Tell Me About Your Oven, Good, Bad And The Ugly.

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Morning all,

With the aching back and dodgy knees not getting better anytime soon I`m looking to replace freestanding oven/grill/hob with a built in double cavity oven/grill in a tall kitchen unit with a seperate hob, all 12v and LPG.

The likes of Spinflo, Thetford, Smev receive mixed reviews and to me are silly money but are they worth it, do you have one, would you buy another? Or has anybody found another make with the LPG conversion kits?

Thanks

[CambridgeCabby]

Whenever we consider such items I tend to see what make the hire yards are opting for particularly Faircraft Lloynes who tend to lean towards the better quality/finish 

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Like your thinking CC. 

[marshman]

There continues to be a myth around the boating industry that you must have a "boat" cooker, oven, grill or whatever. This goes back to the days when boat cookers /hobs had FFD and cookers etc for your home did not. Nowadays all gas appliances running off bottled gas, either butane or propane, have FFD's as standard as they are required in properties that are tenanted so as far as I am aware, there is now much greater choice as you can fit kit that you can use in domestic situations. Or so I am led to believe!

You do need to ensure that you have the correct burners as they are different for butane or propane but you should not have an issue fitting any domestic type - the trouble will be when you want to install them. A lot of fitters will not work on boats, for some reason, but I see no real reason why this should be. You should also bear in mind that a lot of gas cookers have 240v electrical systems as well and you would need to address this in addition.

The choice is now much wider and I would steer away from the expensive kit you see in chandleries - they continue to think along the lines of the BOAT acronym - boat owner, add a thousand!!!! And in my experience a lot of it is cheap and flimsy.

I am sure however, someone may come along and say this approach is not legal?  Chapter and verse would be handy then!

[OldBerkshireBoy]

I agree and I`m aware of the point regarding flame failure device and I can live without the light in the oven, the igniter or any LED display needing 240v  however finding a gas oven & with gas grill (most grills seem to be electric) which can be converted to lpg AND built in is proving tiresome hence putting the call out.

[ChrisB]

1 hour ago, marshman said:

There continues to be a myth around the boating industry that you must have a "boat" cooker, oven, grill or whatever. This goes back to the days when boat cookers /hobs had FFD and cookers etc for your home did not. Nowadays all gas appliances running off bottled gas, either butane or propane, have FFD's as standard as they are required in properties that are tenanted so as far as I am aware, there is now much greater choice as you can fit kit that you can use in domestic situations. Or so I am led to believe!

You do need to ensure that you have the correct burners as they are different for butane or propane but you should not have an issue fitting any domestic type - the trouble will be when you want to install them. A lot of fitters will not work on boats, for some reason, but I see no real reason why this should be. You should also bear in mind that a lot of gas cookers have 240v electrical systems as well and you would need to address this in addition.

The choice is now much wider and I would steer away from the expensive kit you see in chandleries - they continue to think along the lines of the BOAT acronym - boat owner, add a thousand!!!! And in my experience a lot of it is cheap and flimsy.

I am sure however, someone may come along and say this approach is not legal?  Chapter and verse would be handy then!

Probably because they do not have the Gas Safe Certification to work on boats. Quite a few boats have Truma heaters and hot water systems but try getting a truma approved fitter to work on a boat! You won't! They all have static and touring caravan certification but not boat. Too late I found out Tony at Bank Boats is a bit of a wizzard with Truma.

[unclemike]

this is what we have aboard , took it out of our old flat, came with lpg conversion kit,pan storage below oven if needed

 

https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/household-appliances/cooking/cookers/essentials-cfsgsv18-50-cm-gas-cooker-inox-10179279-pdt.html

[OldBerkshireBoy]

3 minutes ago, chameleon said:

this is what we have aboard , took it out of our old flat, came with lpg conversion kit,pan storage below oven if needed

 

https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/household-appliances/cooking/cookers/essentials-cfsgsv18-50-cm-gas-cooker-inox-10179279-pdt.html

Thanks, does the person who uses it most rate it, would you buy another of the same make.

[unclemike]

it seems to do the job, much more economical thaan the 40 yr old one we removed, woud hope not to have to buy another at my age but yes,only thing missing is eectric ignition ,not fitted to the boat,SWMBO prefers it to the lecy thing we have now (no gas here)

[marshman]

Yes thats part of the problem - no electric spark and the oven lights, if fitted won't work either but quite honestly the gas lighters from the market work just as well, if not better. And if they go wrong then its only a quid to replace!!

And whilst the point on working on boats is taken, having a "boat" cooker on a boat is no help. Spinflo won't work on boats - you would have to take your cooker out to have warranty work done!! My Spinflo is next to u/s - the oven thermostat is miles out and the "insulation" is a few bits of 1/2" glass matting stuck to the outside with Sellotape or similar!!! A classic example of BOAT!!!!!!!

 

 

 

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Thats pretty much what I`ve been reading MM.

[dnks34]

If its only a light bulb and igniter on the oven change the bulb to a 12v equivalent and replace the 240v spark generator with a 12v one and cut the mains plug off.  Wire to 12v supply.  Job done!

Probably not so easy to do if your oven model has any digital displays so keep it simple. 

