Norfolk Broads Petrol And Diesel Boats To Be Phased Out.

[Vaughan]

That is the title (verbatim) of an article on the EDP website today, which goes on to say that the BA have announced their aim to achieve zero emissions by 2040 and carbon neutrality (whatever that is) 10 years earlier, by 2030.

A classic example of how press sensation can be totally misleading.  It is only later on that the "local democracy reporter" admits that this refers only to the BA's vessels and vehicles, although other craft, especially hire boats, will be encouraged to follow suit.

Exactly how, I wonder?

 

[Hylander]

What do they suggest is the alternative to petrol and diesel - wind up the elastic and let it go!!!      All  this twaddle about electric boat and electric cars, can see an awful lot of breakdowns when it all comes about when dozey forgets to charge the batteries.

[PCL023]

🤔 could boat’s possibly harness the wind somehow to assist with propulsion? 

I think the same it will never catch on, here’s to rowing 🚣‍♀️👍

[LizG]

Put a sail on everything!

The problem is that electricity doesn't grow on trees, far from it...............

[ExSurveyor]

This is an article I was sent recently, even if it is an exaggeration, are we swopping air pollution for land pollution.

This is a CAT994A.

It burns about 1000 liters of fuel in 12 hours, moves about 250 tons of dirt to extract the materials needed to produce ONE Tesla battery.

To manufacture each battery, it is necessary to process:
- 12 tons of brine for the lithium,
- 15 tons of ore for cobalt
- 3 tons of ore for nickel,
- 12 tons of ore for copper
And move 250 tons of the earth's crust.
For just - one - battery, which comprises approximately:

- 12 kg of lithium
- 30 kg of nickel
- 22 kg of manganese
- 15 kg of cobalt
- 100 kg of copper
- 200 kg of aluminium, steel and plastic

And people still believe in "zero emissions" when they drive their electric car...., and we haven't touched on "recycling".

[oldgregg]

I think some of the facts are a little inaccurate, but it's a fair point.

The trouble is that with combustion engines, 70% of the energy in the fuel is thrown away as heat.

Fuel cells powering what is otherwise an electric vehicle are massively more efficient - But producing hydrogen uses lots of energy and there are now only 11 filling stations left in the UK.

Vast amounts of energy are also used in refining oil products.

It's problematic every way :(

[ExSurveyor]

Perhaps the answer is to change to more efficient cars,

I use to drive big cars and 4x4s, I changed from an older 2.5 litre VW 4x4 to a newer 2 litre VW MPV. I  doubled my MPG .

A friend of mine has a Mercedes A class and gets 900 plus miles from a tank.

I wonder if the goals will be changed to allow more efficient  carbon burners when they start to run out of rare earth minerals.

[BrundallNavy]

I no longer plug in my PHEV VW As it’s more economical To drIve on petrol than electric. 

[BroadAmbition]

A friend of mine has a Mercedes A class and gets 900 plus miles from a tank.

I often hear this sort of claim made by many car/van owners and it is totally pointless unless we are told how big the tank is!!

I.E - Put a big enough tank in a vehicle and 1000 miles is easily achievable even if only managing 20mpg - Sheesh

Griff

[Bytheriver]

I think these are the key lines - 

He stressed that there was no intention to 'ban' the use of fossil fuel boats.

The government has pledged to end the sale of petrol and diesel cars by 2030, but similar plans have not yet been set out for boats that use fossil fuels. 

[TheQ]

If BA want zero emission boats then BA are going to have to install more electric posts..

[ExSurveyor]

12 minutes ago, BroadAmbition said:

A friend of mine has a Mercedes A class and gets 900 plus miles from a tank.

I often hear this sort of claim made by many car/van owners and it is totally pointless unless we are told how big the tank is!!

I.E - Put a big enough tank in a vehicle and 1000 miles is easily achievable even if only managing 20mpg - Sheesh

Griff

Good point

 

 

[FlyingFortress]

9 minutes ago, TheQ said:

If BA want zero emission boats then BA are going to have to install more electric posts..

Could they not reverse the current on wind turbines and generate a constant wind so we can all sail 🤪

[rightsaidfred]

Think there must be a shortage of real news in Norfolk.

Fred

[Andrewcook]

I say having all those Batteries they would need charging from the onshore Post there is not enough of them The other point is the Bost would be close to the Water with all these Batteries but they go to find out which one I'm not happy on Electric Cars at this time do cost of getting a New One .

