Lockdown - Further Clarification

[Maxwellian]

Do all chief executives of major companies have sight of everything released?? Answer is no, same probably for medium sized ones too and many smaller ones. They put process in place and delegate.

[JennyMorgan]

38 minutes ago, Maxwellian said:

Do all chief executives of major companies have sight of everything released?? Answer is no, same probably for medium sized ones too and many smaller ones. They put process in place and delegate.

 At one time, if not now, very little, if anything, was ever passed into the public sector without at least a final nod of approval. We are not talking companies.

[Vaughan]

1 hour ago, BroadsAuthority said:

One final comment, the 'executive' has had absolutely no involvement with the planning or production of this article or the Nature in Lockdown social media campaign.

Thank you for that Tom and I also notice your being there, on a Sunday afternoon, to respond to our comments! Thanks also for that!

Please note also that my comments today are not aimed at the BA directly but at other agencies and powerful charities which may see their own agendas come to the fore, if the BA should let their guard down for a moment and let them in "through the back door"!

[BroadsAuthority]

58 minutes ago, Maxwellian said:

Do all chief executives of major companies have sight of everything released?? Answer is no, same probably for medium sized ones too and many smaller ones. They put process in place and delegate.

Maxwellian is correct. We have delegated responsibility to do our jobs but will of course receive input from others where required. I can’t think of any local authorities who would require upper management or the CEO to approve everything that goes out in said authorities name.

There’s a lot of cross-team working at the Authority and if I need to provide someone with some information (e.g an update on a specific element of some dredging works), I will easily be able to get it from one of my colleagues in the ops team and relay it to whoever has asked.

On the other hand, if we had to get executive management sign off for all of the hundreds of proactive and reactive posts, tweets and public email responses that we make each week we wouldn’t get much done! John and our directors are very busy dealing with higher level issues and managing their own teams.

Things are of course different with particularly sensitive topics, e.g if we are putting a statement out on tolls, funding, governance (etc.) and this will have input and approval from management where required.

Hope that helps 

Tom

[HEM]

On 18/04/2020 at 15:59, floydraser said:

Also, the media have a lot to answer for as regards confusion of information. They all seem to be trying to earn Journalist of the Year for stirring up the biggest controversy.

Yep - over 'ere they were first clamouring for "more restrictions" & when they came after 2 days started running around finding anyone (usually not in authority) ready to pontificate (good word that) on how to open up again.

The media (& many others) seem not to have cottoned-on to the fact that we are dealing with a contageous virus and not some flash flood thats gone after a couple of days.

[woodwose]

Earlier today, The Sunday Times published an article saying that the Schools would open in early May.

Then Gove came out and said it wasn't true.

This left me with the dilemma of whom to believe.

Personally, I am going for neither.

[BroadAmbition]

I'd like to know just how the Sunday Times would know before the government or at least the Education secretary

Griff

[rightsaidfred]

8 minutes ago, BroadAmbition said:

I'd like to know just how the Sunday Times would know before the government or at least the Education secretary

Griff

Since when have the facts been more important than a good story.

Fred

[ZimbiIV]

Having read this thread going round the mulberry bush and getting more and more frustrated by individual dogma.

I have decided to reply.

Never mind your own petty rights to play with the expensive toys that we own.

Pity those that live in high rise council blocks with probably multi-kids and NO where to get away for peace and solitude.

Life for most will return to some form of normality, for some the future is in doubt, for some there is no future.

Remember we who argue about not being able to do what many would thing of as a luxury are lucky and should not think of it as a right.

The dogma of the day is stay at home

FULL STOP

paul

[Poppy]

2 hours ago, woodwose said:

Earlier today, The Sunday Times published an article saying that the Schools would open in early May.

Then Gove came out and said it wasn't true.

This left me with the dilemma of whom to believe.

Personally, I am going for neither.

My daughter is an assistant head teacher in a primary school in East london. The are making plans for a 'phased' return at the beginning of June, with the most needing ( those needing most educational support/input) coming back first.  Meanwhike, a neighbour who works in armin at the local Secondary expects to be off until September. 

