Racism And The Colston Statue

[RumPunch]

There have been suggestions on various veterans / forces groups that they will be surrounding relevant 'monuments' during future planned protests. Could get messy

[MotorBoater]

3 hours ago, Chelsea14Ian said:

I think people  need to get a grip on this.Set up a National  inquiry  into the whole question  of Race relations, equality, Education  and so on.Very wide ranging I admit. As it stands,this whole thing is playing  into the hands of a group of odd fellows, rent a mob at the front,who frankly  dont agree with any one apart from themselves. Sometime in future  they will latch on to any protect that appears, no doubt  many of them that took part in the climate protects. Some local councils,using what muscle they have to have a go at the Government.Many that are taking part are just following along perhaps they dont want to miss out.Many middle aged, middle  class,for there own political reasons.In short the real reason it started in the first place,was the clear fact that a man died at the hand of a Police  officer. Understandable that people  want to protect.Quite rightly he and the other Police  officers are facing justice. We do I believe  need to debate many issues concerning  race and take correct action. If these protects continue  in my view the only thing it will active is to make matters worse. 

I can't disagree with the sentiments expressed  but we have a real problem with Enquiries in this country.

I would support the idea to the hilt if I didn't think the "Winners" would be those who shout and scream the loudest.

As soon as an Enquiry is announced Rent-A-Mob will hit the streets objecting to the terms of reference

Then the choice of members

Then the choice of witnesses

Then which recommendations to adopt

As it is I worry that it will just be another tool for beating the confused majority about the head with the usual bricks, staves and, apparently, bicycles.

Ian, I have followed your posts for months and I believe you speak from the heart but such an all-in-one enquiry as that you suggest should be preceded by answers to a few lesser questions such as why are Rent-A-Mob gatherings not stamped on earlier, especially with meetings of more than six outlawed at present

Maybe we should start with an Enquiry into senior police officers who seem to believe the Police "Service" is a uniformed social service, and who persist in placing their members in harms way without enough kit and support.

"Or we could actually listen to the genuine protesters about their treatment in this country and where things are wrong put them right. Then rent-a-mob will not have a protest to hijack!"

Ray, Rent-A-Mob will always find an excuse. That has nothing to do with your desire for people to listen though. But if we are to listen to "Genuine Protesters" we need to be able to sort out who they are.

Keith

[Chelsea14Ian]

Keith you make some very good points. I just worry  that these protests are going to carry on and being hijacked by those that have a grudge for a number  of reasons. I  dont disagree with some of the core points there making.Now perhaps is the time to invite people  to have a proper debate.Will all those taking part be happy  perhaps not but this needs to be dealt with looking for a acceptable outcome for the majority. After all said and done we are all in a deadly pandemic. 

[grendel]

3 hours ago, Ray said:

Or we could actually listen to the genuine protesters about their treatment in this country and where things are wrong put them right. Then rent-a-mob will not have a protest to hijack!

unfortunately rent a mob are causing their voice to go unheard, we would listen if we could, but not if we are going to be showered with bricks from rent a mob - they do more harm for the cause than good. the media cover the violent activities and give rent a mob their fame and glory and 5 seconds of gratification, meanwhile any cause is relegated to nowhere due to the violence. how are we to hear the voice if the bricks stop us getting close enough to hear. I think there are plenty willing to listen, and even act, but cant.

[Ray]

Good point, here are some resources available without bricks. I don't claim to have looked at them but it only took 5 minutes to find this list. Some are on platforms I don't have but there should be plenty to get a flavour of the problem.

 

Black Lives Matter Resources

Following the tragic news surrounding the murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis police officers, many people are asking themselves, ‘what can I do, what can I say, what action can I take?’ to eradicate systematic racism and fight for justice.

Following the tragic news surrounding the murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis police officers, many people are asking themselves, ‘what can I do, what can I say, what action can I take?’ to eradicate systematic racism and fight for justice.

