River Boat or Sea Boat?

[LondonRascal]

Forum, I’d been curious as to your views on this because of course we all have our own ‘boat tastes’ but I have been pondering things following a conversation over the weekend with some non- boaty types.

I was trying to explain to a young couple Shiela and I had got talking to about the Norfolk Broads. To many who are not aware of the area the moment you mention a boat they presume it is either something tiny and fast or something massive but often the question comes ‘don’t you get sea sick’ and you respond ‘no these are just inland rivers’.  Of course when you show some photos on your phone, their eyes light up and it all seems really exciting and ‘cool’ and you wonder if you have just inspired someone to take a closer look at visiting the area.

This made me think though about boats generally on the Broads.  If you had no money constraints and wanted to boat on the Broads, would you go for a river boat every time, or a sea boat?   

I thought I knew – it was simple – a river boat. 

Imagine having some big twin screw boat and not being able to get up the upper Ant to Barton Broad etc, or having a large boat based on the Southern Rivers and not being able to get past the bridges at Yarmouth because of your airdraft – how restricting. 

But there are some boats I see and think to myself I could be tempted the other way... A Broom Ocean 42 for example. In my mind this looks like a classic boat yet not old and very capable so I read in various sea states.  Not a super fast boat, but one that will plod on regardless.  So, what do others think? Always stick with a practical river boat able to explore all the waterways or something big and fancy where instead of going to Horning for lunch, you decide to go to Holland...

[JawsOrca]

Hi Robin,

I would have one boat in Norfolk which was a river boat and one sea boat elsewhere so when norfolk gets too busy we can go and play at sea.. (p.s I'd also have a light aircraft so I can fly between them..)  

[Speleologist]

I'm with Alan on this. Two boats. On the Broads I would want a River Cruiser Class yacht. At sea a yacht capable of serious offshore racing and extended fast cruising (but small enough to be eligible to race in the Junior Offshore Group. Fortunately at the moment I am able to indulge both passions on other people's boats!

[riyadhcrew]

A Broom 35 coupe with twin engines (not too big) and a sea going hull. This is my dream and then I can do the Broads and the coastal sea.

[senator]

Sea boats do become limiting on the Broads where in the end you are forced to choose one or the other.

We have done 10 years of Dual use boating but the restrictions imposed by the Broads Bridges, the poor quality of Broads infrastructure, resulting in Bridges that don't open, locks that don't work etc. and the attitude of the BA Executive, coupled with the fact that at least for motor boats there is not that much within economical range of the Broads entrances to visit, has finally resulted in us making a choice between the two. It was good while it lasted but I would agree that if you want to do both you need two boats.

[vanessan]

I'm with JawsOrca on this one, with money no object it has to be one of each! However, if it was a choice then for me it would be a reasonable sized river boat for the Broads every time and preferably one that could go under all the bridges on the navigable system. I'm sure it must be coming up to my turn to win Lotto !!

[LondonRascal]

I had not thought of the two boat solution at all.

Come to think of it damn you people! 

Now I've got the the river boat sorted in BA, I'll be tempted to look at small sea craft thinking 'oh, now that is nice' not to mention the fact my Mum wants to move to Portland or Weymouth could well encourage me more and think about weekend visits to her in the summer coupled with 'lets pop over to Jersey'.

No, need to keep sensible and my feet on the ground unlike Alan who seems to be considering some kind of aircraft carrier at this rate

 

 

 

 

[Speleologist]

You need something with a rag and stick!

[JennyMorgan]

Robin, one blessing about Lowestoft & Yarmouth is that it only about 110 miles to Holland. 24 to 36 hours under sail or displacement motor boat. If BA could go to London then she could do the canals of Holland, problem solved!

[Vaughan]

There is a perfect boat - The Albert (of Blofield).

Brooms built a sister, but I forget the name.

Well you did say that money was no object!

[imtamping2]

Rag and stick you say.........something like this?

[addicted]

we have a boat that although not a  huge twin screw has an air draft that prevents us from accessing the Upper Ant and thus Barton Broad which is a real shame. We visited that part when we first came to the Broads in 2010 and had a boat with a lower air draft. However within 3 months of arriving on the Broads we changed to our present boat which we like enough to make up for not being to get to some places Although high, it is very much a river boat rather than a sea boat having 115 hp engine and being 1050 metres in length. One advantage about the height is being able to see over the reed beds to some of the  beautiful surrounding countryside which was lost to us on our previous boat. So having a  restricting boat has it's advantages.,

regards,

Carole

 

 

[Polly]

1050 metres in length would certainly not get round the bends on the Ant

[Polly]

Please can I have the Hathor and a nice big merc on the tender?