Make of that what you will.

[Meantime]

1 hour ago, ZimbiIV said:

Having read this thread going round the mulberry bush and getting more and more frustrated by individual dogma.

I have decided to reply.

Never mind your own petty rights to play with the expensive toys that we own.

Pity those that live in high rise council blocks with probably multi-kids and NO where to get away for peace and solitude.

Life for most will return to some form of normality, for some the future is in doubt, for some there is no future.

Remember we who argue about not being able to do what many would thing of as a luxury are lucky and should not think of it as a right.

The dogma of the day is stay at home

FULL STOP

paul

Paul, With all due respect if you have truly read all this thread then you have totally missed the point. I don't think there is anyone on here advocating not staying at home, and yes everyone has got the message to stay at home. This thread is largely about the mixed messages coming from organisations other than the government and mission creep from other organisations.

I haven't visited The Broads since before the lockdown started, and have no intention of visiting The Broads until the Government announces that the restrictions have been eased or lifted. However I do resent being told to stay away by an authority with no authority in the matter and to be honest being told to stay at home by anyone attempting to stand on the moral high ground. I don't believe anyone on this thread has insisted they have a right to use their boat. I'm sure a good many are missing not using their boat and I'm sure those lucky enough to own a boat, already know how lucky they are, but remember the BA message to stay away doesn't just apply to boat owners. Even the ones who you seem to think are trying to exercise their own petty right to play with their expensive toys, even if you appear to be the only one to have brought that up so far. 

[grendel]

To be fair there are a lot of Authorities, councils, Agencies and other organisations who have all been put into the same spot as the BA which is to promote the stay at home message from the government, i dont think the BA is the only one put into that position of trying to implement actions they have no authority to implement, yet it is the governments wish that this be so.

That so many of those organisations have different interpretations is not surprising considering that each has to interpret they to relate to their specific roles, sure this means some may well be over zealous and exceed their authority, sure this means mixed messages are going out, thats just normal for such an unprecedented situation.

I am certain some will try and turn it to their advantage, just as I am sure there are those out there that will try and use any perceived loopholes they can to their own advantage - that too is a natural consequence of such emergency legislation, it will be full of loopholes.

I just hope that after all this is over those people and organisations that have tried to turn things to their advantage will be investigated and if necessary brought to book over their actions.

Meanwhile, the rest of us should concentrate on trying to do the right thing, by following the spirit of the government guidelines, by staying at home and avoiding unnecessary travel.

during this we will have plenty of time to amass the data of the actions we see / perceive ready to report it so anyone or any organisation that took advantage can be brought to book. if that is to be successful will will need the evidence. 

[Vaughan]

To add to that good analysis I think it goes back to my point that there is not enough clear legislation from government, hence far too many loopholes. We need to be told what to do at the moment, but all we have are "guidelines".

[grendel]

Vaughan, that is probably down to the years it normally takes for legislation to be put through, those years are used to get the wording clear and unambiguous, and to find those loopholes and plug them. any new legislation rushed through in days will be full of ambiguities and loopholes. as we have indeed seen.

[rightsaidfred]

We have been told what to do.

Only leave the home for

Essential shopping,

Essential work if it cannot be done from home.

Medical Reasons.

Exercise done in your own locality.

The only exceptions to that are to provide child care for key workers.

Any confusion that surrounds that is being generated by the media continually bombarding ministers etc with questions to which there are no answers until they elicit some slip of the tongue that can be manipulated to suit the story they want, you can add to that a lot of local authorities understandably trying to make their own operations as simple to maintain as possible, the only people looking to use that muddying of the water are those who`s only interest is in them selves and their own life the vast majority are having no problem complying.

That is why I and so many people are exasperated and loosing all faith in the media and should only take note of the official government announcements each day, they may not get everything right no one can but theirs is the most reliable information we have and all we need to take note of.