Overt and covert racism isn’t just an American problem. It’s a worldwide injustice. We are all accountable for the energy and actions that cause harm to BIPOC. We must ask more of ourselves and our friends and interrogate tough truths; to lean into the discomfort and denial and seek to understand our privilege as white people and what that power and protection has afforded us.

It’s never too late to cultivate change, empathy and education. To be better and do better. If you’re wondering where to start with your learning, or how to dismantle institutional racism in your own life and immediate circles – because, yes, it exists – we’ve rounded up some insightful resources to help you begin this life-long work.

It’s not up to our black friends to do the work, they are exhausted enough and still, we dare to ask more of them; to carry more weight for us. Enough.

The obligation to challenge the ways white supremacy resides within you is no one else’s job but your own. We all have to put in the work to undo the silence. Start now – speak up, be an active ally and, if nothing else, make it a priority to listen and learn.

Now more than ever, we need to use our voices to verbalise a narrative that doesn’t belong to us but that was systematically created by us, and to keep the volume up until black people and POC can breathe.

Below is by no means a comprehensive list, and we will look to constantly update it. If you think we are missing something important, drop it in the comments.

Accounts you can follow

Nova Reid – @Novareidoffical on Instagram Nova runs in depth and comprehensive anti racism courses. For anyone in a financial position to do so the knowledge you gain about becoming a better ally to POC is invaluable.

Munroe Bergdorf – @Munroebergdorf on Instagram

Donté Colley – @Dontecolley on Instagram

Stephanie Yeboah – @StephanieYeboah on Instagram – be sure to check out Stephanie’s IGTV ‘I’m tired of the white tears’ Her blog, her book, and her Patreon here. Steph has also hosted a Tuesday Takeover on Zoella, you can watch it here.

Chrissy Rutherford – @Chrissyford on Instagram. Chrissy uploaded a very helpful IGTV titles “It’s not enough to just say “I’m not racist”

Nicole Ocran – @Nicoleocran on Instagram. Nicole’s BLM highlight is really insightful and points out the emotional labour that POC go through when white people continually ask for help/directions/resources.

Jameela Jamil – @JameelaJamilOfficial on Instagram

Florence Given – @Florencegiven on Instagram

Rachel Elizabeth Cargle – @Rachel.cargle on Instagram.

Layla F. Saad – @Laylafsaad on Instagram Layla is the author of Me and White Supremacy.

Dom Roberts – @Domrobxtrts on Insgagram.

The Grief Case – @Thegriefcase on Instagram. Specifically, take a look at this post about supporting black communities.

The Conscious Kid – @theconsciouskid on Instagram. If you are a parent take a look at this post discussing the idea that children may be ‘too young’ to learn about race issues and how racism can be reinforced by the silence of white care givers.

Mireille C Harper – @Mireillecharper on Instagram. Be sure to read her post on education and advice regarding non-optical-allyship.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez – @AOC on Instagram congresswoman for NY has been sharing helpful information for those protesting.

Janaya Future Khan – @Janayathefuture on Instagram. Janaya has uploaded a live-stream to her IGTV aimed at white people only, to teach and educate, for people wanting to know what else they can do to help.

Gal-Dem Magazine – @galdemzine on Instagram.

From Privilege to Progress – @Privtoprog on Instagram.

Yazzie – @Standforhumanity on Instagram. Yazzie has also hosted a Tuesday Takeover on Zoella, you can watch it here.

Black Lives Matter – @Blklivesmatter on Instagram.

Books you can read

Why I’m No Longer Talking To White People About Race by Reni Eddo-Lodge. Reni is also asking people who buy her book to purchase from small independent sellers or better yet borrow from a friend and spend the money on donating.

Me and White Supremacy: How to Recognise Your Privilege, Combat Racism and Change the World by Layla F. Saad.

White Fragility by Robin DiAngelo. Find Robin’s other literature, podcasts, articles and more here.

