Wroxham Bridge.

[MauriceMynah]

As you all know, up till very soon, I own a boat, moored at the Pleasure boat Hickling. The problem has always been getting under Potter Heigham. 

I am wondering about asking Landamores if they have a mooring in the old Connoisseur yard.

I need to find from Richardson's what clearance new Nyx needs. but I also need to know what clearance Wroxham bridge NORMALLY offers.  I'm not sure that I want to be back in the same boat, if you know what I mean!

Who best to ask?

[annv]

A person that owns and uses a NYX would be a good starting point. John

[MauriceMynah]

Fair enough. Do we have any owners or regular users of Mk II  Aquafibre 42s in the forum?

However, I'd be more interested in the average clearances under Wroxham bridge these days. The BA tide table is NOT a trusted source! If you think it is, look at what it gives for Potter Heigham!

[Mouldy]

Personally, I wouldn’t want to risk my cruising potential by mooring the wrong side of a bridge, whether it be Potter, Wroxham or if the airdraft of my boat was high enough, even Ludham.  The river levels appear to have been relatively  high all year and that situation probably isn’t going to improve in the future.

[BroadAmbition]

Get her measured yersen.  It's the only true way of knowing exactly what her airdraft is.  Same classes of boat / hull will not be exactly the same due to build / fit out variances.

It's proper easy to do to, I've done stax of em.

You will need a long straight edge, planed timber 1" x 1" will suffice, spirit level, length of string, a ring spanner to act as a weight, tape measure

First procedure, with everything lowered, that is canopy, flag poles / masts etc,  on the upper scuppers go fwd to aft with straight edge and spirit level and find the highest point

Second procedure, tie spanner to string then t'other end of string to end of the straight edge.  Sit straight edge on top of previously discovered highest point, with it swung out to Port or Stbd over the wet stuff spirit level on top of straight edge. Adjust string length so spanner is just kissing the water.  Measure from underside of straight edge to tip of spanner and you have you airdraft reading.  Repeat with canopy up etc.

Most important bit - Make a note of your findings, preferably with a permanent tally on the helm somewhere or t'other

Griff

[grendel]

if you do it with all the tanks empty you will have the worst case scenario.

[Captain]

Hi Mm,

I am not sure which ex Richardson A/F 42 you are acquiring however if it's one the ex Thames design s I believe Richardson list them as 7ft 3inch see San Bernadette which is a Barnes version of the same style. The earlier mk 1 s are I believe a little lower 6ft 10 ish for Superior Gems etc. Boatyard s tend to build in a few Inches when stating airdraft however I suspect she could need 7ft for Wroxham if I she is a Crusader/Corsica. Now bearing in mind Connoisseurs needed between 6ft 6 and 6ft 8 and they were having issues in the later years of Wroxham operation I would say you could easily get stuck under their for a chunk of the season. Happy to be proved wrong as it's undoubtedly a nice area, personally I wouldn't chance it with that design, although maybe with NYX mk 1

Neil

[Guest]

Can't help with the bridge heights but I was chatting to someone in the summer whilst moored opposite landamores who had just moved to another site because of the bridge clearance, but more importantly on several occasions in the colder months could not leave the mooring because they could not get under the iron bridge at the exit to the marina as the water level was too high. If memory serves me right it was Tarr Stepps an Aquafibre Diamond (centre cockpit).

John.

[Guest]

ps.....we were offered a place in Landamores back in July/August it was £1700 inc vat (34ft) with no electricity available. Also if you wish to walk off site in the rainy months you will need wellies as it floods on both sides of the iron bridge. We were also offered a spot at Horning Sailing Club who I think still have availability. 

John.

[marshman]

The trouble is MM, as we have all discussed time and time again, its not just the airdraft - thats the easy one, but you do need to be aware of the beam. I am well aware that the arch at Wroxham is a wider and easier profile but it still impacts on the passage. There is a very good reason why Connoisseur struggled so often with the water drums!!!!

