a case of mis information

[littlesprite]

I once had an emergency landing in a 747 when the cabin pressure failed, I once spent 18 hrs on the M4 in a snow drift, no I'm not trying to make light of Breydon but danger is everywhere you just need to plan before crossing.

[Mowjo]

Thank you Bill! you got the point over so much better than I did, my incident with Breydon was back in 89, I havn't seen any big stuff around for a while now apart from the Dredgers and dredging pontoons, in the end no matter if It's Breydon or anywhere else on the Broads, all we are really saying is Be Careful  out there and don't take anything for granted,,,

 

Frank,,,,

 

Peter! don't mention Oulton Broad to me! last time I went there I nearly got taken out by an out of control speedboat, the look on the Drivers face was, I'm gonna die, I'm sure he took a layer of paint off my boat,

[Guest]

I think that's entirely unfair, Strowager. "Newcomers" as you call them are just that and are bound by their perceived lack of knowledge and what the yards tell them.

 

Your final paragraph might show a pretty drastic lack of appreciation of just how daunting it all can be for "newcomers", if they didn't know you better.

 

In fact they wouldn't cope, as probably many "experienced" Broads helms wouldn't, either.

 

Sorry John, I'm trying to understand where you feel I've been entirely unfair.

 

If it's my use of the word "Newcomers" sounding like some sort of snobbery on my part, then I apologise for giving that false impression. I certainly didn't want to imply any feelings of superiority.

 

It was in reply to the assertion that favourable tides through Yarmouth are often perceived on forums as being "inconvenient", falling sometimes, as the do, very early or very late in the day.

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

We`ve never had a problem crossing Breydon, either with or against the tide. If crossing Breydon against the tide, it just takes considerably longer, and uses more fuel. Personally, i`d prefer to come down the bure against the tide, and cross on the incoming tide, and in reverse, crossing with the tide just after high water slacks. That way. you you cross Breydon quickly, and only have to punch the tide a couple of miles or so up the lower Bure, which is not as strong as the southern river tides.

[riyadhcrew]

Every boat yard I have ever hired from has given advice on WHEN and HOW to cross Breydon Water. I personally have crossed both ways everytime I have ever been on the Broads. I was down in August and had to leave Acle before 5.00am to get the tide right and I am next down in March 2015 when I will have to leave Acle at 6.00am to get the tide right. I may be one of the fortunate hirers that have never had any "life threatening" incidents, but I have had fog (not so dense) and a few big waves. If you look at the information that is given on the boat you hire ( not on  forums and internet ), you will minimise any chance of problems. For what it is worth, my 12 year old daughter (with me behind her) took Carousel all the way from the old Yarmouth yacht station all the way across Breydon to the Waveney without any concerns what so ever. As previously stated - COMMON SENSE.

[MBA Marine]

I would quite like to see a large amount of mooring at either side, those that are nervous or wish for assistance could moor up and be escorted across in convoy once a day by the BA, guided at the front by a BA vessel and a BA ranger on the last boat with radio contact to the front. 

 

Time of the escorted crossing could be available online or by phoning ahead, this would help with confidence for those making the crossing, avoid accidents for hire craft and private boats.

 

Although I think the BA receive enough through tolls already I would have thought that most people would be happy to spend up to £10 to use this service.

[BroadScot]

Sorry Mark I dont like a police state of any kind on holiday. What is the wording again ??? ah yes Freedom to go where you please. Its bad enough now that after thirty, nah nearlly forty years cruising I can no longer take my hired craft through Wroxham Bridge.

 

I am all for safety, but I will repeat what I said in my earlier post COMMON SENSE is the order of the day. IMHO.

 

 

Iain

[MBA Marine]

Sorry Mark I dont like a police state of any kind on holiday. What is the wording again ??? ah yes Freedom to go where you please. Its bad enough now that after thirty, nah nearlly forty years cruising I can no longer take my hired craft through Wroxham Bridge.

 

I am all for safety, but I will repeat what I said in my earlier post COMMON SENSE is the order of the day. IMHO.

 

 

Iain

Why a police state? did I imply that you would have to use the service? or could use the service? 

[BroadScot]

Calm down Mark wiz joking about BA and using Nic Nic  SOB to escort us over, just a figure of speech, nowt else.