[LondonRascal]

I saw this...serious fast, offshore crew support vessel. £1,300,000.  Lovely helm, massiv3 engines, great visibility but blimey I thought these salty seafarers were a hardly bunch! Seems not anymore, for what every offshore boat needs is a bloody coffee machine by the helm.  What happened to a flask or a toddy of Rum eh?

[ExMemberBobdog]

Broads boat; one of Colin Buttifant's beautiful creations - I'm not greedy, a Bure Classic would do.  Sea boat; again I have simple tastes - a Neil Thompson boat, a Norfolk Gypsy, or maybe a Norfolk Smuggler - and a nice little mooring in Wells Harbour.

[JennyMorgan]

28 minutes ago, Polly said:

Please can I have the Hathor and a nice big merc on the tender?

Polly, couldn't you manage with something a little more modest? A Smart car or Reliant Robin for example, big Mercs are just so vulgar!!

 

 

[LondonRascal]

Ahh but you can get a classic 'Merc' ...

 

But let us not forget our French cousin's, though like with so much they did not quite engineer it as well as the Germans..

[JanetAnne]

1 hour ago, Vaughan said:

There is a perfect boat - The Albert (of Blofield).

Brooms built a sister, but I forget the name.

Well you did say that money was no object!

There were four Vaughan. The Albert as you said, currently lying Wroxham, Sujarota (I bet that's spelt wrong) laying at Brooms, Cadilly now at Wayford Bridge but in need of restoration and a fourth called Jabet or Jablet. She is rumoured to be in your neck of the woods on the canals somewhere. 

Cadilly was the only single engined one I believe and she was taken across on numerous occasions and has been on the fjords as well as along the French coast. The owner at the time has a number of tales involving his exploits including sprung planks mid channel!

But yes, a Broom 45. Excellent choice for those not going the two boat route 

[MauriceMynah]

I have one question for Robin (LR)

If you wanted a river boat, why did you buy a share in a sea boat? Jack Powles of that vintage (and for many years after) were sea boats, not river ones!

[Guest]

Norfolk is way out in the countryside, so we tend to have more rugged landrover style amphibians.....

[Liberty]

Now at Goodchilds - or it was a year ago...

 

[jillR]

Passat krait still is.

 ishtar krait until she was mounted onto a van lent hull and became Passat krait

[Springsong]

Janet Anne you beat me to it stunning boats hull design by Arnott Fowler above deck by Martin Broom, as you say fascinating stories by a previous owner of Cadilly.

As for the original post yes have to be two boats for me, one traditional wood Broads (motor) cruiser and something along the lines of Cadilly to go across the pond, or maybe a Bates 45' with fly bridge, like Jamarc 

[BroadAmbition]

Robin, you are already an owner of both types of craft in one boat 'B.A'

The following was sent to me from Anthony Trafford years ago when we were researching R641's history:-

Anthony Trafford – Former owner at Jack Powles and Co Ltd, now director at Jack Powles Company:-

I have just seen your website and in particular the ex Star Supreme cruiser that you are restoring.

My family owned Jack Powles and I remember these boats quite clearly. 

I can tell you that Star Supreme 1 was the first of 6 such craft. The hull was based on a cut down version of the sea going Powles 41. This one as is evident was built in timber but subsequent models were in GRP. The original design incorporated timber screen and side windows with a canvas rear window. The actual tops were canvas on timbers that were able to be rolled back to as far as one wished. 

After the Supremes came 2 Star Magnas which were slightly larger models (10 berth) based on a cut down version of the Powles 45.  

 

The Star Supreme was a cut down version of a Powles 45 sea going hull. None of the Powles boats used Bourne hulls, unlike some of the other companies we acquired, namely Ernest Collins and Moores which did use Bourne hulls. The only Star Supreme which had a timber hull, was the first one which we used as a plug for the class of 6. & 2 x Star Magnas & 2 x Star Victors. If my memory serves me correctly, the Star Supreme's Reg. Nos ranged from R641 to 646. If this one is 641, then it will have been the plug.

 

Thank you for sending me your substantial collection of pics of Star Supreme, which I note still bears the original Broads registration number. R641, was the first in a range of boats which stemmed from this boat. Subsequent boats R642 and so on, were in GRP and then came the Star Explorers, Star Trackers, and then later on when we purchased Moores; Braemores, Glenmores, Strathmores and so on, all based on the same Powles 45' sea going hulls cut down for river use and lower freeboard.

 

Griff