asking people for evidence for.

[MauriceMynah]

Was I harassed ?

Well, hardly harassed, and I have no "evidence" to prove we even met 

I could stand in court and testify but if disputed, I have nothing to support my statements.

No, in fairness if anything it was I who was doing the harassing 

[Vaughan]

2 hours ago, MauriceMynah said:

I was nor going to contribute further to this thread having made my views on the matter some time ago, however,,,

There were four boats having difficulty mooring at the staithe yesterday in the slightly tricky crosswind. Two were dayboats, each finally taking two spaces. I asked one of them to move up a bit, which he did, enabling me to moor. I went into the space, and hadn't even finished tying my ropes when I was approached by the lady to take payment.

I told her that it was my belief that the justification for introducing this charge was that there were rangers there to assist people mooring.

She apologised and explained that she was in the information centre with customers and was the only ranger there. The other ranger was taking trippers out on Liana.

I was able go express my displeasure without showing how angry I really was, as I had no wish to upset the ground troops on a matter over which they have little control, though I did make a formal complaint 

I think what upset me was the speed she was with me given there was no sign of her when actually needed. 

A short time later, the Liana returned and the skipper/ranger complained to me about my having tied to one of the posts by the emergency ladder. (I was in no way impeding access to that ladder) .

I have no idea how I stopped myself from giving him both barrels!!!

This is an extremely telling witness statement, especially as it happened at the height of a very important Bank Holiday weekend.

I very much hope that @BroadsAuthority will be reading this post carefully, when their office resumes work tomorrow.

[Chelsea14Ian]

If they read it,will they care?I would  like to think they would,but I doubt  it.

[floydraser]

I think the ba should know and it should be on record that they have been told, for future reference. 

BRAG should know for anecdotal evidence. 

[MauriceMynah]

I'm not sure how to tell BRAG, but if someone can copy my post to them I'd appreciate it.

[TFrench89]

1 hour ago, MauriceMynah said:

I'm not sure how to tell BRAG, but if someone can copy my post to them I'd appreciate it.

evidence@broads-reform.org

[jeffbroadslover]

How much assistance was given by the ranger to the four boats that were experiencing difficulty in mooring?

I understand that the reason for the mooring charge is to pay the rangers for their help whether it is needed or not !!!!!!

Jeff  

[Wussername]

Four boats at the same time?

Or, was there a time difference between each episode. It is important.

 

[MauriceMynah]

4 boats , 2 (dayboats) in immediate need of assistance, the other two, of which I was one, following straight after where assistance would have... Well... assisted.  Both dayboats tied up and I was tying up when ranger approached. Dayboats took at least 5 to 10 minutes to come in stern on and each taking up more space than was necessary.  I was having to hold station while they tied and had to ask one of them to move up and share the mooring post with the boat they had moored next to. 

Little Nyx was the fourth boat and he managed to get in next to the taxi rank. Whilst Bernie needed no assistance,  again things would have been quicker and easier had there been a ranger on hand to direct and assist the dayboats.

This morning when leaving the mooring, there was no boat next to me either side and the rather strong wind was making untying difficult. It was 09:55, both rangers were in the information centre. I received no assistance. 

 

[MauriceMynah]

I should add that I'm not that bothered about when I left the moorings, it's not an event normally needing assistance... and it was a bit chilly.

[jeffbroadslover]

Nice to know that they earned their wages by helping !!!!!!

Jeff

[Broads01]

MM did you pay the mooring fee?

It strikes me that if the ranger was indeed having to combine shop duties with boat assistance then she's been lumbered with a completely unrealistic job. Perhaps the BA aren't serious about providing assistance? Surely not!

[Chelsea14Ian]

Knowing how they may employ another  Ranger.Costing more,which they may well increase the fees or on our tolls.

[MauriceMynah]

4 hours ago, Broads01 said:

MM did you pay the mooring fee?

Yes I did.  I find there's a wonderful view from the moral high ground .

[BroadAmbition]

I’ve got a different answer 

Griff

[MauriceMynah]

27 minutes ago, BroadAmbition said:

I’ve got a different answer 

Griff

I'm sure you have Griff, and I both understand and respect your standpoint. Mine is just a little different.

If I go into a restaurant and find the meal lacking,  I will always pay for it and then make my feelings known.

Never wilI I refuse to pay, nor do I accept a refund. I find this attitude tends to make those concerned listen to my complaint and perhaps even act on it. 

This course of action removes the belief that there is a different agenda.  Just my take Griff, and nothing against yours. 

[Broads01]

That's fair enough.

[Vaughan]

11 hours ago, Broads01 said:

That's fair enough.

Except, to use MM's analogy, you wouldn't pay for a restaurant meal twice, even if you were satisfied with it.

But at Ranworth you are now demanded payment twice.  Once in the river toll (+13%) and twice, on the spot.

[MauriceMynah]

Sorry Vaughan, not quite my point.

I am aware of the arguments put forwards regarding payments, my point is that I pay THEN argue.

It is my belief that this puts you in a stronger position. 

If you don't pay, then argue that you shouldn't have to,  they are in a position to reply

"Well you haven't, so whatever. Goodbye... Have a nice day."

My way obliges them to at least listen.

 

 

[Vaughan]

Well, time will tell which way is best.  One way or another something must be done to stop this, or we all know that next Spring there will be charges for BA moorings all over the Broads.  I can't imagine any boat owners are going to like that.

It's the old saying : You give them an inch; they'll take a mile.

[Vaughan]

21 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

my point is that I pay THEN argue.

But you have already paid. That's my point.