I Am Not Your Baby Mother by Candice Braithwaite

So You Want To Talk About Race by Ijeoma Oluo

Girl, Woman, Other by Bernardine Evaristo

Race Matters by Cornel West

I’m Still Here: Black Dignity in a world made for whiteness by Austin Channing Brown

Shows, Documentaries and Ted Talks you can watch

When They See Us – Netflix – “Five teens from Harlem become trapped in a nightmare when they’re falsely accused of a brutal attack in Central Park. Based on the true story”

I Am Not Your ***** – Documentary Amazon – “The memoir recounts the lives of James Baldwin’s close friends and civil rights leaders Malcolm X, Martin Luther King Jr., and Medgar Evers.”

Dear White People – Netflix

The Hate U Give -Hulu

What happens when I try to talk race with white people – YouTube – Insightful short video ft Renni Eddo-Lodge (author of Why I’m No Longer Talking To White People About Race) that really succinctly sums up the issues at play when discussing racism with white people. Easy and accessible language amongst maybe some of the more academic content online.

White People, Enough: A Look at Power and Control | Jaelyn Coates | TEDxCSU

Let’s get to the root of racial injustice | Megan Ming Francis | TEDxRainier

Not all Superheros wear capes-how you have the power to change the world | Nova Reid | TEDxFrankfurt

Petitions you can sign

List of petitions you can sign from Black Lives Canada – This includes area codes you can use if you are not based in the US

Petition to Defund the police

Colour of Change petition to charge all officers involved with George Floyds murder be charged with murder

Change.org petition for jusitce for George Floyd

Black Lives Matter, two petitions you can sign to help black communities dealing with coronavirus and demanding racial data.

Black Lives Matter petition to defund the police

Places you can donate

Official George Floyd Memorial Fund Go Fund Me Page

List of funds for victims from Black Lives Matter

List of ways you can donate to help protestors

Important places you can donate to including the BLM Fund

Protest Information

Important information and numbers for those protesting in the US

UK Protest Information

What to bring and wear to a protest

Brighton Protest Information

Articles you can read

Why You Need to Stop Saying “All Lives Matter” By Rachel Cargle

10 Habits of Someone Who Doesn’t Know They’re Anti-Black

How to be a white ally by Stephanie Yeboah (Patreon)

100 Ways White People Can Make Life Less Frustrating For People of Color

Podcasts you can listen to

Code: Switch NPR – “Hosted by journalists of color, our podcast tackles the subject of race head-on.” Explores everything from pop culture, to politics, to sport. Race impacts every part of life.

Momentum: A Race Forward – Features movement voices, stories, and strategies for racial justice.

Intersectionality Matters! – Intersectionality Matters! is a podcast hosted by Kimberlé Crenshaw, an American civil rights advocate and a leading scholar of critical race theory.

About Race – Hosted by Reni Eddo-Lodge

Nova Reid and Vicki & Selina from loveprojectlove – A powerful conversation about race, racism and white privilege with Nova Reid

[Ray]

Well this is brilliant, I downloaded Instagram and now know what that is and how to use it (5 minutes tops) I started with an American lady explaining what White Privilege means to people in the BLM movement, not what you may think!

It's a start and I was already sympathetic to their cause!

[Paladin]

58 minutes ago, Ray said:

Good point, here are some resources available without bricks. I don't claim to have looked at them but it only took 5 minutes to find this list. Some are on platforms I don't have but there should be plenty to get a flavour of the problem.

 

Black Lives Matter Resources

Following the tragic news surrounding the murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis police officers, many people are asking themselves, ‘what can I do, what can I say, what action can I take?’ to eradicate systematic racism and fight for justice.

Following the tragic news surrounding the murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis police officers, many people are asking themselves, ‘what can I do, what can I say, what action can I take?’ to eradicate systematic racism and fight for justice.