My guess is you will struggle more often than some would suggest - in my AF35 there was hardly a time I couldn't squeeze under 20 years ago - now it is less often and what would your back up be if, as it as been, several weeks at a time and you are stuck the wrong side? And its not going to get better!!!

For what its worth I wouldn't not go anywhere near those moorings these days with a boat that size  - didn't you learn your lesson up at Hickling??? To guarantee passage most of the time, you needed a smaller boat - what on earth are you going to do with all that room????

 

[CambridgeCabby]

We are facing a similar dilemma, our current airdraft is 8ft and more and more often Ludham Bridge is becoming a no go , last year we had a period of 10 weeks when we were stuck upstream of Ludham .

So , we either go for a lower airdraft craft or bite the bullet and go higher altogether .

We love fly bridge boats especially Brooms , hence why we may be changing from our much loved Cerise Lady .

 

MM have you considered Horning opposite the village staithe as I know they have moorings available atm 

[MauriceMynah]

Finding out what clearance I actually need won't be difficult, the bridge pilots will have records. New Nyx, (formally Corsica II ) will be one they will have taken under.

No, what I'm trying to find out now are things I've been trying to find out for some years now.

Is the clearance at Wroxham bridge reducing in the same way and at the same rate as the clearance at Potter Heigham?

Will the BA be turning the same "blind eye" to the navigational issues at Wroxham as they insist on doing at Potter?

Have the bridges on the southern waters suffered the same problems?

 

I would like to know what the average clearance is at Wroxham these days.. From whom would I get this information?

[MauriceMynah]

1 hour ago, marshman said:

For what its worth I wouldn't not go anywhere near those moorings these days with a boat that size  - didn't you learn your lesson up at Hickling??? To guarantee passage most of the time, you needed a smaller boat - what on earth are you going to do with all that room????

Sorry Marshman, I omitted to reply to your question.

Shorter boats these days are not necessarily much narrower and bridge clearance isn't governed by length, but you know that better than I.

Is it just the bridge that would make you reluctant to use those moorings? I am thinking second thoughts about them anyway.

Did I learn my lesson at Hickling?, Yes, when I bought old Nyx, I didn't ask these questions!

What on earth am I going to do with all that room?  Well Old Nyx is too small for me to live on comfortably, but it was the largest boat that could reasonably be expected to get under Potter. Once I realised that the Hickling area was out of court, length ceased to be an issue.

If it comes to it, I will be able to live on new Nyx, and quite comfortably, even having guests. I have no intention of living like a hobo

[Mouldy]

25 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Is the clearance at Wroxham bridge reducing in the same way and at the same rate as the clearance at Potter Heigham?

Given that Wroxham is further upstream from the reason that The Thurne is allegedly not draining and causing river levels at Potter to increase, I would have thought that it is.

29 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Will the BA be turning the same "blind eye" to the navigational issues at Wroxham as they insist on doing at Potter?

Is it the BA or The Environment Agency that is preventing the dredging of the lower Bure??

30 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Have the bridges on the southern waters suffered the same problems?

The problems with bridges on the southern rivers are largely caused by the weather, preventing either Reedham and/or Somerleyton to swing, neither of which should affect your ability to negotiate them with your new boat

[BrundallNavy]

We’ve been up to Coltishall quite a few times this year but I don’t remember it being more than 7ft. Only once have we not been able to get through was 6ft 1. We need 6ft 3. Water levels had certainly risen but whether it’s Down to dredging is any ones guess.  

[OldBerkshireBoy]

1 minute ago, Mouldy said:

Is it the BA or The Environment Agency that is preventing the dredging of the lower Bure??

According to the last BA meeting that I watched online dredging is not the answer to high waters on the north, according to their model going sideways is, something to do with water not running off.

[CambridgeCabby]

But is the water not draining from the system partially attributed to the lack of dredging on the upper Yare ?

This subject has been flogged to death and it seems the BA are burying their heads in the sand , or should that be accumulated silt ?