Fred 

[Poppy]

1 hour ago, Vaughan said:

To add to that good analysis I think it goes back to my point that there is not enough clear legislation from government, hence far too many loopholes. We need to be told what to do at the moment, but all we have are "guidelines".

The 'Regulations'  as published were as clear as mud, and as witnessed by the different interpretations by police in various parts of the country were applied often in ways that were never the intention . For example the stupidity of some local officials and Police who declared Easter Eggs as 'non essential'  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52090441

Clarification of the 'guidelines' was needed - and when it was provided we have the spectacle of battalions off 'keyboard warriors' across the varied branches of social media declaring that everybody  should adhere to their interpretations. This in turn led to clearer statements and so it goes on.

[Meantime]

Fred, I largely agree with what you have said above, but herein lies the problem, what you have posted above is just a snippet of the government advice, or the bits that you have selected. For instance you can leave home to provide support to vulnerable people if you meet the relevant criteria for doing so. Probably why as you say it is better to look to Government sources for information.

I agree about people being exasperated and loosing all faith in the media, and in much the same way I'm getting exasperated by some of the responses on here. One post in particular last night caused me to go back and reread every single post on this thread again this morning and I'm still confused by some of the statements made. The use of some of the terms in the post last night was extremely misleading, if only for the fact that they were the first person to make the statements, which they claimed to be so frustrated by.

For the sake of clarity, and having reread all the posts again, not one person said they had a right to come and use their boat. Not one person said it was their intention to come and use their boat. Only one person was querying and it was a valid query, why they couldn't use their exercise period to polish their boat a short distance from their home and even then they did not state that they intended to.

[rightsaidfred]

ECIPA I think we are pretty much on the same wavelength, I have rightly or wrongly included vulnerable people within the medical reasons category perhaps I should have been more explicit.

Fred

[BroadAmbition]

Vaughan - We need to be told what to do at the moment, but all we have are "guidelines".

I understand what you say, However:-

Are not the guidelines sufficient?  As a population, the vast majority who have more than one brain cell to call upon, can't we just simply follow guidelines?  Do we really need to all be told individually in bold type writing what we need to 'Do' ?

If we all simply followed those guidelines and instructions as our government calls them then there would be no loopholes or grey areas, the vast majority of which have been caused by the Media.  I know a 'Free' press is a good thing but more often than not they just take it too far time and time again, no doubt trying to justify their own existence.  Take the daily questions they put to ministers, junior school kids would do much better at grown up questions.

Thankfully the majority of the population seem able to follow guidelines and instructions just fine

Griff

[ScrumpyCheddar]

We have online shopping or the wife goes once a week to the village shop... 

I sit out the front of my house in the deck chair talking to my neighbours in there gardens ... A good 6 meters away across the road... well shout over to them ha ha ha having a few drinks can’t beat it putting the worlds to right.. Making the most of the Lockdown... 
 

Cheers everyone 

[Oddfellow]

11 hours ago, EastCoastIPA said:

I haven't visited The Broads since before the lockdown started,

I live in Martham, just a 15 minute walk to the river and I have been to "The Broads" just once since lockdown!

[BroadAmbition]

If I lived 15 mins walk from the river on the Broads (Not jealous - I Keep telling mysen that), then that would be my daily exercise walk each and every day

Griff

[Meantime]

1 minute ago, BroadAmbition said:

If I lived 15 mins walk from the river on the Broads (Not jealous - I Keep telling mysen that), then that would be my daily exercise walk each and every day

Griff

Too bloody right. I'd be wearing the river bank out!

[Oddfellow]

1 minute ago, BroadAmbition said:

If I lived 15 mins walk from the river on the Broads (Not jealous - I Keep telling mysen that), then that would be my daily exercise walk each and every day

Griff

It should be, but my better half is in the At Risk group and I struggle with the morality of my own situation against the greater risk to her. She has been out in the wild just once in a month or more and that was to collect medication having first checked that there was no queue at the pharmacy.  

[marshman]

I got told off for going to the pharmacy - not that I am in the at risk group fortunately! Just because I am over 70 so I should have sent my carer!

Whats one of those???