 

If it came to that, I regretably would stay South or North.

 

 

Iain.

[JimG]

Very interesting this, I can see both sides of the discussion. I personally have never been daunted by GY and Breydon but fully understand it if others are. My advice would be to just cruise right through and avoid mooring. It's the mooring up at places like GY, St Olaves, Berney Arms etc that can be very tricky. I think it's important that newcomers are aware of the potential dangers but we don't want to put people off crossing from north to south or vice versa.

[donnygeoff]

It's one of my major bug bears, a lot of twaddle is spoken on various forums about crossing Breydon

 

I read this, then didn't bother with the rest of the thread............

 

TO ALL CROSSING BREYDON......

 

Get in the boat, check air draft for Yarmouth bridges,  set off and go across....

 

Stay inside posts,

 

Enjoy the ride. it gets really rough, sea sickness is well known to happen on days when it is rough, like the attached pic.....

 

[BroadScot]

Nice still life pic Geoff

 

 

Iain

[kadensa]

Surely it's not the actual crossing that people are worried about, but more the passage through the bridges at Yarmouth, which if you follow the instructions from the hire company is not a problem

 

Escorted crossings?  You have to be joking!  It's Breydon, not the North Sea.

[JennyMorgan]

Escorted crossings?  You have to be joking!  It's Breydon, not the North Sea.

Exactly!

Be careful what you wish for.

[deebee29]

When we first hired back in the 80’s crossing Breydon was always a highlight.

I remember we were always sent tide tables (in the post !!!!!!) and the little book that is often mentioned and we would plan our crossing to suit

It was all part of the fun.

If the tides times weren't suitable for our chosen dates we didn't cross but it didn't spoil our holiday. The Broads are stunning either side.

I think there was only once we didn't cross.

We all read that book from cover to cover many times before the holiday, its a shame they don't still send that (mind there was no internet back then so we didn't see the mistakes people made on youtube back then or the excellent advice thats out there of course)

I wish we'd kept a copy.

Our first few hires were from Brundall and our very first mooring was at Reedham which was interesting with the rise and fall of the tide but we managed and it didn't put us off.

I don't remember being told anything about crossing by the boat yard during our trial run but my Dad was a great one for reading up on things before the event so there would be many visits to the library and books and magazines bought i think he probably knew more than the person giving the instruction.

David

[Guest]

When we first hired back in the 80’s crossing Breydon was always a highlight.

I remember we were always sent tide tables (in the post !!!!!!) and the little book that is often mentioned and we would plan our crossing to suit

It was all part of the fun.

If the tides times weren't suitable for our chosen dates we didn't cross but it didn't spoil our holiday. The Broads are stunning either side.

I think there was only once we didn't cross.

We all read that book from cover to cover many times before the holiday, its a shame they don't still send that (mind there was no internet back then so we didn't see the mistakes people made on youtube back then or the excellent advice thats out there of course)

I wish we'd kept a copy.

Our first few hires were from Brundall and our very first mooring was at Reedham which was interesting with the rise and fall of the tide but we managed and it didn't put us off.

I don't remember being told anything about crossing by the boat yard during our trial run but my Dad was a great one for reading up on things before the event so there would be many visits to the library and books and magazines bought i think he probably knew more than the person giving the instruction.

David

 

 

I've taken the liberty of highlighting some of the sentences in your post David.

 

You've recounted the situation exactly as I remember it as well, from when I first started to hire, back in the seventies.

 

The handover instruction was boat handling only, but the small free handbook that came with the booking confirmation contained all of the information needed about Breydon, and mooring, mudweighting etc.. 

 

Aside from that, most people purchased a copy of one of the Broads guides, with maps etc., so that they could plan and get the best out of their forthcoming holiday.

 

Maybe more people these days just can't be bothered to learn what they can about their first boating holiday, to get the best out of it.

[JimG]

I remember the handbook well. When it arrived on your doorstep it was the countdown to the beginning of your holiday. My dad used to test us on the rules of the river, it all added to the excitement. The earlier ones included a log book. I've still got these, the oldest being 33 years old! (Apologies for going off topic a little).