[AEJB]

MM,

I work in the area of Wroxham bridge and check the levels most days.

As rule of thumb the summer months will give you a clearance of 6ft 6in to 7ft.

The winter is usually around 5ft 9in to 6ft 3in.

Having said that, depending on the shape of your boat, you can easily add a couple of inches to the clearance

 

[OldBerkshireBoy]

16 minutes ago, CambridgeCabby said:

But is the water not draining from the system partially attributed to the lack of dredging on the upper Yare ?

This subject has been flogged to death and it seems the BA are burying their heads in the sand , or should that be accumulated silt ?

There was no mention that I recall of the southern waters.

[WherryNice]

I very nearly took a mooring at Bridge Broad recently but backed out at the last minute (not something I take lightly) when we had the very high water levels in September. The bridge was impassable and the road to the yard iself was heavily flooded. Also once over the bridge into the yard proper there is an area that floods very readily so wellies are a must.

That said, on the day I visited it was a glorious late summers day and it was all rather picturesque and peacefull but it is a yard that is somewhat past its best and lacks some of the mod cons. The yard manager, Cheryl, is a lovely person to deal with however.

If I had a 20 footer then I would definitly consider it again but even with my Safari I think it's all a bit of a gamble with regard getting stuck the wrong side of the bridge.

[MauriceMynah]

This is where I start to get really frustrated. People appear to be either unwilling or unable to answer my questions yet there is so much local knowledge, the answers should be easy.

When I referred to the southern waters I was talking of bridge clearance not malfunctioning swing bridges. Has the clearance at any of the other bridges reduced in the manner of Potter Heigham Bridge? This change may not be of the same magnitude, but the changes, if any, would or could be indicative of the possible causes.

AEJB, Thank you for that info. Would I be correct then in suggesting that Wroxham and Potter bridges are suffering similar problems? I seem to remember 20 years ago finding a good 12 inches more clearance than you suggest of today.

Is it the BA or the Environment Agency refusing to dredge? Well lets try to find the reasons and if it would cure the issue. Then pressure can be put on the relevant department.

If dredging IS the solution, I start to wonder at what point those who say they love thr broads will start to complain. Will it be when Wroxham bridge is virtually unnavigable, or do we wait till it's Ludham... Perhaps even Acle.

If WherryNice thinks Wroxham is now a gamble in a Safari, we are closer to this problem than perhaps people think.

[SwanR]

Hi MM ... sorry, I don't have any answers but here's some photos taken 26th September after we had some very heavy rain here, probably for at least 48 hours. It took quite a long while to go back down. These were taken just near the stern on moorings opposite the yard I think you're talking about.

 

[rightsaidfred]

Average height at Wroxham has certainly reduced over the years one reason Le Boat moved down to Horning, an added problem with the upper Bure is the sluices at Coltishall with the run off noticeable this year in particular with all the rainfall, personally I wouldnt consider it with anything over 6'6".

Fred 

[WherryNice]

I'm sure many will know this but if not, in SwanR's last photo the area between the two sheds that is flooded is where you have pass through to get either to or from the moorings, normally you can drive through it but in that picture I would estimate the middle part could be over a foot deep possibly more.

I'm afraid I don't have many answers regarding the bridge clearance issues, I suspect that it has reduced generally but that because a lot of boats are still able to transit a lot of the time it hasn't quite become the same issue that PHB has.

I suppose it could be a bit like PHB was in the 80's now?

[CambridgeCabby]

There can be no doubt that the river levels have risen and ergo the bridge clearance levels has decreased over the last decade and it was (I believe) 2009 when Le Boat decided to move from Wroxham to Horning citing the bridge level (then) as one of the deciding factors .

This year , yet again, we saw a fair few hire boats “stranded” upstream of the bridge , including some Aquafibre 42’s, after high tides and the “wrong wind”.

For your own peace of mind , I would suggest a permanent mooring downstream of that bridge would be the sensible option as you know how frustrating it was when you were kept upstream of Potter.