Overt and covert racism isn’t just an American problem. It’s a worldwide injustice. We are all accountable for the energy and actions that cause harm to BIPOC. We must ask more of ourselves and our friends and interrogate tough truths; to lean into the discomfort and denial and seek to understand our privilege as white people and what that power and protection has afforded us.

It’s never too late to cultivate change, empathy and education. To be better and do better. If you’re wondering where to start with your learning, or how to dismantle institutional racism in your own life and immediate circles – because, yes, it exists – we’ve rounded up some insightful resources to help you begin this life-long work.

etc., etc., etc.

 

Copyright material should always be attributed. The original article can be found here https://zoella.co.uk/2020/06/01/black-lives-matter-resources/

 

[Tempest]

Every time I investigated a criminal they invariably researched matters online

Usually from a number of sources, but always the ones which reinforced their views or their target

This included (not an exhaustive list)

Left wing
Right wing
Animal rights
Environmentalists
Paedophiles
Drug dealers
Firearms procurement
Murderers
Terrorists

So a list of links from one source to reinforce the argument of that source, really doesn't sell it for me

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app

[Paul]

15 minutes ago, Tempest said:

This included (not an exhaustive list)

Left wing
Right wing

be careful Tempest, i think you are discriminating against center extremists!

 

[FairTmiddlin]

Yeah be careful of upsetting the liberals

They may have to question their policy once again

Like the one, which is do we back the party with the biggest majority in case it leads to a job.

[Ray]

1 hour ago, Tempest said:

Every time I investigated a criminal they invariably researched matters online

Usually from a number of sources, but always the ones which reinforced their views or their target

This included (not an exhaustive list)

Left wing
Right wing
Animal rights
Environmentalists
Paedophiles
Drug dealers
Firearms procurement
Murderers
Terrorists

So a list of links from one source to reinforce the argument of that source, really doesn't sell it for me

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app
 

I had to react to your post with the laughing emoticon, I have rarely come across such a convoluted response.

I was asked how we could listen to the voices of the BLM movement not for a list of those that disagree.

If you wish to listen to the independent voices listen and then post sources of repudiation I will look at them, otherwise you should perhaps check what it is that you are criticising with your experience investigating criminals, which for your information I am not despite having researched the internet in a genuine reply to a genuine question from Grendel

 

[grendel]

I have just read a post elsewhere that two of the protestors tried to stop the rioters and were beaten up and given verbal abuse with racist connotations by the thugs. and that the violence was being used to discredit the protest.

 

[rightsaidfred]

54 minutes ago, Ray said:

I had to react to your post with the laughing emoticon, I have rarely come across such a convoluted response.

I was asked how we could listen to the voices of the BLM movement not for a list of those that disagree.

If you wish to listen to the independent voices listen and then post sources of repudiation I will look at them, otherwise you should perhaps check what it is that you are criticising with your experience investigating criminals, which for your information I am not despite having researched the internet in a genuine reply to a genuine question from Grendel

 

How about we listen to every ones voices not just the vocal minority.

Fred

[Ray]

Just now, rightsaidfred said:

How about we listen to every ones voices not just the vocal minority.

Fred

and yet when a list of individual voices is given it is called into disrepute!

[grendel]

2 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

How about we listen to every ones voices not just the vocal minority.

Fred

except people carrying bricks and ropes

[grendel]

Just now, Ray said:

and yet when a list of individual voices is given it is called into disrepute!

i would rather see 100 independent voices supporting the same cause than 100 from the same page carefully chosen to support the views upheld on that page. for preference they should be from my own searches so i can be certain of the provenance.

[Ray]

But have you really even listener to one of them. They are drawn from a single source only because I'm not a paid researcher and I was spe ifically asked how we can hear the voices of genuine protesters. Given that these are genuine protesters it's not feasible that the repudiating arguments are there also.

People say they want to listen, well here are the voices, no one says you have to agree, in fact if you disagree you.can be the voice in opposition.