[mbird]

Only once have I ever had an "incident" when crossing Breydon. That was on a delivery trip taking a couple of hire craft from a yard in Norwich up to the northern rivers. Unfortunately we were dictated by other circumstances as to when we left Norwich which put us going across Breydon mid ebb. That was great for actually getting across Breydon, but as soon as we turned into the Bure, the ebb was so strong we actually stopped dead even at almost full throttle! Luckily the tidal flow was just passed it's strongest and so we eventually made about 1 knt against the tide but it took ages to get through Yarmouth. I should add that I was also tandem towing another hire boat as the same time. At least now there is a floating pontoon we could have waited at for an hour, but this was a few years back.

 

I certainly agree that now the holiday booklets aren't sent out, it is more up to the hirer to seek out information, but I can remember feeling a bit nervous after reading the literature embarking on a rare trip across Breydon. Of course, experience is everything, and after doing it once or twice, you soon get to realise the crossing is nothing to be afraid of, just respected with a little bit of planning.

 

There are several videos on YouTube of boats crossing Breydon. This one from Lord Paul is probably the most informative 

[Timbo]

I agree with David and Strowager on this one. I too can remember the comprehensive book that came through the post prior to our family holidays, and Uncle Albert sitting reading it from cover to cover and taking notes. I can also remember the 'enforced hanging around' in moorings until Uncle Albert had calculated the 'optimum time of passage' and the clock hands slowly made their way to the time we could 'get under way'.

 

It 'used' to be about 'boating',the boat and how different it was to be on board a boat instead of at home in your house on land. These days it seems to be a case of 'how can we make the boat like an apartment'. Cruising about the Broads you may hear Uncle Albert pass the odd comment such as 'there's a bungalow coming' (Topliner) or on some occasions 'here's a block of flats' (anything with a superstructure not suited to the Broads).

 

I try to engender a healthy respect for Breydon in my kids. I've crossed and it was like a mill pond, I've also crossed and had a nightmare journey, buffeted by wind and waves. I've crossed and then had a job and a half finding a mooring before it got dark. I've seen too many boats stranded on the mud...more private craft than hires of late and I've also seen several idiots in the water with no life jacket being swept along faster than they anticipated.

 

I still read everything I can get my hands on, and try to plan my own crossing, but even so I will always ring the Yacht Station. A calm reassuring voice asks the name of the vessel, the height, one one occasion what engine I had, my intended destination and my current location. They will then give advice such as 'set off now and dawdle down to arrive at such and such a time' or 'leave it until tomorrow leave at this time to arrive at that time' and even 'you can go across but moorings will be scarce'.

 

I have a lot of respect for the guys at the Yacht Station...particularly in the way they patrol the boats moored and the river, asking things like 'where's your life jacket' and in one occasion I had to chuckle when a ranger approached a 'lads cruise' who were attempting to put a drunken crew member back on the boat, and declared he 'wouldn't trust the lad to climb a ladder sober let alone in his current state' and made all the lads from the boat sit with their friend on the bank until they had sobered up. There was no argy bargy, no nastiness, all done politely but with a great deal of authority. To be honest it was fantastic to see a professional at work in what seemed to be a more old world approach, looking after both the safety of others and the crew with a minimum of fuss.

[ranworthbreeze]

Hi Jim,

We all go off topic from time to time, that is a sign of a friendly forum.

 

Regards

Alan

[BroadScot]

Very true Alan, now where was I ????????

 

 

Iian.

[Broads01]

I agree the tides shouldn't put anyone off going south. From my own experience passing through GY at slack water is by far the easiest and most stress free. It avoids any worry about bridge clearance as well so in my view its still the best advice for first timers.

I think a lot of people don't go south because they like to just pootle about slowly on the north without bothering to do the extra distance to go south and back. There's nothing wrong with that and although I like the south sometimes staying north is good.

[Broads01]

I guess what I'm saying is there is absolutely no case of misinformation at all.

[thirdmate]

In nearly 30 years of broads sailing my view on Breydon is "If I can get under the bridges I can cross Breydon"

 

Yes you can gain some advantages in picking you time but there is almost nothing (Krakens excepted )

to stop anyone crossing Breydon whenever they like

[RumPunch]

I haven't ventured South, and am pretty aprehensive of so doing.

 

Under power I made 3.8mph on Barton according to my GPS

 

How strong are those tides again.............

 

 

Oh - and just realised afer much lurking ( and inhabiting elsewhere ) this is my first post here !