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Agree, I would try to obtain the 12v spark generator and stay away from digital displays however I can live with the torch and a hand held spark generator.

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Has anyone seen a gas oven with gas grill suitable to fit in a tall housing?

This is the hard part. 

[grendel]

my parents just managed to get a new gas oven with an eye level grill to replace their old one, it still needed wiring in to the mains for the spark igniters. so they needed to have a new socket installed to accomodate this.

[Vaughan]

5 hours ago, marshman said:

There continues to be a myth around the boating industry that you must have a "boat" cooker, oven, grill or whatever.

Marshman and I have had this conversation before on the forum and there is no reason why you should not fit a modern domestic gas cooker with oven and grill into a boat, as long as it has flame failure devices on all the burners. It must also, of course, comply with all the other installation regulations, especially with regard to the minimum distances from combustible materials, such as a bulkhead, doorway, overhead panelling or a wooden worktop. For this reason you usually need quite a large boat, to fit a domestic cooker in the galley!

Most modern boats have an inverter these days so wiring up a spark ignition or digital display on 220v AC is not a problem. Again, as long as the wiring is properly installed. You must also install adequate fixed ventilation.

Household cookers are sold with spare sets of jets, so that you can change yours from natural gas to LPG Butane or Propane. This is a job which must be done by a gas safe fitter and so I must emphasise that you need to get this work done by a boatyard with qualified staff.

I have operated an awful lot of hire boats with SMEV cookers and I can highly recommend them. We often get favourable comments from hirers themselves. One word of warning though - they are supposed to be "dual fuel" so they will operate on Butane or Propane but this is NOT true. You can only operate them safely on Propane gas.

 

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Thanks for the SMEV recommendation from experiance Vaughan. I did read somewhere that Butane will soot the system up over time so better to use Propane, is this what you meant.

With roof vents and the passage way from back to front and with galley and saloon being open plan area I estimate vented area to be around 23m3. 

[Islander]

Very happy to recommend Smev. We had the 4 burner version on The Green Lady Too which we live on. It lasted 15 years before the hob top rusted through near one of the burners ( this was an enamelled version) This had been fitted before we bought the boat so don't know how old it was but was well worn.

We have just (5 years ago!) fitted the three burner version to Lady Linda. We could not be any happier with it. I can say that as I cook and have done for the last 20 years.

A couple of things to note. Buy one with the controls down the front as the models with them on the top get mucky with splatters. Don't bother with a four burner. You will never get four standard pans on it and do you really want all that washing up and go for a stainless steel version. They're a lot easier to clean.

Propane only as Butane useless in cold weather.

 

 

Sorry, I don't have a pic of the finished job.

forgot to add, this cooker cost £600 . Add another hundred after brexit.

Colin 

[JanetAnne]

I've got me one of these. Very nice piece of kit. And mountable at any height you choose.

By the way, you need to be competent to fit your oven, not qualified. And whilst you are there fit a bubble tester. That way you can check the system any time you want to. 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dometic-Smev-FO311-Caravan-Campervan-Motorhome-Oven-with-Grill/223254540596?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D33f47d87f3f54286bf19afd8d608be00%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D223254540596%26itm%3D223254540596%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A77985664-f838-11e9-b185-74dbd180fd49|parentrq%3A09fe770f16e0a9cd213768d5fff0c502|iid%3A1

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Thanks JA and have checked out the bubble tester you mentioned. Being competent v qualified comes up a lot on domestic gas forums as one would expect. One thread comes to mind where an senior engineer on a nuclear submarine threw the toys out of the pram when he didn`t get the answer he wanted. 

[annv]

Hi We have one of these from Hughes in Norwich works well and came with propane jets JohnNorwich has grill in top works well came with propane jets as well as nat gas

[stumpy]

No Worries came with a Smev 4 ring oven 8 years ago which hasn't given us any problems. The ignition was off a separate motorcycle battery sitting beside it which was a pita so was soon skipped! It's no hardship to use a long gas lighter as we already had one for the good old ThermX catalytic heater. They've both sailed through 3 BSS checks so far but we are over-ventilated with an extra solar vent from the standard spec.

[Paul]

I thought we had decided that the competent person requirement didn't apply to boats unless they were to be used for hiring? Anyways, if you really want a twin cavity then look for Belling B170 LPG ovens. They are recently discontinued but still odd new ones pop up on sites like Amazon and Ebay, but main retailers such as Currys / AO.com will be out of stock.

I couldn't find any other twin cavity all gas ovens when I looked recently, which is bizarre when you think of the number of properties in the UK still not supplied with mains gas.

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Agree there really is a limited selection of twin cavity lpg ovens where the grill is also lpg powered. Found a Belling B1702 yesterday but it is +£600 but then the Smev with combined oven/ grill is £400 - 500 so .....................

[OldBerkshireBoy]

Going by the replies it would seem that nobody has ovens by Calor or Montpellier which is a shame as the latter has a very good customer service system. They replied to my email question within 24hrs and gave me a list of their lpg ovens plus their prices are lower than most but I know nothing of the build quality as I can`t find one to go and see.

Leaning towards the Belling at the moment with the Smev second choice.

Thanks to all that responded.