If the fact in really is that in order to listen you  must search out your own sources then do so and share them.

Am I to search out voices from protesters individually and then a separate voice in disagreement in order to satisfy those asking to hear or is it that they don't really want to hear or already have closed their minds and only say they'll listen to give the appearance of an open mind?

 

The provenance would not be hard to establish if you would just look, these are the people you asked to hear!

[Tempest]

I had to react to your post with the laughing emoticon, I have rarely come across such a convoluted response.
I was asked how we could listen to the voices of the BLM movement not for a list of those that disagree.
If you wish to listen to the independent voices listen and then post sources of repudiation I will look at them, otherwise you should perhaps check what it is that you are criticising with your experience investigating criminals, which for your information I am not despite having researched the internet in a genuine reply to a genuine question from Grendel
 

I was going to say something about a kettle and a pot...

But thought, best not!



But I am from Bolton which is near to Blackrod, Blackpool and Blackburn.

All northern towns with a name that some now may find offensive.......

But if you can open your eyes and take yourself back to when these towns were named, for example Blackburn was from the old words of "burn" which meant a stream and black was dark

As the town was built around a dark or muddy stream, hence Blackburn!

Put that into today's vocabulary and you may end up with a completely different opinion and the aggression and violence we are seeing today

All I say is yes, discuss issues, offer opinion, but please take off the blinkers and open your mind to the world around you and the opinions of others



Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app

[grendel]

I have an open mind, i am looking forward to getting back into my office where i can chat with people from a large number of cultures and countries and hear what their opinions are. I am much better at gauging reactions and feelings when chatting face to face.

[Ray]

Just now, Tempest said:

I was going to say something about a kettle and a pot...

But thought, best not!



But I am from Bolton which is near to Blackrod, Blackpool and Blackburn.

All northern towns with a name that some now may find offensive.......

But if you can open your eyes and take yourself back to when these towns were named, for example Blackburn was from the old words of "burn" which meant a stream and black was dark

As the town was built around a dark or muddy stream, hence Blackburn!

Put that into today's vocabulary and you may end up with a completely different opinion and the aggression and violence we are seeing today

All I say is yes, discuss issues, offer opinion, but please take off the blinkers and open your mind to the world around you and the opinions of others



Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app
 

For goodness sake no one is objecting to word black, what on earth has that nonsense to do with your experience of criminals and sources of info that come from a single source?

[Ray]

1 minute ago, grendel said:

I have an open mind, i am looking forward to getting back into my office where i can chat with people from a large number of cultures and countries and hear what their opinions are. I am much better at gauging reactions and feelings when chatting face to face.

Fair enough, but you did ask how to hear "genuine protesters" above rent-a-mob! That's why I bothered and got attacked by Tempest

[Ray]

3 minutes ago, Tempest said:

All I say is yes, discuss issues, offer opinion, but please take off the blinkers and open your mind to the world around you and the opinions of others

My god.... simply unbelievable!

[Tempest]

You missed the point again, because of your blinkers and closed mind..

Sad that you can't see this, but all the very best wishes for the future

P.S. the point was in the last paragraph and I didn't say you objected to the word black..., But you focused on that which....proves my point!

For goodness sake no one is objecting to word black, what on earth has that nonsense to do with your experience of criminals and sources of info that come from a single source?

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app

[Ray]

1 minute ago, Tempest said:

You missed the point again, because of your blinkers and closed mind..

Sad that you can't see this, but all the very best wishes for the future

P.S. the point was in the last paragraph and I didn't say you objected to the word black..., But you focused on that which....proves my point!

 

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app
 

 

See above for my separate comment on your last paragraph.... Your position weakens me with a mixture of laughter, dismay and disbelief. May you be happy in your path

[grendel]

if it were possible I would suggest that the two of you got together, shared a pint and chatted to each other, things come across much better face to face.