[rightsaidfred]

Its physically impossible to provide enough charging points to electrify every boat for constant cruising.

I wonder how much the EDP advertising revenue has increased from the number of hits this has generated.

Fred

[Meantime]

35 minutes ago, TheQ said:

If BA want zero emission boats then BA are going to have to install more electric posts..

Be careful what you wish for!!! I'm sure they would be happy to oblige, but I dread to think how much they would put the tolls up by!!!!

[Mouldy]

52 minutes ago, ExSurveyor said:

Perhaps the answer is to change to more efficient cars,

I use to drive big cars and 4x4s, I changed from an older 2.5 litre VW 4x4 to a newer 2 litre VW MPV. I  doubled my MPG .

A friend of mine has a Mercedes A class and gets 900 plus miles from a tank.

I wonder if the goals will be changed to allow more efficient  carbon burners when they start to run out of rare earth minerals.

Hmmm.  My wife’s Sportage has the 1.6 high output petrol engine, coupled to a 7 speed dual clutch auto box and 4 wheel drive.  When we bought it, prior to the phasing out of E5 petrol, it was doing 33 - 34mpg.  As soon as we switched to E10, the fuel consumption increased and we were doing 27 -28mpg.

A few months ago, purely as an experiment, I tried super unleaded (E5) and the consumption now is around 36mpg.

Its interesting that the switch to a fuel that is supposed to be better for the environment has caused us an increase in fuel consumption and co-incidentally, more money to the exchequer by way of increased taxation.  It strikes me that far more needs to be done to convert us all to more environmentally friendly propulsion for our own personal transport needs, as nothing seems to be carbon neutral.

[OldBerkshireBoy]

26 minutes ago, rightsaidfred said:

Think there must be a shortage of real news in Norfolk.

Fred

There is news story that will break very soon only I am not allowed to say!  

[Meantime]

2 minutes ago, OldBerkshireBoy said:

There is news story that will break very soon only I am not allowed to say!  

As they say, every cloud has a silver lining!

[MargeandParge]

43 minutes ago, Meantime said:

Be careful what you wish for!!! I'm sure they would be happy to oblige, but I dread to think how much they would put the tolls up by!!!!

Our thoughts are, it's easy for any authority to achieve there goal if done so at the expense of those that they are supposed to look after. Very easy to install a charger in your own boat house as well.

Regards Marge and Parge 

 

[PCL023]

2 hours ago, oldgregg said:

I think some of the facts are a little inaccurate, but it's a fair point.

The trouble is that with combustion engines, 70% of the energy in the fuel is thrown away as heat.

Fuel cells powering what is otherwise an electric vehicle are massively more efficient - But producing hydrogen uses lots of energy and there are now only 11 filling stations left in the UK.

Vast amounts of energy are also used in refining oil products.

It's problematic every way :(

We all know the answer….Dilithium crystals it’s so obvious 🤔

If there is a shortage of these get hold of a flux capacitor and send everything back to the future 👍. 

Think we will be stuck with Dino go-juice for a while as yet. 

[grendel]

well if the tolls have to pay for the electric charging points, they would need to price everyone off of the water, its just not practical, the energy companies are already coming to terms with not being able to deliver enough capacity to charge electric vehicles, south west london people asking for new capacity are being told it wont be available until after 2030 as thats how long the new substations to supply the power into the area will take to be built. as for the broads, each mooring away from a town or village will cost millions to get a supply to, some tens of millions, costs that cant be recovered from the cost of the electricity supplied,  each fast charging point requires the equivalent capacity of 5 houses,  the current cables cannot supply this if every house is to have a charger (and we are not looking at ultra fast chargers here- just the standard 7kW models.

add to that the longevity of broads boats and engines, and I predict there will still be a large proportion of diesel powered boats in 50 years time (Water Rail is 90 years old, and with some love and care should be good for another 90 at least.

[rightsaidfred]

1 hour ago, TheQ said:

If BA want zero emission boats then BA are going to have to install more electric posts..

Given the remote locations of many moorings both North and South there is a limit to how many more posts they can provide.

Fred

[grendel]

Just now, rightsaidfred said:

Given the remote locations of many moorings both North and South there is a limit to how many more posts they can provide.

Fred

that should read that they can economically provide, spend enough money and you can get electricity anywhere.